Recording Vocals While Listening to Guitar Track

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nicho269

New member
I'm trying to record vocals while listening to a guitar track through my headphones. I do not want the guitar track to lay over the vocals. I want two separate tracks. I am using a macbook, Adobe Soundbooth, a mixer (Eurorack UB1002), an MXL 990 mic, Bose headphones, and listening to the guitar track from iTunes.

Whenever I press record, Soundbooth is somehow picking up the guitar track. I know it's not coming from the headphones because they're noise reduction and the guitar track ends up coming through my vocal track very crisp.

Is there something I'm doing wrong? Should I be changing something in my macbook settings? This never happened on my PC...
 
nicho269 said:
I'm trying to record vocals while listening to a guitar track through my headphones. I do not want the guitar track to lay over the vocals. I want two separate tracks. I am using a macbook, Adobe Soundbooth, a mixer (Eurorack UB1002), an MXL 990 mic, Bose headphones, and listening to the guitar track from iTunes.

Whenever I press record, Soundbooth is somehow picking up the guitar track. I know it's not coming from the headphones because they're noise reduction and the guitar track ends up coming through my vocal track very crisp.

Is there something I'm doing wrong? Should I be changing something in my macbook settings? This never happened on my PC...
Click to expand...

It appears to be bleed through from the headphones or the mac speaker is on. Check the mac, try different phones.
 
nicho269 said:
I know it's not coming from the headphones because they're noise reduction...
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That doesn't neccessarily follow. Headphone leakage occurs to varying degrees in all headphones, although tight-fitting closed-back headphones are less prone to it. Active noise cancellation systems are no guarantee against headphone bleed. Indeed, such `phones are an ill-advised choice for critical monitoring and recording applications.

As for the leakage itself, how much of it is getting onto your tracks? Are we talking a tiny bit of whisper in the vocals, or is the guitar track getting mixed right into your recordings? I haven't worked with a Macbook, so I'm going to assume that plugging in headphones will mute the built-in speakers.

First things first: determine if the headphones are the issue. Do a test recording with the headphones on and at the usual volume, but keep them far away from the mic (even in another room under a stack of blankets).

If you still hear the guitar track in the test recording, then the problem is probably internal to the Macbook's sound card (eg. cross-talk between the line input and the headphone output) or software (perhaps the iTunes audio stream is internally routing into Soundbooth's input stream). In the latter case, I don't know nearly enough about the software you're using to offer specific help. Either way, using some other device (eg. an MP3 player) for audio playback would certainly keep the two tracks sepperate. The obvious downside of this strategy is that you would be unable to monitor both your backing tracks and your vocals at the same time.

As for Xiaobaimao2008's contributions: boo to spammers!
 
nicho269 said:
I'm trying to record vocals while listening to a guitar track through my headphones. I do not want the guitar track to lay over the vocals. I want two separate tracks. I am using a macbook, Adobe Soundbooth, a mixer (Eurorack UB1002), an MXL 990 mic, Bose headphones, and listening to the guitar track from iTunes.

Whenever I press record, Soundbooth is somehow picking up the guitar track. I know it's not coming from the headphones because they're noise reduction and the guitar track ends up coming through my vocal track very crisp.

Is there something I'm doing wrong? Should I be changing something in my macbook settings? This never happened on my PC...
Click to expand...

I'm not all that familiar with Soundbooth but the problem may lie in trying to listen to the guitar track in one application (iTunes) while recording into a second (Soundbooth). Most standard audio drivers don't support using multiple concurrent applications like that.

Another thing to check - in the computer's audio control panel is the wave out getting routed to the recording in?

Do you have Soundbooth CS3 or CS4? CS3 is not multitrack but CS4 is. You may need to move the guitar track out of iTunes and into a multitrack audio editing program, either Soundbooth CS4 or Audition. You'd play the guitar back from one track in the audio application through your headphones while simultaneously recording vocal to a new track. When you mix the final version for export out of the editor you can include as much or as little of the guitar as you wish, even excluding it altogether if you like. Standard multitrack NLE fare. In fact, if you have the musical chops to play a variety of instruments you can build up an entire complex song one instrument at a time using that technique.
 
Sorry it took so long to respond - my internet went down last night
SMuir said:
As for the leakage itself, how much of it is getting onto your tracks? Are we talking a tiny bit of whisper in the vocals, or is the guitar track getting mixed right into your recordings? I haven't worked with a Macbook, so I'm going to assume that plugging in headphones will mute the built-in speakers.
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It's getting mixed right into my recording. And, I've tried all of those tests. It's definitely the system or hook-up.

Thanks for the advice; I'll check this out:
SMuir said:
If you still hear the guitar track in the test recording, then the problem is probably internal to the Macbook's sound card (eg. cross-talk between the line input and the headphone output) or software (perhaps the iTunes audio stream is internally routing into Soundbooth's input stream).
Click to expand...
 
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Steve House said:
Another thing to check - in the computer's audio control panel is the wave out getting routed to the recording in?
Click to expand...

Any ideas on how to check that on a macbook??

