1schoeps = (2octavas + living off the interest.)

ScoobySounds

ScoobySounds

Well-known member
I've been thinking recently about something so thought i'd ask here.

i'm thinking about selling my schoeps hyper, and buying two octavas instead. I have been thinking and thinking about the advantages of having AB stereo capability, (or each on a boom) over the existing only-having-one hyper situation. not to mention what I could buy with the extra money.

its a dilemma i'm struggling with, and find it harder and harder to justify the schoeps, as compared to two hypers, a heap of useful cables, wireless monitoring, a cart, spare long pole, backup recorder, figure of 8 mic, and probably many other things I could think of that I want.

The main thing is, that i've never used one of these octavas, i've only ever HEARD of them here on these boards, so this is why i'm posting this here. seems like the most qualified place for the advice i'm looking for. Does the sound quality of the schoeps far exceed the octava, enough to justify its price as compared with all the stuff I could do with.

I think the answer is no, probably not. Perhaps I wasn't in a position to buy such an expensive mic, when there are other things I could really do with.... but then again, there are ALWAYS things you could 'really do with', and I can't always just buy the cheaper stuff, just to have more volume of kit.

I'm not doing huge budget feature films, or big international docos, and even when I might be in the future, then the budget would get me schoeps' if I needed them. But I AM doing work in rugged and varied conditions where chains of people are relying on my equipment to work, and work well. So I have to consider this in my purchases also, that i'm not cutting any financial corners and taking risks that will ultimately loose me work.

So - what would you guys do? Would you rather have 1 really excellent mic (which cost me $2500 including rycote suspension, conn box and wind protection) or 2 good mics costing ($376+suspension etc) leaving $2124 to spend, on, maybe a small island in the mediterranean.
 
I have both and personally would never trade my Schoeps for anything. It is the one piece of equipment I absolutely love. The Oktava sound really good considering the price but "really good" is not great and the Schoeps is GREAT.

If you only need really good and want some cash to fill out the rest of your kit then go for it. You might want to try Oleg's site if you end up selling the Schoeps. You will have no problem finding a buyer for that mic.

As far as getting two Oktavas, I have a matched pair and never use them for stereo recording (truth is my Oktavas collect a lot of dust). It is a personal choice thing but I prefer MS for most of my stereo recordings. Ambient makes a really nice figure 8 that will work with any hyper or shotgun.

Cheers
 
Scooby - of course, you know the first thing I'm gonna say is that you should try the Oktava before making a decision. You'll never get a clear enough answer asking questions like this, 'cause it's all so subjective and dependent on experience, style, and circumstances. However, my psychological advice is - sell it if you can think of it as a possibility. I've bought gear that's been "ourageously expensive" at the time I got it; some of it (very little, thankfully!) I've been happy with but not overwhelmed, and some (like wabbit and his Schoeps) I've come to love and depend on so much that I'd never be able to imagine operating without. And it's a personal decision; I'm not saying that 'cause he loves his Schoeps, you should, too. I'm saying, since you are even entertaining the idea of selling it, it doesn't have the magic for you that should make you sacrifice the other things you're considering.

As you may or may not know, I record mostly classical music, live and critical, and I have to say that for me, the Oktavas fall into this "never give 'em up" category - as a pair of omnis. (Actually, I have six MK-012s; two matched pairs and two modified). They're extremely reliable, and very forgiving of problems that other mics are not - scratchy strings, harsh pianos, page-turnings and stage creaks. If I were in a studio where all these factors could be controlled, I'd likely consider other mics for many things, but when I have limited time and control of the situation, I usually reach for the Oktavas. Many people would claim other mics are "better" - but this is always a pronouncement that makes a lot of assumptions. I've done some production-style dialog recording with the Oktava hypers, and have been happy with the natural, warm sound. As it's nowhere near my most common activity, I've seen no need so far to look for anything else.

Look around for a DVXUser in Scotland that has an MK012, and see if you can get together and try it out! Try whatever mics you can get your hands on. Then see if your feelings for the Schoeps shift towards love or indifference!

Wabbit - Hey, I've done a lot of MS recording but have never really tried it with different (unmatched) mics - I suppose I'll do some testing soon just for kicks - but do you really get a great sound by pairing that Ambient mic with "any hyper or shotgun"? Seems like the stereo field would vary with frequency in the ranges where the mics differ. Can you (or anyone else) comment on the solidity of the stereo field with such "mix'n'match" MS setups? Do you have certain combinations that work best? I mean, I've heard of people pairing a ribbon mic with a pretty hyped condenser; and these diverge greatly in exactly the frequency range where most stereo perception takes place (I've never gotten a sound sample of one of these odd combinations!)... I can't imagine a stable image there!
 
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P.S., As for using the MK012s for stereo - they are NOT my favorite for coincident stereo; I use 'em that way only when I don't have a choice. I never use the hyper caps for stereo. I'm not sure what you want to record in stereo; but I don't know that hyper MK012s are the best bet. Now, if I were you, I'd get the matched 3-capsule set, or just 1 hyper. With the 3-cap pair (in its nice, small box!) I can tackle any situation fairly well. One of my pairs lives in my camera bag for just that reason....
 
