.:*~*:._.:*~*:._"Mordere" .:*~*:._.:*~*:._
- Thread starter Beat Takeshi
- Start date
Arrik
Well-known member
Thanks iSTy.
Hey I just wanted to note that Justin's work really made the story pop. Seeing it with and without his work I know what kind of impact it really makes. Really happy he was able to collab with us for the film. I know he's a busy man in high demand.
Thanks again, Justin.
Hey I just wanted to note that Justin's work really made the story pop. Seeing it with and without his work I know what kind of impact it really makes. Really happy he was able to collab with us for the film. I know he's a busy man in high demand.
Thanks again, Justin.
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Beat Takeshi
Two-Hip Shakur
Yes, Justin did a great job on the score like always. www.edgen.com
Shawn Philip Nelson
Veteran
Wow! Ah dude, you could have gotten the meat of this down to 6min for compete!
My wife and I really enjoyed this. EXCELLENT acting and direction, very convincing. Quite a twist ending, very satisfying!!
My wife and I really enjoyed this. EXCELLENT acting and direction, very convincing. Quite a twist ending, very satisfying!!
Susanne G.
Well-known member
What a clever story. I enjoyed it so much. It was nearly all perfect. There is only one thing: I admit that the young sister asked her boyfriend to kill her big sister. I didn't really understand why. Obviously the young sister was often angry about the older sister, but this is the reason to let her kill?
Above all - a very well nice work. Thank you for done it.
Susanne
Above all - a very well nice work. Thank you for done it.
Susanne
Matt Sconce
Veteran
SPOILER SPOILER SPOILER highlight to read
The young sister kept asking her older sister to make her a vampire also, but her sister told her to stop asking. The young sister had her boyfrined shoot her so her older sister would be confronted with the choice to let her die, or make her a vampire as well. Am I right?:cheesy:
Susanne G.
Well-known member
Thank you Matt for the explanation. I am think you are right. I watched again with Jason together the film and he translated every frase for me.
SPOILER BELOW
I think that there is only one situation where it is really clear:
05:03 "Hey, it looks dangerous down there."
05:09 "What the f*ck, are you kidding me. What the hell, do you have to be afraid of? Of all people?"
Only in this moment the audience can understand it. I have to say that this frase I couldn't hear very well - probably, because english isn't my mother language, but this is my problem!
Thanks again.
Susanne
SPOILER BELOW
I think that there is only one situation where it is really clear:
05:03 "Hey, it looks dangerous down there."
05:09 "What the f*ck, are you kidding me. What the hell, do you have to be afraid of? Of all people?"
Only in this moment the audience can understand it. I have to say that this frase I couldn't hear very well - probably, because english isn't my mother language, but this is my problem!
Thanks again.
Susanne
Beat Takeshi
Two-Hip Shakur
Hi guys,
Thanks for the kudos, especially from Shawneous. You are very critical in your critiques and believe it or not, every time I have been a part of other films as DP I always think "I wonder what Shawneous thinks" so to get an EXCELLENT from you means a lot to me. Thanks again.
Yes Matt got it exactly. We were going to put the boyfriend scene after the credits so it was like a double "oh ****" but people felt that the pay off was the last thing that needed to be seen and putting the boyfriend at the end would diminish the impact.
Susanne, thank you. Thank you. I'm really glad you enjoyed it.
There are a couple of hints in there about what the sister wants. The part where she says "what... to take care of me?.....well do it already" and she gets real close to her and kind of stretches her neck but its subtle. The one you mentioned, when the older sister says "you don't know what you are asking of me" and when she calls her a nightmare.
Also all the cursing and the demeanor of the younger sisters character was another hint on why the older sister doesn't want to do it plus the promise to the mother. Well there are actually 2 promises, one to take care of the younger sister and the other was not to do what she had to at the end hence the tag line " To keep a promise, another must be broken"
Thanks for the kudos, especially from Shawneous. You are very critical in your critiques and believe it or not, every time I have been a part of other films as DP I always think "I wonder what Shawneous thinks" so to get an EXCELLENT from you means a lot to me. Thanks again.