Steve House said:
Do you have Soundbooth CS3 or CS4? CS3 is not multitrack but CS4 is. You may need to move the guitar track out of iTunes and into a multitrack audio editing program, either Soundbooth CS4 or Audition.
Click to expand...

Yeah, that makes sense. I'll try that right now!
 
Ok, So I'm now using Garageband, which is a multitrack editor, and that seems to fix the problem I was having... but now I can't hear both my music and myself through my headphones at the same time. I'm using a Eurorack UB1002 mixer. I have a condenser mix hooked to it via XLR, and the mixer is connected directly to my computer with the in/outputs on the mixer. I also have headphones connected to the mixer.

Any ideas?
 
nicho269 said:
Ok, So I'm now using Garageband, which is a multitrack editor, and that seems to fix the problem I was having... but now I can't hear both my music and myself through my headphones at the same time. I'm using a Eurorack UB1002 mixer. I have a condenser mix hooked to it via XLR, and the mixer is connected directly to my computer with the in/outputs on the mixer. I also have headphones connected to the mixer.

Any ideas?
Click to expand...

Exactly how is your mixer patched to the computer? There are a variety of ways to do it depending on whether you want to monitor the vocal directly at the mixer or want to monitor it through the computer. My first thought is to connect the mixer's Tape Out stereo RCA L&R connectors to the computer's audio Line In connection and the computer audio Line Out connection to the mixer's Tape In RCAs using a pair of RCA to stereo mini "Y" cables. Your headphones connect to the phones jack on the mixer and your mic to mix input channel 1, panned center to record dual mono. Set the mixer's "Tape to Ctrl Room" switch on but make sure that the "Tape to Mix" switch is off to avoid feedback. You'll hear the guitar playback from Garageband plus your voice in the headphones but the mix going to the recording input will not have the guitar track
 
Steve House said:
Set the mixer's "Tape to Ctrl Room" switch on but make sure that the "Tape to Mix" switch is off to avoid feedback.
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I tried this, but it still isn’t working. After playing with the buttons for a while, the only thing that seems to be working (so that I can hear both my guitar track and myself) is if I have “PHANTOM” and “TAPE TO MIX” pressed. When I have “PHANTOM” and “TAPE TO CTRL ROOM” pressed, I can’t hear myself.

Steve House said:
Exactly how is your mixer patched to the computer? There are a variety of ways to do it depending on whether you want to monitor the vocal directly at the mixer or want to monitor it through the computer.
Click to expand...
I have two pairs of RCA to stereo mini "Y" cables. One from the L and R tape out on my mixer to the mic input on my macbook, the other from the L and R tape in on my mixer to the headphones output on my macbook. The mic is connected via XLR to the mic input channel one, panned center. My headphones are in the headphones jack.

If you have any advice on to enhance my setup, or a recommendation for software I should use, it would be appreciated, especially if you've recorded music before (I’ll be getting a PC in the next couple of months and I currently own a macbook, so software for either computer would work). I don’t mind purchasing more equipment if I need to, so if you have any recommendations for that, please let me know! I’m just trying to learn everything that I can.

By the way, thanks for all of your help. It's very appreciated.
 
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nicho269 said:
I'm a noob at this, so I'm not sure exactly what I want to do or how to do it. Any advice would be appreciated, especially if you've recorded music before :)

The way I have my mixer hooked up: I have two pairs of RCA to stereo mini "Y" cables. One from the L and R tape out on my mixer to the mic input on my macbook, the other from the L and R tape in on my mixer to the headphones output on my macbook. The mic is connected via XLR to the mic input channel one, panned center. My headphones are in the headphones jack.

Here are the buttons I've pressed (I have no idea if they are correct, so correct me if I'm wrong): "PHANTOM" and "TAPE TO CTRL ROOM". I have not pressed, "TAPE TO MIX" or "FX TO CTRL R."


The only time I've been able to hear myself through the mic is when I have "FX TO CTRL R" pressed, but whenever I press that button, I lose all other sounds; I can no longer hear the guitar track. When I press just the two I've mentioned (tape to mix and fx to ctrl r) I can't hear myself through the mic. I even have the volume level for both channel one and the phones turned all the way up, and still, nothing.

By the way, thanks for all of your help. It's very appreciated.
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The mixer Tape Out is a line level source, not a mic level. If you have both a mic in and a line in on the computer, use the line in. If there's only one input, there should be a software control to switch it between line and mic sensitivity - I don't use MacBook so you're on your own tracking that down (RTFM). If you're certain you're stuck with only mic level inputs on the computer, you'll need some attenuating pads to get the mixer output down low enough that you avoid overloading the audio inputs.

Since writing this I looked at the Apple website and what I see there indicates a MacBook has audio line in and line out, but no specific mic jack so your connections at the computer are probably okay. Double check to make sure what you have though.

