2nd Gen GH1 ??

singleframe

singleframe

Well-known member
realistically does anyone have thoughts on when the next version of the GH1 will come out? just curious....
AND, what features will it have that the current model does not?
(errr....what features would you want it to have?)


btw: (i searched for a similar thread -- couldn't find any answers/thoughts)
 
What we want:

1. Higher bitrate 24mbps
2. No banding in lowlight scenes
3. Adjustable/fixed audio level and monitoring
4. Less jello in 1080

What they'll give us:

1. Higher bitrate maybe 21mbps for FHD
2. Better sensor but not get rid of the banding completely
3. Maybe adjustable/fixed audiolevel but no monitoring
4. A smidgen less jello in 1080

And they'll give us more lenses with autofocus when filming. Just my guess!
 
Panasonic will probably have a yearly product cycle for the GHX products, since its with their consumer division. My guess is next summer 2010 they'll come out with the GH2, but by then their competition will be murder (including perhaps competition from their own camcorders lets hope :).
 
Problem isn't Jello in 1080p it's mud...get your evil evil evil terms right :D

I think Panasonic is going to continue kicking ass in this area. The GH1 is an amazing camera, and it's successor will be too.

You have to remember that the GH1 was leaps and bounds ahead of anything else when it came to innovations on a vDSLR camera, and it still is (7D is pretty much an incremental update to the features they added in the 5D mkII, whereas the GH1 represents, despite itself being an update of the G1, something entirely new in this area with its features geared specifically for video shooting, in many ways more so than toward photos, it's mirror-less design, and great lens support.)

I really don't see why everyone is assuming the GH2 will just be an incremental update. While it seems somewhat likely I think you should consider the changes made between the G1 and the GH1, such as a better viewfinder, a different kit lens, an improved sensor, a myriad of new features, etc....what I am really hoping for is the ability to turn on a Pro mode or something in the menu that will give us more control and options in the areas we've asked for. Panasonic isn't stupid and I think they've realized that one of the reasons they grossely underestimated demand at launch was the fact that they didn't realize that professional and prosumer video people would be as interested in this camera as we were and are. They are left facing the reality that they do need to cater to our needs as well, or they're going to lose the largest percentage of the customer base that their product has.

I'm also looking forward
 
I too am curious about the next step for the GH1. Looking at the dates of firmware updates on Panasonic's web site for their consumers products revealed there were some quick update like the GH1 had for v1.1. On average updates came out about every six months. Some were 1.1, 1.2 and 1.3 and others went directly to 2.0.

My daughter is getting married next April so I'll be picking up a GH1 in early 2010. Until then I'll sit back and enjoy the show and hope for an awesome firmware update.
 
editman said:
Well if Nr 1 is a higher bitrate we might don't have to worry about mud and the only thing lacking in 1080 is jellofreevision...
Click to expand...

not entirely. from what i'v read from the boards, it's not about the bitrate, but the way the codec is being used. there are 17mb ACHD cams on the market that don't suffer from mud because they are using a different way of encoding AVCHD. Something about GOP, b frames..etc..
 
I'd be happy if they just added a headphone jack, called it a GH2, and charged 100 dollars more.
I'm still scratching my head trying to figure out why the 5D and GH1 (and apparently 7D) have audio recording capabilities if we can't monitor any of them.
 
I'm still scratching my head trying to figure out why the 5D and GH1 (and apparently 7D) have audio recording capabilities if we can't monitor any of them.
Click to expand...
About all you'd be able to monitor would be whether you'd remembered to switch on any external mic you were using. If they added audio controls, then monitoring would become more useful.
 
Ozpeter said:
About all you'd be able to monitor would be whether you'd remembered to switch on any external mic you were using. If they added audio controls, then monitoring would become more useful.
Click to expand...

Touche.
:)

But still - I guess my point is...
either put audio on the camera, or don't....
but don't just PRETEND to do it.

(which is essentially what we have now).
 