Yes Matt got it exactly. We were going to put the boyfriend scene after the credits so it was like a double "oh ****" but people felt that the pay off was the last thing that needed to be seen and putting the boyfriend at the end would diminish the impact.
Susanne, thank you. Thank you. I'm really glad you enjoyed it.
There are a couple of hints in there about what the sister wants. The part where she says "what... to take care of me?.....well do it already" and she gets real close to her and kind of stretches her neck but its subtle. The one you mentioned, when the older sister says "you don't know what you are asking of me" and when she calls her a nightmare.
Also all the cursing and the demeanor of the younger sisters character was another hint on why the older sister doesn't want to do it plus the promise to the mother. Well there are actually 2 promises, one to take care of the younger sister and the other was not to do what she had to at the end hence the tag line " To keep a promise, another must be broken"
justin ewart
Well-known member
Good credits, well chosen soundtrack, and I really liked the intro scene. It was great natural feeling dialogue and really pulled me in, in a light hearted way which was a good call for an otherwise very dramatic piece. Great lighting and camera work, the coloring was gorgeous and I think you had good actors working with some unnatural dialogue in parts...
Admittedly, when I first tried to watch this I turned it off before the ending. I liked it so much more when I read through this thread and "got" what the story was really leading up to which is a pretty cool concept... Without the Vampire angle it's kind of one dimensional story telling, but with that clear it takes on a while other depth and becomes much stronger as an overall piece. I think the foreshadowing needed to be stronger, the little details telling us there was a dark supernatural angle to all of this, not just a couple of unlikeable sisters bitching at each other on the streets at night which become somewhat tedious and that's why I turned it off the first time. I think it drags melodramatically after the little sister is shot and I figured that was it. I needed more to make me stick it out and I'm glad I came back to it and finished it because there is a lot to like about this.
Visually stunning. Really loved the look. I have a lot of respect for what you attempted here and I think with some tightening up in editing, ie. losing some of the awkward dialogue, you could strengthen the overall piece. But I can see as a director you are very strong and I am genuinely interested to see more of your work!
Admittedly, when I first tried to watch this I turned it off before the ending. I liked it so much more when I read through this thread and "got" what the story was really leading up to which is a pretty cool concept... Without the Vampire angle it's kind of one dimensional story telling, but with that clear it takes on a while other depth and becomes much stronger as an overall piece. I think the foreshadowing needed to be stronger, the little details telling us there was a dark supernatural angle to all of this, not just a couple of unlikeable sisters bitching at each other on the streets at night which become somewhat tedious and that's why I turned it off the first time. I think it drags melodramatically after the little sister is shot and I figured that was it. I needed more to make me stick it out and I'm glad I came back to it and finished it because there is a lot to like about this.
Visually stunning. Really loved the look. I have a lot of respect for what you attempted here and I think with some tightening up in editing, ie. losing some of the awkward dialogue, you could strengthen the overall piece. But I can see as a director you are very strong and I am genuinely interested to see more of your work!
So I liked the cholos in the begining were cool. I think it was a waste of time. I'm a huge fan of the end of one adventure leading into another. So they did their job of setting the tone and then they hung out too long talking about pussy. I didn't really understand the warm tones, I think it should have been a bit more neutral color wise.
I really hate the transition. You break the 180 line when they pull up into her over the shoulder, and its very jarring. It takes you out of the picture right off the bat.
Then we have this nice hallmark moment with continued warm colors. You verbally set her up as a pretty white girl who is out of place, and then reading a nice book in the middle of the ghetto in the middle of the night. Cute couple pictures... no signs... no indication of her being a street rat.
Then the sister shows up. We''re still warm and then they start fighting. I really don't like the actual dialogue here and the whole, ****ity ****ity **** **** thing while we have this older sister moment trying to be something of a family... just a juxtaposition of images and framing and sound that dont make any sense what so ever.