Set the Main Mix fader so the line in the middle of the knob lines up to the "0" mark towards the top of its travel. Set the "Fx" fader (red knob) on the mic's channel all the way off, fully counter-clockwise (that's what's sending signal to the FX bus that you're hearing when you switch on "FX to Ctrl Room.") Set the mic channel fader (bottom white knob) to mid scale, the 0 mark in the middle of the dial. While talking into the mic, adjust the mic channel Gain control (top black knob) to make the top pair of green LEDs glow as you speak and the yellow LEDs on the meter just barely flicker occasionally. Adjust the headphone gain to a comfortable level. That should get you into the ballpark. The channel gain control is the master level for the mic, setup and forget it. The channel fader is the fine adjust you use to trim levels as needed during a take. The main mix is normally set to the proper level for unity gain and left alone from there. In fact, production mixers often have a click stop at the unity mark to make sure they don't accidently get moved. Continual riding of the main mix level fader is more a feature of live sound PA mixing, not usually done when recording.
 
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nicho269 said:
Ok, So I'm now using Garageband, which is a multitrack editor, and that seems to fix the problem I was having... but now I can't hear both my music and myself through my headphones at the same time. I'm using a Eurorack UB1002 mixer. I have a condenser mix hooked to it via XLR, and the mixer is connected directly to my computer with the in/outputs on the mixer. I also have headphones connected to the mixer.

Any ideas?
Click to expand...

Yes, read the manual. :)

It wiil tell you to monitor the macbook, not the mixer. Plug your headphones into the macbook. Visit the Mac sound control panel, Garage Band preferences and Audio/MIDI application to make sure your settings are right.

Try making an appointment with a Mac Genius at the local mac store. One lesson about Garage Band will be very helpful.

Regards,

Ty Ford
 
Steve House said:
The mixer Tape Out is a line level source, not a mic level.
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Thanks for all of this help!! I've been busy with Christmas, but I'll try it out as soon as I can!

tyreeford said:
Plug your headphones into the macbook.
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Hmm I can't do that. I'm using a condenser mic so I need phantom power which I can't get without my mixer. I need my headphones in the mixer because that's the only way to monitor my vocals while I'm singing. Thanks for the advice though :)
 
nicho269 said:
Thanks for all of this help!! I've been busy with Christmas, but I'll try it out as soon as I can!


Hmm I can't do that. I'm using a condenser mic so I need phantom power which I can't get without my mixer. I need my headphones in the mixer because that's the only way to monitor my vocals while I'm singing. Thanks for the advice though :)
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???Um, what you say makes no sense. I understand you need phantom power for your mic. but to hear the mix you need your phones plugged into the Mac, NOT THE MIXER. That's why you're not hearing what you want.

If you have configured the system right Garage band lets you do that.

Go to a Mac store and let one of those guys show you, really.

Regards,

Ty Ford
 
tyreeford said:
???Um, what you say makes no sense. I understand you need phantom power for your mic. but to hear the mix you need your phones plugged into the Mac, NOT THE MIXER. That's why you're not hearing what you want.

If you have configured the system right Garage band lets you do that.

Go to a Mac store and let one of those guys show you, really.

Regards,

Ty Ford
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Hi Ty:
As I read the manual for that little Behringer mixer it appears that he should be able to hear a mix of the input channel with the mic on it plus the playback coming in on the tape input in his phones yet only have the mic's signal routed to its Main Outs. I'm thinking a mix-minus here. If so, wouldn't that allow him to direct monitor his vocal at the mixer while still hearing the playback or am I missing something? Never worked with Garageband or MacBook myself so I've been guessing that direct monitoring at the mixer would be easier to set up than trying to configure Garageband to playback the guitar track while also monitoring the channel where the vocal is being recorded. On my Mackie it's a no brainer - I've got my playback coming into an Aux input that can be routed to the control room/phones monitor bus while remaining isolated from the main mix. The mic on input 1 goes to main mix. The control room bus hears both the main mix and the Aux input. In the phones I hear a mix of playback and the live mic (with zero latency on the mic of course) but only the mic appears on the mixer's main out. Then in Audition or Nuendo it's only a mouse click in the software plus a button press on the mixer to toggle between internal monitoring in the software versus zero-latency external direct monitoring, all the while hearing the playback. That's what I've been trying to help our OP set up. For that matter, my audio interface allows for ASIO direct monitoring at the interface itself, sending any of its inputs directly to any output as well as to the computer, but I don't know if the MacBook stock sound card would have that ability.
 
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Steve,

Easy for you, but not necessarily for the OP. That's why I'm trying to steer him to square #1.

GB requires attention to I/O detail in its preferences, in the Audio control panel and in the Audio/MIDI applet to work properly. You can be one click away from success and never know it.

Soundtrack Pro is worse.

Regards,

Ty Ford
 
tyreeford said:
Steve,

Easy for you, but not necessarily for the OP. That's why I'm trying to steer him to square #1.

GB requires attention to I/O detail in its preferences, in the Audio control panel and in the Audio/MIDI applet to work properly. You can be one click away from success and never know it.

Soundtrack Pro is worse.

Regards,

Ty Ford
Click to expand...

Good to know. Rather than trying to get a mixed output of the recording track and the playback track into the phones direct from GB, what do you think of the idea of direct monitoring the mic at the mixer?
 
Apparently, for any of a number of reasons. it's not working for him.

I'm suggesting a way it can.

Ty Ford
 
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