Thnks for the replies -

there's no doubt that I love the sound of the schoeps, but I haven't got an octava to compare it to, so very true ullanta, it would definately be obligatory to listen to a few comparisons first. I've just heard so many people raving about them here.

The stereo stuff I do at the moment is usually MS, and, its funny you mention the emesser mic wabbit, cos thats the one i'll be geting once I have the cash.

Mixmatching mics for MS produces good results usually, better than you'd expect from mixing mics for AB recording, the ambient characteristics are defined with the side mic and the focus characteristics with the Mid mic. Matching isn't so important with MS because both mics are matrixed onto both channels.

anyway, thanks - I need to think more about it. i think i'd really miss having it if I sold it.
 
akg uls 63,61 is my favor , could be found for 500+us , each aditional capsul around 160
no figure of 8 but you can handle it with blue line akg - another 500
exellent microphone , if i havent had few schoepses that what i was looking for .defenetly few leags over the oktava .
+ you have low cut filter and attunuation directly on the mic , abillity for swivel joint ( mast)
 
For flexible stereo the matched set of Oktavas is the way to go. With omnis you can get nice (most hi-fi) AB or Jecklin disk (I should post a picture of the nice disk I made), With cardioids you get XY and ORTF and variants. With hypers you can try to get pointed XY if you must have stereo for video (?).

For all flavors of AB and XY the mics should be exactly alike...
 
ScoobySounds said:
Matching isn't so important with MS because both mics are matrixed onto both channels.
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Hey, not to be argumentative, but I wholly disagree. MS works through the summation of waveforms, and differences in frequency response between two mics will affect this sum. Just because the differences are the same (well, inverted) in each final L/R signal does not mean that the stereo image will be solid - it will vary in "width" in proportion to the differing frequency response of the mics.

Again, I'll emphasize that I'm mostly recording classical, where the precision and image of an unmoving soundstage is paramount. Even with a slightly unmatched pair of the "same" mics (e.g., two multi-pattern mics of the same model), the frequency response differences cause frequency-dependent shifting of the stereo image. I'm not saying the sound at any moment isn't "nice" or strereo-like; it's that moment to moment the exact position of musicians may seem to vary. This wouldn't be an issue in many applications, but comes to the forefront in audiophile classical recording. I'm just wondering if anyone's used a "mix'n'match" MS pair for a recording whwere a precise and consistent soundstage was essential....
 
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ScoobySounds said:
Does the sound quality of the schoeps far exceed the octava, enough to justify its price as compared with all the stuff I could do with.

I think the answer is no, probably not.
Click to expand...

Having heard both, I think the answer is "yes the schoeps makes a big difference."

Buy an Oktava for a throw away you can use in hazardous situation.

Regards,

Ty Ford
 
oh the agony of decision. Personally, I'd side with Ty - but there's another way.

If you can't find one locally to borrow, buy one from the sound room and try it out for yourself. Sound may be a bunch of waveforms on an oscilliscope to the purist, but it's really all about your perception of sound that makes it all so interesting. It's your ears and your dollars, and this one's cheap enough you don't have to guess.

Buy the mic, experience the differences and decide for yourself. If, as I'm guessing, the Schoeps has raised your bar too far, turn around and sell the octava here. It'll go fast and I'd bet your total out of pocket would be UNDER $50. and you'd know for sure.

If I've guessed wrong and you do decide the schoeps can go, there's a bunch of sharks, myself included, who'd love to discuss trades . . .:beer:
 
I think if someone has never heard the Schoeps and the first mic they buy is the Octava, then they would probably be pretty happy with it. But I think an A/B test would go a long way to convince most that the Schoeps is the better mic. How much better is really the determining factor. I think for a sound recordist who des this everyday for a living, the price of the Schoeps is justified. For someone who needs a budget mic that sounds really good in situations where a hyper is needed, then the Octava fits the bill. I think everyone should own at least one anyway, because as Ty mentioned earlier, you can have a mic you're not afraid to use in compromised conditions.

My only other point would be that you know the Schoeps really well at this point. You haven't heard the Octava in numerous record situations, so you'd have to learn its characteristics. Not a big deal I suppose, but there has to be a comfort level knowing what to expect from that Schoeps.

Anyway...I'm sure either way, you'll record some great sound.

Steve
 
Some great comments,

Thanks fellas..

Ty, I think that is a good idea, I've had my Schoeps in some precarious situations that the octava woulda been much more comfortable for. Once I had to hide the schoeps next to a chopping block, where this ham-fisted oaf was damn near totalling my mic with every axe swing. :furious3:

..and I Do know the schoeps very well at this point..
....and I could just buy them, and all the stuff I need in time....


.... aw heck ---
-------No sale guys!
---------------she's gonna be a keeper!!:thumbsup:


Guess I've just been intrigued by this Octava since being on this board, it was written about like a bit of a phenomenon.
 
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