Then they get to the scary part. Why is the (future) vampire scared? Why do you change the color correction to these cool tones when they finally stop fighting and start bonding? Maybe you were going for another weird paradox, but thats not how an audience works. You want the twist ending.. you need this to be warm... the fighting to be cool.
The shot was completely unmotivated... he ran off then stopped in the shadows and then shot. Sloppy directing there, he's obviously a decent enough actor to pull off what the actual moment was. What we got was an afterthought. A cliche.
The good stuff had everything to do with the control of the camera, and light. Had amazing pictures, amazing night for night with a video camera. Very good art direction.
I think what this piece suffers from the most is a very inexperienced director who shirked all the important aspects of pre-production. There are just too many scenes where the focus was on making this scene or that scene really pretty to look at. Rather than what am I showing in this frame and how does an audience respond to what I am showing. Where do I want to take them. There are techniques for this just by where you put the characters. No attention was paid to shooting for the edit. A lot of the performances were shot in the moment, and probably looked great live. But they don't string well together. Alot of things were done for the sake of that's a cool idea... i.e. the ****ity **** fight scene.... I would definately re-evaluate what parts serve the story and which parts are just to look pretty or sound cool.
Now, I've only been really critical because you have the potential to be quite great.
One of the first books I would recommend your director read is this one-
http://shop.mwp.com/products/cinematic-storytelling
This will fill in the why you put things where in frame.
The next book I would recommend would be-
http://shop.mwp.com/products/first-time-director
The guy who wrote this is a professor at Chapman, a top 5 filmschool, and he covers a tremedous amount of directing skills and theory.
Again, this could be great, and thats the only reason I've been so merciless. If you want pretty good for a student film, or amateur indie, you got it in spades and it looks beautiful to boot.
I really hate the transition. You break the 180 line when they pull up into her over the shoulder, and its very jarring. It takes you out of the picture right off the bat.
Then we have this nice hallmark moment with continued warm colors. You verbally set her up as a pretty white girl who is out of place, and then reading a nice book in the middle of the ghetto in the middle of the night. Cute couple pictures... no signs... no indication of her being a street rat.
Then the sister shows up. We''re still warm and then they start fighting. I really don't like the actual dialogue here and the whole, ****ity ****ity **** **** thing while we have this older sister moment trying to be something of a family... just a juxtaposition of images and framing and sound that dont make any sense what so ever.
Then they get to the scary part. Why is the (future) vampire scared? Why do you change the color correction to these cool tones when they finally stop fighting and start bonding? Maybe you were going for another weird paradox, but thats not how an audience works. You want the twist ending.. you need this to be warm... the fighting to be cool.
The shot was completely unmotivated... he ran off then stopped in the shadows and then shot. Sloppy directing there, he's obviously a decent enough actor to pull off what the actual moment was. What we got was an afterthought. A cliche.
The good stuff had everything to do with the control of the camera, and light. Had amazing pictures, amazing night for night with a video camera. Very good art direction.
I think what this piece suffers from the most is a very inexperienced director who shirked all the important aspects of pre-production. There are just too many scenes where the focus was on making this scene or that scene really pretty to look at. Rather than what am I showing in this frame and how does an audience respond to what I am showing. Where do I want to take them. There are techniques for this just by where you put the characters. No attention was paid to shooting for the edit. A lot of the performances were shot in the moment, and probably looked great live. But they don't string well together. Alot of things were done for the sake of that's a cool idea... i.e. the ****ity **** fight scene.... I would definately re-evaluate what parts serve the story and which parts are just to look pretty or sound cool.
Now, I've only been really critical because you have the potential to be quite great.
One of the first books I would recommend your director read is this one-
http://shop.mwp.com/products/cinematic-storytelling
This will fill in the why you put things where in frame.
The next book I would recommend would be-
http://shop.mwp.com/products/first-time-director
The guy who wrote this is a professor at Chapman, a top 5 filmschool, and he covers a tremedous amount of directing skills and theory.