I find the onboard audio fine for syncing the sound from a external device or song playback when shooting rock video style. Good production sound still means a dedicated sound guy anyway and I don't want his gear tangled up with my camera. So it's better that a basic AGC sound is available than not at all.
 
I agree, the onboard audio is great as a reference track for post production. Not that I'd use it I was kinda surprised how good it was which is a great plus for the consumer market the camera was intended for.
 
Ozpeter said:
[If there was a headphone jack] About all you'd be able to monitor would be whether you'd remembered to switch on any external mic you were using. If they added audio controls, then monitoring would become more useful.
Click to expand...

Hi Ozpeter: I respectfully & strongly disagree. :)

The addition of a dirt cheap headphone jack on the GH1, 7D, etc. would make a _huge_ difference for many users!

Although connecting external audio gear to a camera can be inconvenient at times, this doesn't prevent thousands of productions of all types from doing it everyday all over the world. Being unable to monitor GH1/7D audio during preview & recording can _not_ be made into an advantage.

Further, although in-cam manual level control would be useful, it isn't absolutely required for many/most prosumer & pro users. Instead of manual audio _control_, Panasonic & Canon could easily (e.g.: essentially for free) allow you to switch the mic input to fixed line level in, and you'd then control levels using your external audio gear. Video & sound pros have worked this way _forever_. Together with the addition of a headphone jack, this capability would give the GH1/7D powerful and yet quite ordinary (and expected) audio recording capabilities. Again, the lack of simple, ordinary, expected audio functionality can not be made out to be some kind of advantage.

As I pointed out months ago, what's even more insane is that Panasonic & Canon don't even actually have to add a headphone jack -- they can save that measly penny or two per cam: All they have to do is enable live audio out during preview & recording via their cams' existing audio output connector! Again, many/most prosumer & pro users are able to convert line level out for headphone monitoring. There's some hope Tramm Hudson may be able to add live line level audio out to the 7D via some future Magic Lantern firmware hack, but there's no guarantee. Panasonic & Canon are stupid (or greedy/stingy) for omitting it in the first place. Once again, the lack of simple, ordinary, expected audio functionality can not be made out to be some kind of advantage.

In another thread Barry Green asked (paraphrasing): "Who gets to decide which features are included/excluded from a cam design?" While I appreciate his point, it presents somewhat of a false choice. Some features are more simple, ordinary and basic than others. Cost effective. Bang for the buck. There's nothing in motion picture production more cost effective & bang for the buck than good, functional audio! The audio recording & monitoring capabilities of these cams are inexcusably pathetic. _Especially_ since it would cost the manufacturers practically _nothing_ to implement this basic functionality.

Being forced to shoot using an external audio recorder is completely brain dead, and as Barry said, "asinine". It. Is. Not. A. Feature.

Also, _where_ in the audio chain you do your monitoring makes all the difference in the world! (It can make a career-jeopardizing difference.) See:
http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?p=1747058#post1747058
 
Luis Caffesse said:
I'm still scratching my head trying to figure out why the 5D and GH1 (and apparently 7D) have audio recording capabilities if we can't monitor any of them.
Click to expand...
How many times have you seen a parent at a soccer game, wedding, graduation, baseball game, birthday party, etc., videotaping an event...

... and wearing headphones?


The GH1, 7D, and 5D are *consumer cameras*. People using them aren't going to be wearing headphones.

We are the oddballs. We're the ones trying to take a consumer item and press it into professional service.

Yes, I'm well aware many consumer cameras do have headphone jacks, but who uses 'em? I'm also sure many consumer cameras don't even bother with headphone jacks.
 
Peter J. DeCrescenzo said:
Being forced to shoot using an external audio recorder is completely brain dead, and as Barry said, "asinine".
Click to expand...
Who is "forcing" you to use a consumer DSLR for your professional productions? You're choosing to go use a product which was not designed for professional use, and pressing it into service for something which it was not designed to do.

