FS7: 7Q owner with Extention unit to buy or not to buy

So Sony FS7 + solution = $8,000 + $11,900 = $20,000

Sony FS7 + Odyssey 7Q+ = $8000 + $6695 = $14,965

I agree that the 7Q+ solution is probably the way to go, but I also have to say that if you are really looking at the $15k to $20k PLUS category (I say plus because you're going to need batteries, and even with the pure Sony FS7 solution still likely going to want external 7" monitor, and possibly even other accessories) then I would really say that the F5 should not be dismissed. Especially as Ned has pointed out if (compressed) RAW is going to be important to you.

I'm not saying that there isn't a huge difference between $14,965 and $20,000 dollars - of course there is and because of that spread it does make the 7Q+ much more attractive - BUT the F5 is the FS7 plus a whole lot more for "relatively" not much more money once you're getting into this range.

There are pretty good kit deals on the F5 probably even with 0% financing from Sony and if you want to save 15-30% you can go for a used one. Just look at this one for sale currently on the Sony F5/F55 forums:

1-SONY PMW-F5 Camera body
1- SODVFL350 DVF-L350 LCD Viewfinder
1- Sony SOBCL90 BC-L90 Battery Charging Station
3- Sony SOBPFL75 BP-FL75 Olivine V Mount Battery
1-Sony SOSBP64B 64GB SxS PRO+ Memory Card
1-Sony SOSBACUS10 SBAC-US10 SxS Memory Card USB Reader/Writer for ExpressCard/34
1-Ruggard RUMCHS2B Memory Card Case for Up to 2 SxS Cards
1-Porta Brace PORSPMWF55 RS-PMWF55 Rain Slicker for Sony PMW-F5 / F55 Cinema Camera
1-Sony SOLCF55CZ LCF55CZ Hard Case for PMW-F5 & PMW-F55 Cameras and Accessories
1- MOVCAM SHULDER KIT -http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/962998-REG/movcam_mov_f55_sk2_shoulder_kit_2_for.html
1- DOVETAIL -http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/962986-REG/movcam_mov_303_1706b_10_lightweight_support_dovetai...

Total retail value :$ 26,000
SALE Price :$18,000 USD

There's no 240fps RAW unless you add the $5k AXS-R5 but there won't be with the CD solution either (comprised RAW) and the complete FS7 + HXR + AXS solution just isn't ergonomically that friendly.

I don't want to turn this into a F5 vs FS7 thread so I won't list the "differences" between the two cams but I just feel its worth noting if you're spending $15-20k you're in the ball park of a new/used F5 and heck possibly even used F55… not to mention a used F65.
 
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Starcentral has a great point above, and I would counter with advice at the other end of the spectrum - if you think the FS7 internal or FS7+ProRes1080p fit 90%+ of your workload, consider only renting a raw recorder on a shoot by shoot basis. If you're in a large market you may be able to do so from another owner operator, but even the rental houses have to stay competitive. The benefit of the FS7 is in it's modularity - the fact that you don't have to buy everything to have access to everything for the instances where you need it.
 
There are many, many ways to skin the cat here. An F5 at $20K offers a lot, but not the same. In the end it is important to look at all the features and functions and decide what matters more to you.Do you want/need RAW? ProRes in 4K? Handheld form factor? Variable frame rates? There are many other parts to the puzzle, and this is why Sony makes different models.
 
starcentral said:
… but I just feel its worth noting if you're spending $15-20k you're in the ball park of a new/used F5 and heck possibly even used F55… not to mention a used F65.
Click to expand...

I was trying to be a bit funny with the F65 reference, but well shiver me timbers :huh:

F65 - $22k : http://www.ebay.com/itm/Sony-PMW-F6..._Video_Cameras&hash=item3f44794ffe&rmvSB=true

It could just be me but I'd honestly find it hard not to consider an F5, F55, F65 over a "new" FS7 fully kitted package.
 
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Well, I'm considering an FS7 rig because of options/ solutions that are simply too hard or impossible to do with other cameras without a lot of custom machining. Of unique interest to me are:
1. 7Q RAW cDNG format. I've got a new post workstation and I'm Adobe CC, so the cDNG workflow is getting better to the point we don't need to transcode to edit. Debayering is still a pain, but the data rates are do-able.
2. Metabones Speedbooster Ultra. There is something undeniable about full frame optics and field of view. You could go Canon or Schneider FF cine glass. For myself I want to assemble an older Nikon AIS lens set for cine. I really like the look of older Nikon glass with digital. FF field of view, boost in light sensitivity- what's not to like about that?
3. Solid Camera supported PL mount. For the PL glass I have. and for the Solid Camera PL to E-mount adapter I have left over from an FS700 kit now sold.
4. Internal Prores recording. Eventually.

I never understood or agreed with Sony and Canon's refusal to incorporate Prores and DNxHD codecs in their current cameras from day 1. They always quoted cost reasons, but the BMPCC had it from day 1 no? Arri has it, BM has it. RED STILL doesn't have it. Nor Canon.

The build quality seems better than the FS100/FS700, but honestly I'm not too concerned as the market relevant life span of these bodies are not overly long- not like the days of Arri SRs and BetaSp or DigiBeta cameras.
 
To me the price tag meant I could justify the FS7 and weighting in all aspects to me at least the FS7 is all I need and want. It's a tool which I can take any job I see coming.
 
klk said:
I never understood or agreed with Sony and Canon's refusal to incorporate Prores and DNxHD codecs in their current cameras from day 1. They always quoted cost reasons, but the BMPCC had it from day 1 no? Arri has it, BM has it. RED STILL doesn't have it. Nor Canon.
Click to expand...