Again, this could be great, and thats the only reason I've been so merciless. If you want pretty good for a student film, or amateur indie, you got it in spades and it looks beautiful to boot.
Beat Takeshi
Two-Hip Shakur
Thanks for watching. I read what you said and then watched again but I still stand behind what we did. The color transition reflects this is where the younger sisters plan is taken effect and theres no turning back in a number of ways and a sense of dread sets in. All the fighting between the sisters reflects a lot of fights I have heard between sisters IE the fookity fook scene. What better way to get under someones skin than to exaggerate what they just complained about. I have done it myself and have seen it done and its very effective in provoking someone to react. It had nothing to do with being cool or being a cool scene or idea. In fact, a lot of the dialog was pulled from real life situations. We stayed away from being cool with this story and making it some glorified action flick with cool leather suits and special powers which really would be cliche. This is a simple story between to sisters and one happens to be something else.
We did have to scramble when our original location fell through and had to make where we shot seem like it was all the same place and change some of the dialog to match but I think we did ok for faking angles and stuff.
I don't get the 180 thing when the pulling back to the girl because there is no line established yet in that shot. We go from a first person shot which now we can go to either side on the next shot. We do swing around her to reveal the sisters feet but it doesn't bother me at all.
The shadow shooting, I don't get what you mean unmotivated. He gets scared that she recognizes him, starts to freak, but then remembers what hes there to do and takes the shot. Hes not a thug, just some poor dude dragged into this. So I feel this is what would happen. What do you think should happen?
I definitely want to hear from more people if things rub them the wrong way though. Since we have not gotten that many reviews like yours, its hard to judge if what you say rings true to others which helps us grow as film makers.
As for the books, I'm not sure I want to learn techniques that everyone else may be using. I thought being different was a good thing.
I don't mind being an amateur indie at this point. Its been 2 years since I did my own film so at least I'm not a scrub.
We did have to scramble when our original location fell through and had to make where we shot seem like it was all the same place and change some of the dialog to match but I think we did ok for faking angles and stuff.
I don't get the 180 thing when the pulling back to the girl because there is no line established yet in that shot. We go from a first person shot which now we can go to either side on the next shot. We do swing around her to reveal the sisters feet but it doesn't bother me at all.
The shadow shooting, I don't get what you mean unmotivated. He gets scared that she recognizes him, starts to freak, but then remembers what hes there to do and takes the shot. Hes not a thug, just some poor dude dragged into this. So I feel this is what would happen. What do you think should happen?
I definitely want to hear from more people if things rub them the wrong way though. Since we have not gotten that many reviews like yours, its hard to judge if what you say rings true to others which helps us grow as film makers.
As for the books, I'm not sure I want to learn techniques that everyone else may be using. I thought being different was a good thing.
I don't mind being an amateur indie at this point. Its been 2 years since I did my own film so at least I'm not a scrub.
Well a couple of things-
First you can't really justify bad dialogue with realism when you're telling a [removed] story. You aren't being realistic cuz theres no such thing as [removed]. When I offer you a criticism that says this part of the dialogue is bad- I'm really saying that you're showing me something that reminds me I'm watching a movie rather than experiencing a story.
You can represent the conflict in a way that keeps me (the audience) in the moment and the fiction of the story.
As far as the transition from the first scene to the second- we're in the back seat of the car with the two guys. Then in a split second we're behind the girl. The audience has to think- Where am I? Why am I here? Am I standing behind her because I'm a POV shot of someone about to get her?
Good movies make you feel- not think.
The fact that you have to explain and defend the piece and your choices means you're not doing a good job of telling the story visually. You've chosen things because you think it looks good. But when you show an audience- they are reacting to what your showing based on how we work as humans. So you show me conflict during a warm and fuzzily lit scene- and I'm confused. I thinking why are we fighting when it's so safe and pleasant?
There are rules to visual storytelling. Some you've stumbled on instinctively from watching movies. You have to master the rules before you can break them.