So there's an old adage that says "beggars can't be choosers". Either work around the limitations (by using an external recorder) or don't use the product that's not designed for your use. Wait for a broadcast version.

Also, _where_ in the audio chain you do your monitoring makes all the difference in the world! (It can make a career-jeopardizing difference.) See:
http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?p=1747058#post1747058
Click to expand...
Sure -- which is why I question why someone would jeopardize their career by using a product that's not designed for professional use?

All I'm saying is: it IS what it IS, not what you wish it was. End of story. Full stop.

You have the choice of using it as-is, and jumping through hoops, or ignoring it and using what works. That's the same choice I had to face with my Red One, way back in Build 14 days. I chose not to jump through the hoops and sold it off, and used conventional properly-designed video cameras and got on with life and with business. Others chose to jump through the hoops. Not saying either decision is better than the other, but saying that they're both perfectly valid choices.
 
The problem is that the companies have this somewhat inexplicable attitude that their highest end photo cameras should have introductory level video features...one of the main reasons I like the GH1 is that despite being a somewhat lower-end photography camera they actually put in great video controls, etc, lol.
 
"great" for a DSLR, but not great as per a video camera. Where's the zebras? Where's the audio level control? etc...

The GH1 is a quantum leap beyond the D90 and the original-firmware 5D Mark II, but it's still a consumer still camera with an added video feature. I think it's fantastic, I love it, but I recognize its limitations and I do not expect them to change.

If they change? Yay. Great surprise.

But I do not expect it to change.
 
Camera's like the GH1 and 5D are pioneer tools. If you recognize the much better image quality compared to ordinary video camcorders you can choose to pioneer and have a horrible life with a lot of headaches for about one year and struggle due to the limitations of these new camera's, or you can wait for a camera that doesn't have these limitations. I chose to compromise and use the GH1 and deal with the headaches. Because looking at the image quality of for example my Canon XH A1 gives me a bigger headache and it hurts my eyes too :-) Some people don't see the difference and are not impressed by the image quality of the GH1 and the 5D. Those should not use these camera's in the first place and stick with conventional video camcorders.

Now about the GH2... I think it will be a small camcorder with conventional camcorder like housing but with DSLR camera like signal processing and recording. This is also what I am hoping for, so this is wishful thinking.

Now will Panasonic be eager to develop such a camcorder? Maybe not because by doing so they would create a camera in the $1500 price range that will produce the same kind of picture quality (if not better) than a $50,000 Panasonic camcorder. In other words, they would become their own competitor.

So I think a camera like this (a professional DSLR video based video camcorder) will come from a brand that used to be specialized in photo camera's and never made video camera's before. For example Pentax or Leica.

Just my thoughts.
 
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Barry, I luv you man, but this may be only the 2nd time in your life you're mistaken. :-)

It's idiotic (or worse) for companies (plural for crissake!) to design mid-priced 2nd/3rd generation "HD video-capable" DSLRs which have all-but-crippled audio capabilities. Period. Full stop.

It doesn't matter if these are allegedly "consumer" products: Designing-in basic, simple, expected audio capabilities _correctly_ COSTS THEM ESSENTIALLY NOTHING!

I'm very, very sorry to have to shout about this, but you're mistaken.

And since you bring it up, zebras or other things like peaking (and heaven forbid, colorbars!!! AHHHHHHHHHHHHH EVERYONE RUN!!!!!!! HE"S ASKING FOR A BUILT-IN JPEG OF A CALIBRATED COLORBAR!!!!!!!!!!!!!! AHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!) are right up there alongside basic, simple, expected audio capabilities in this regard.

Oops. Sorry for shouting again. :-)

There's a relatively short list of basic, simple features we should expect from cams which produce HD video of this caliber.

All I'm asking for are features which will cost them as close to nothing as is possible in the world of electronic design & manufacturing.

You can't convince me my expectations are unreasonable. It's the manufacturer's apparent refusal (thus far) to do the right thing which is unreasonable -- or worse.
 
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