The fact is Prores and DNxHD are essentially intellectual property or patented or whatever, and they have to be licensed from the companies that developed and own them. And there's no obligation that the price be the same for every licensee. Furthermore, Sony makes it's own codecs in house. There's a certain amount of pride there, as well as expense to recoup. Whereas, Blackmagic doesn't really make codecs. They license no matter what. So it's kind of tricky. By Sony making ProRes only available with the XDCA back, they not only avoid the hardware cost in the base camera, but also the license cost.
 
Corporate politics I could care less about- though my sentiment is really targeted towards the release of the F55/ F5. What was/is one of the big selling points of the Alexa after all? Direct to edit.

With Sony making Prores an available option at this price point I consider to be a very good thing- it does make the camera more market relevant for owner/ operators.

With regards to the OP's original inquiry- a definite YES to the extension unit.
 
klk said:
Corporate politics I could care less about- though my sentiment is really targeted towards the release of the F55/ F5. What was/is one of the big selling points of the Alexa after all? Direct to edit.

With Sony making Prores an available option at this price point I consider to be a very good thing- it does make the camera more market relevant for owner/ operators.

With regards to the OP's original inquiry- a definite YES to the extension unit.
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Sure. Now let me dig through my pocket change and see if I have $50k for a beat-up high-hours used Alexa package. I'll get back to you when I find it.
 
Honestly,
I bought the FS7 over other cameras as I can use it small
and light in any setup (handheld, shoulder, sticks).

Adding the back means more weight, size amd money.
I like the internal XAVC-I very much - no need for ProRes
for me.
I like the smaller BP-U batteries - the big ones give nearly as
much power as V-Mount batteries and hace D-Tap outs, too.

If you want to use RAW-format or need the additional outputs,
the back is a very welcome addition or if you just want to look your FS7
more grown-up... ;)
 
I bought it to have the options.

Small and one-man-band self contained. OR full raw shooting package. And countless variations in between depending on the requirements of the job.

A Swiss Army Knife approach to camera gear.
 
Ben Scott said:
I bought it to have the options.

Small and one-man-band self contained. OR full raw shooting package. And countless variations in between depending on the requirements of the job.

A Swiss Army Knife approach to camera gear.
Click to expand...

I've said the exact same thing before. Definitely a Swiss Army Knife. Even more so than the FS700+7Q. I feel like FS7 + XDCA + 7Q+ is a killer combination:

FS7 alone: XAVC UHD (right now) up to 60fps. Smaller, lighter, run-n-gun. Heck, can probably throw it on a gimbal easily.

FS7 + 7Q+: 4K ProRes HQ from HDMI. Great monitor. Would be great for on a jib (monitor+record), or on a gimbal/steadicam/etc. Studio/Interview shoots.

FS7 + XDCA: For the clients that want 1080p ProRes. If you have/want V-mount for counterbalance or longer run time. Timecode in. Genlock.

FS7 + XDCA + 7Q(+): Bigger gigs. All the fixin's. 4K ProRes HQ derived from the RAW signal. Or straight-up RAW. Slomo shoots. A bit bigger, a little unwieldy for handheld but nothing unbearable. The old school film dudes carried gear a lot heavier than this.

I just think these pieces offer a lot of flexibility. Lots of people scoff at the XDCA unit "gah, you have to buy something extra for RAW out?"... Yes you do, but imagine if it was packed in! Heavier camera. More expensive. The way I see it, I bought a $10,000 XAVC + 1080p ProRes camera with a V-mount and RAW out. But I have the added feature of being able to strip down to just the body for smaller size and weight.
 
It's a great approach to a camera. I would never have bought it if everything was included from the start. I picked up the FS7 to have a quick light ready to shoot 4K b-camera to our REDs as we do a lot of docu style extreme sport shooting in remote location.
So now it's the REDs mainly for the action and the FS7 to document everything around + it can be used to help capture the action as well.
 
+1. I can invest 8k now and keep using my Atomos Samurai for ProRes. I have internal 4k. If my client base grows, I can buy into extra features. If it doesn't, no biggie - I didn't plunk down $20k or $30k.
 
Ed Waters said:
Didn't realize BP-u batteries are available with d-tap. Have you tested them on the FS-7?

Thanks,

Ed Waters
Click to expand...

Yes. I use the old Swit 8U62 with the d-tap used to power the FS7.
There's still another d-tap out for additional accessories.

But now, there are better solutions out there. The new Swit 8U63-7,
which was a new chip working on the FS7 natively and some other
batteries work to, as there is a new chip around. They all work natively
on the FS7 and have an additional d-tap for whatever you want...
 
Thanks for the info Erik! Im having trouble finding the new version on line. No search brings up the -7 version.
 
Westside A V has the new Swits ready to ship and chargers for them as well, the Sony charger works fine too.

http://www.westsideavstore.com/index.php?p=product&id=99

Compatible with SONY FS7, PMW-EX1, EX1R, EX3, F3, 100, 200, 300 series cameras, no DC cable required.
Replaces Sony BP-U60. Features a D-Tap power jack to power accessories while powering the camera natively using the battery socket,
and a 5V/1A USB socket for mobile devices (cell phone etc.) charging.
•63Wh/4400mah capacity (max output power 50W) •D-tap DC output •4-level LED indicators
•Designed specifically for PMW-100/200/300 Sony cameras •Compatible with Dolgin TC400-EX, TC200-EX and TC40-EX fast 4X and 2X battery chargers
•Compatible with Sony BC-U1/BC-U2 battery chargers •Warranty 1 year

s-8u63-7.jpg

I use these Swits in my FS7 myself.
 
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