The shooting doesnt work because you havent given us enough information to know that he as a character is making a decision to finish what he started. So to us who don't know he's the boyfriend it's just a guy who chickens out because he was recognized and then shoots for no reason. Now we're going who is that guy? and... we're out of the moment until it's explained in the car. Even then it's pretty sketchy of a connection because we only saw a picture of him earlier.
What should happen? He should be revealed by the older sister. It should be the payoff to an earlier setup. We should suspect that the younger sister is up to something. Right now it's just a couple of sisters fighting with odd pacing and confusing visual language... then we get a flash of her face making a sinister smile. Then that performance. So... you've shown us a payoff without a set up. Set it up. Cut the fookity fook crap and use that time to set up a payoff thats critical to the plot.
Specifically I would add a scene where he tries to steal himself up to do it in the car. Needs a bit of misdirection for the big payoff but thats the creative part of it. Now we the audience is clued in.. they are up to something... instea of saying who is the person she recognizes... but she doesnt figure it out. And wait he's shooting anyway? wtf? whats the point? Is he gonna rob them? We just go hey the little sister is hit... she's dying. (plant the seed of the bullets went through the big sister) and then you get a better payoff in the end. Less distraction for your audience. etc.
What you did was pretty. You got a great ending. I could say- good work and move on like everyone else. I just think you got something in your production that could be something worth watching on television or in a good festival.
First you can't really justify bad dialogue with realism when you're telling a [removed] story. You aren't being realistic cuz theres no such thing as [removed]. When I offer you a criticism that says this part of the dialogue is bad- I'm really saying that you're showing me something that reminds me I'm watching a movie rather than experiencing a story.
You can represent the conflict in a way that keeps me (the audience) in the moment and the fiction of the story.
As far as the transition from the first scene to the second- we're in the back seat of the car with the two guys. Then in a split second we're behind the girl. The audience has to think- Where am I? Why am I here? Am I standing behind her because I'm a POV shot of someone about to get her?
Good movies make you feel- not think.
The fact that you have to explain and defend the piece and your choices means you're not doing a good job of telling the story visually. You've chosen things because you think it looks good. But when you show an audience- they are reacting to what your showing based on how we work as humans. So you show me conflict during a warm and fuzzily lit scene- and I'm confused. I thinking why are we fighting when it's so safe and pleasant?
There are rules to visual storytelling. Some you've stumbled on instinctively from watching movies. You have to master the rules before you can break them.
The shooting doesnt work because you havent given us enough information to know that he as a character is making a decision to finish what he started. So to us who don't know he's the boyfriend it's just a guy who chickens out because he was recognized and then shoots for no reason. Now we're going who is that guy? and... we're out of the moment until it's explained in the car. Even then it's pretty sketchy of a connection because we only saw a picture of him earlier.
What should happen? He should be revealed by the older sister. It should be the payoff to an earlier setup. We should suspect that the younger sister is up to something. Right now it's just a couple of sisters fighting with odd pacing and confusing visual language... then we get a flash of her face making a sinister smile. Then that performance. So... you've shown us a payoff without a set up. Set it up. Cut the fookity fook crap and use that time to set up a payoff thats critical to the plot.
Specifically I would add a scene where he tries to steal himself up to do it in the car. Needs a bit of misdirection for the big payoff but thats the creative part of it. Now we the audience is clued in.. they are up to something... instea of saying who is the person she recognizes... but she doesnt figure it out. And wait he's shooting anyway? wtf? whats the point? Is he gonna rob them? We just go hey the little sister is hit... she's dying. (plant the seed of the bullets went through the big sister) and then you get a better payoff in the end. Less distraction for your audience. etc.
What you did was pretty. You got a great ending. I could say- good work and move on like everyone else. I just think you got something in your production that could be something worth watching on television or in a good festival.
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Arrik
Well-known member
WOW Chuk,
Thanks for the very detailed review. Appreciate the time you spent posting. I never thought about the warm tone in the beginning visually cueing the audience to think of Rachel as the "cute little white girl in a bad part of town reading her book." I guess I can see how you can be thrown with her first line being so abrasive.
Switching to the desaturation was mainly to help indicate that there was something more unnatural about this story, and its not just about two girls fighting (over something that the audience, at the time, has no idea about). This coupled with the music and the walk through the amusement park, was aimed for the audience to think somethings up. Justin Durban did a great job scoring to the color change. I don't think that it needs to be so warm in the beginning though. If you know Aram like many on this board do, you'll know that he loooooOOoooves the warmth. Bosindy, in an earlier post, said he'd rather see the whole piece all in desat, and I would like to see how that plays out as well.
One of the big things for us was we absolutely wanted to have some cues for the audience so that way they dont feel robbed with the bite, and it is instead a payoff. Same with the boyfriend. I guess for your viewing experience, we werent successful. The earlier setup was supposed to be the CU of the picture of rachel & her boyfriend + the younger sister's glance down the street BEFORE the thug actually comes in + the sinister look you mentioned were all supposed to clue you in without hitting you over the head. Some other views have mentioned this made them think the younger sister was planning to have her older sister shot. I agree it makes it a more "what the poo poo just happened and why?" kinda moment. Do you find that the instances that make you question what is going help make the payoff at the end greater? Or do you think we should make it more clear?
Hmmm.... we never looked at it as the payoff should be the stick up / shooting. Think we should have? I think it's better if you're still somewhat in the dark at that moment. The payoff being in the car also helps prep the audience for Barry's performance, imo.
As far as the car and 180 line. Trust me, aint gonna fight you on those shots. Nothing to be proud of there. Not enuff shots/angles to work with for my comfort. If we had MS shots of both the passenger and rach. We could have had moved in a more segmented fashion as opposed to Far POV to OTS or not use the OTS at all. Hindsight's a *****, huh? However, I don't think we broke the line. We were in a POV of Rachel and cut to her OTS. Not the prettiest edit I know, but I think were safe. Now if you mean from when she dropped the photo and we cut to the OTS of her picking it up, I guess that may be a prob. But you seem to have a problem with the POV-OTS. Don't matter, if it took you out of things, that's what it did, regardless of the 180.
I know you said you were only being harsh because you saw potential in this piece. I still think there would have been a more tasteful way to say some of this stuff. All of this is completely speculative (and I dont think you'll dispute that considering you started with "I think"). It was indeed shot for the edit. It was blocked with the actors especially the handheld shots and dying scenes, then final storyboards drawn, shot list made. This ensured Aram and I were on the same page regarding the vision. Ofcourse, some things changed on location, they always do right? I guess if it fell short for you, it fell short in our collaboration. I admit, I tried to make it look cool.
The above quote is just about the only thing i'd refute from you. You have a solid explanation for all your other points and I think some of them have merit. Please dont feel like were double teamin' you. I just wanted to respond to some of your critiques as DP of the film.
Thanks man.
***EDIT***
Hahahahaha Aram, I'm sorry man. I cant help it. I'm even more flattered by this compliment cuz Chuk was such a jerk to you. HAHAHA, Is that so wrong???!!! (Chuk, i'm just kiddin' man. All fun). Seriously, too kind.
Thanks for the very detailed review. Appreciate the time you spent posting. I never thought about the warm tone in the beginning visually cueing the audience to think of Rachel as the "cute little white girl in a bad part of town reading her book." I guess I can see how you can be thrown with her first line being so abrasive.
Switching to the desaturation was mainly to help indicate that there was something more unnatural about this story, and its not just about two girls fighting (over something that the audience, at the time, has no idea about). This coupled with the music and the walk through the amusement park, was aimed for the audience to think somethings up. Justin Durban did a great job scoring to the color change. I don't think that it needs to be so warm in the beginning though. If you know Aram like many on this board do, you'll know that he loooooOOoooves the warmth. Bosindy, in an earlier post, said he'd rather see the whole piece all in desat, and I would like to see how that plays out as well.
One of the big things for us was we absolutely wanted to have some cues for the audience so that way they dont feel robbed with the bite, and it is instead a payoff. Same with the boyfriend. I guess for your viewing experience, we werent successful. The earlier setup was supposed to be the CU of the picture of rachel & her boyfriend + the younger sister's glance down the street BEFORE the thug actually comes in + the sinister look you mentioned were all supposed to clue you in without hitting you over the head. Some other views have mentioned this made them think the younger sister was planning to have her older sister shot. I agree it makes it a more "what the poo poo just happened and why?" kinda moment. Do you find that the instances that make you question what is going help make the payoff at the end greater? Or do you think we should make it more clear?
That's what we were going for, for you to question it.
The payoff is in the car where he takes off his mask and says "Rach... blah blah blah"
Hmmm.... we never looked at it as the payoff should be the stick up / shooting. Think we should have? I think it's better if you're still somewhat in the dark at that moment. The payoff being in the car also helps prep the audience for Barry's performance, imo.
As far as the car and 180 line. Trust me, aint gonna fight you on those shots. Nothing to be proud of there. Not enuff shots/angles to work with for my comfort. If we had MS shots of both the passenger and rach. We could have had moved in a more segmented fashion as opposed to Far POV to OTS or not use the OTS at all. Hindsight's a *****, huh? However, I don't think we broke the line. We were in a POV of Rachel and cut to her OTS. Not the prettiest edit I know, but I think were safe. Now if you mean from when she dropped the photo and we cut to the OTS of her picking it up, I guess that may be a prob. But you seem to have a problem with the POV-OTS. Don't matter, if it took you out of things, that's what it did, regardless of the 180.
I know you said you were only being harsh because you saw potential in this piece. I still think there would have been a more tasteful way to say some of this stuff. All of this is completely speculative (and I dont think you'll dispute that considering you started with "I think"). It was indeed shot for the edit. It was blocked with the actors especially the handheld shots and dying scenes, then final storyboards drawn, shot list made. This ensured Aram and I were on the same page regarding the vision. Ofcourse, some things changed on location, they always do right? I guess if it fell short for you, it fell short in our collaboration. I admit, I tried to make it look cool.
The above quote is just about the only thing i'd refute from you. You have a solid explanation for all your other points and I think some of them have merit. Please dont feel like were double teamin' you. I just wanted to respond to some of your critiques as DP of the film.
Thanks man.
***EDIT***
Hahahahaha Aram, I'm sorry man. I cant help it. I'm even more flattered by this compliment cuz Chuk was such a jerk to you. HAHAHA, Is that so wrong???!!! (Chuk, i'm just kiddin' man. All fun). Seriously, too kind.
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Arrik
Well-known member
Hey justin,
Thanks for the kind words. I like hearing your experience viewing our film. Aram definitely intends on tightening it up in the edit. The characters are 1-dimensional, I agree. But only at first glance, I agree too. Gotta keep viewers glued til the end. Thanks for sharing.
Susanne,
thanks for your review as well. I laughed a little after your second post. I like Matt's explanation. He's a sharp one that Matt. And that is not a back-handed compliment
Pretty impressive following without english being your mother language. Though, I think if you can understand F@CK you are about halfway there! Thanks for stoppin in.Geoff,
Whatever man. I was only nice to you in L.A. cuz I wanted you to feel obligated to post good things about our film early on in the reviews. Total waste of my time.
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Beat Takeshi
Two-Hip Shakur
First of all thanks for taking the time to watch and review.
Thats the key... to make a movie that makes you feel but I also love movies that make you think and think about them when you leave the theater. Yes I want to make a movie that makes people cry and laugh and get angry but I also don't want to spell out every step of the way for them. At this level I know its going to be a long road to find that balance and learn as I go.
So in that, I will take what you have said and think about it and store it away for next time as part of the learning process in this journey of being a film maker. I'm glad you didn't just say good work and move on cause nothings learned.
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I didn't see Arriks posts before posting this. Its all good. I didn't feel he was being a jerk because you can never tell with text online what people are thinking so I don't put any emotions in it when I read. I agree with some parts and don't with others but thats the great thing about art, never can satisfy everyone which makes it so great. If we were to make everyone happy we would get board quickly and move on to something else. I hope more critiques come in with true feelings so that kool aid doesn't taste so good
Thats the key... to make a movie that makes you feel but I also love movies that make you think and think about them when you leave the theater. Yes I want to make a movie that makes people cry and laugh and get angry but I also don't want to spell out every step of the way for them. At this level I know its going to be a long road to find that balance and learn as I go.
So in that, I will take what you have said and think about it and store it away for next time as part of the learning process in this journey of being a film maker. I'm glad you didn't just say good work and move on cause nothings learned.
EDIT:
I didn't see Arriks posts before posting this. Its all good. I didn't feel he was being a jerk because you can never tell with text online what people are thinking so I don't put any emotions in it when I read. I agree with some parts and don't with others but thats the great thing about art, never can satisfy everyone which makes it so great. If we were to make everyone happy we would get board quickly and move on to something else. I hope more critiques come in with true feelings so that kool aid doesn't taste so good
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I guess my response would be- why are you directing our (the audience) attention offscreen? In moviemaking the biggest thing on screen is the most important. With what you've done you have us wondering who that was and more specifically why he shot her anyway? was it for the money? isn't that what they were fighting about? when you are showing us the little sister with a horrible gut wound.
I think the picture is a good start, but all to subtle and too far away from the climax. Had I not been taken out of the movie a couple of time with the fookity fook fook fok fight, I might have been able to piece it together, but with this edit, the bits are too far apart for the audience.
So I would either add something just as subtle to remind us. Like dropping the book, and showing us the picture again.
By making the shooting the payoff you misdirect the audience's attention from your twist ending. Which I think we can all agree is definitely strong. It enhances your reaction to mother forgive me line. Frankly I'd rather be wondering why the older sister didn't get hurt when the little sister was standing behind her. That's where your story is. Directing my attention away from that to- Who was the guy? is distracting.
I was sitting in Camera Techniques class when I wrote this. While I meant to be contrastingly sharp specifically with Aram, I did not mean to be a complete prick. So I apologize if I was overly harsh. I was just watching it without sound for the review, and my eyes were going to all the wrong places on the screen during the dialog and that made the editing stand out and took me out of the moment.
Frankly I think this is good enough for a reel piece for both of you, but you could realy turn it into a calling card piece, i.e. something that can get you work and $$ for your efforts with some thought given to composition and if more focus were given to leading the audience through the story rather than rationalizing and justifying elements in a script you like.
I see metric tons of potential in you guys. This isn't being reviewed on a internet forum for amateur short film level- it's being reviewed on a give these guys a job at Sci-FI channel doing this for real money level.
Shooting in low key light at night on location and making it look that good. It's quite an accomplishment.
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Beat Takeshi
Two-Hip Shakur
I think there is enough time from when he shoots to the actual reveal to think about all those questions. It does hang on her watching him run away for a while to draw it out.
She was supposed to have a hole in one of the arms of the jacket she had on but she didn't want to make one in it. There was a line as she turns back and sticks her finger through the hole saying "and get better aim next time". Since she didn't want that we decided to make him stager off to the side to show he sidestepped away from the older sister.
We didn't think we needed to remind again since there are only 5 people in the movie and hes the only white dude.
The pay off to me was when the sister gets what she wants since the whole argument is about her not getting what she wants.
She was supposed to have a hole in one of the arms of the jacket she had on but she didn't want to make one in it. There was a line as she turns back and sticks her finger through the hole saying "and get better aim next time". Since she didn't want that we decided to make him stager off to the side to show he sidestepped away from the older sister.
We didn't think we needed to remind again since there are only 5 people in the movie and hes the only white dude.
The pay off to me was when the sister gets what she wants since the whole argument is about her not getting what she wants.