••Why do You Guys Continue to Shoot on the EX1?••

Coco Bermudez

Coco Bermudez

Well-known member
I have been in the market to upgrade my DVX100A...love that bugger!
The only logical choice for me is to go with the HVX200...but I came across an article on one of my trade magazines and I started to read about the PMW-EX1 and to be quite honest I was quite impressed.

I have always used Sony gear before I switched to Panasonic.

My questions is...why the EX1 over the Panasonic HVX200A or HPX170?

How is depth of field on this camera? What about the 4:2:0 chroma subsampling versus the 4:2:2?

Any light into this subject would greatly be appreciated...any links to past discussion on the subject always welcome too!

Thanls
 
Have both so I'm not a raceist... The full resolution for the ex-1 makes up for 4:2:0.

It's pretty simple. Just pick the camera that looks best for the project your working on.

BTW there is a reason ex-1 are outselling other camera's.
 
As for me and my house, I chose the EX1 because I had to have the full 1920x1080 resolution that the tri-1/2" chips provide. Plain and simple... resolution, baby, need those specs for my markets. Sharp and crisp and vivid. If I didn't need the rez, I may have gone with the HVX200 at the time, who knows. It was what I was gonna get before this new puppy came along. I love this EX1 thingamajigger. But I'm not making 'films', I'm shooting nature so I prefer "I'm so there" look and the "WOW, freakin' awesome!" factor. HD in your face. This thing is amazing for 6.3 grand.
 
Buck Forester said:
But I'm not making 'films', I'm shooting nature so I prefer "I'm so there" look and the "WOW, freakin' awesome!" factor. HD in your face. This thing is amazing for 6.3 grand.
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Are you saying that the EX1 has more of a video look than he more filmic look of the Panasonic?
 
Super8 said:
Are you saying that the EX1 has more of a video look than he more filmic look of the Panasonic?
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No, I can't say that firsthand because I've never seen any footage of the Panasonic other than what I've seen online. I've never shot with a Panasonic. But the profile settings I use with my EX1 have sweet color, great highlite control, and I shoot 1080/30p for a more realistic view. It doesn't look like the "video" I used to shoot years ago withy my old Beta camcorder or my Sony digital-8 camcorder, it's on a whole different level to the point it's got me really excited about creating footage again. But I'm shooting purposely more realistic looking stuff. With the nearly unlimited profile options and shooting 24p I'm sure the EX1 could be tweaked to look filmic, but reading these boards it sounds like the Panasonic is much more filmatic out of the box.

I'm sure someone who's shot with both cameras can provide a much better qualified response than mine in this regard. I just know I can't put this camera down, and everyone I show the footage to is blown away by the technical quality of the footage.
 
Oh, and regarding DOF, I wish I knew how to get footage edited and up on Vimeo so I could show some of my own examples... that's my next goal. Maybe it's subjective on the DOF, but to me it's pretty darn good... I was at McWay Falls on the Big Sur coast a couple of weekends ago and I shot some foreground plants wide open with the blurry surf crashing on the rocks behind it. I was impressed I could get such shallow DOF with the stock lens. But apparently those who use the 35mm adapters prefer much more DOF and thus use the adaptors. The DOF is obviously nothing like my Canon 5D still camera and selection of "L" glass lenses, but for the nature stuff I'm doing it's more than enough. I also have a Sony HC9 camcorder and everything always seems to be in focus no matter what, ha! So being able to single out a subject and turn the background into a pleasant mush is pretty nice for a video camera.
 
Buck Forester said:
No, I can't say that firsthand because I've never seen any footage of the Panasonic other than what I've seen online. I've never shot with a Panasonic. But the profile settings I use with my EX1 have sweet color, great highlite control, and I shoot 1080/30p for a more realistic view. It doesn't look like the "video" I used to shoot years ago withy my old Beta camcorder or my Sony digital-8 camcorder, it's on a whole different level to the point it's got me really excited about creating footage again. But I'm shooting purposely more realistic looking stuff. With the nearly unlimited profile options and shooting 24p I'm sure the EX1 could be tweaked to look filmic, but reading these boards it sounds like the Panasonic is much more filmatic out of the box.

I'm sure someone who's shot with both cameras can provide a much better qualified response than mine in this regard. I just know I can't put this camera down, and everyone I show the footage to is blown away by the technical quality of the footage.
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thanks for the info...do you have any of your videos online so i can take a look?
is it easy to pick it up and shoot? or do i ned extensive training..Ive shot with the DSR300's and DSR-130
 
Like 90% of us..... We looked at both the Panasonic and Sony cameras.

-For me.... I bought the EX3

-Easy manual focus on the EX3 without any external 5-7 inch monitor! (That alone is worth it) I couldn't focus the Pana 200 for crap.

-Bigger, bolder, sharper image. (search and compare. Vimeo and Exposure Room)

-The EX1 is about the same price as the Panasonic 200A (Rebates, Memory Card Costs KxS)

The Panasonic has it's uses.... For me it was a no brainer to go with the Ex3 image quality.

frisco
 
I would have gone the Panasonic a long time ago if it wasn't such a bandwidth hog. It makes the use of P2 unfeasible for me. With the EX, the memory may cost the same (just ignoring XxS which wasn't an option when I bought it), but I get so many more minutes on the same size card I could actually work with it.
 
do you get good control of depth of field over 1/3 cameras like the HVX?

Also what is the depth of field scale option?
 
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My choice came down to a few things (and I also came from a DVX)

1. Compatibility with our current Firestore since that is my primary long-format recorder
2. Media costs
3. Image Sharpness and control
4. Features
5. Predictied longevity.

The half inch imagers offer shallower depth of field by a good margin. Without having to buy an adapter. Yea a 35mm adapter would be awesome, but most of my work would not support that so I couldn't buy it.

The depth of field scale is an overlay on the lcd screen that shows you in feet or meters how deep the depth of field is. The peaking option also shows your focus. The Waveform monitor of the HPX170 would be a welcome option.

Then there is the speed of offloading from the Expresscards. I had to do this in the field recently, and it was a lovely option to have.

Low light performance is excellent. Chroma Subsampling on true 1080 is very close to what the 4:2:2 on the HVX/HPX offers. The full raster codec also helps the image. And since it has SDI out, if you REALLY need 4:2:2 you can have it.

The LCD blows the HVX/HPX out of the water for focusing. I've only used an external monitor a few times and that was for interview sit-down work where I wanted the foxus tack sharp, and I wanted very fast falloff of focus.

Some say the Panasonic is more filmic. That may or may not be true. It's certainly softer, but I can get there with diffusion. THey are noisier, but I can do that in post. They have different color, but I'm not sure how close I could get in trying to match. Frankly, I love what I am getting out of the camera without it.

Look at this link:

That was shot at 9pm, the only lighting was the streetlights in the parking lot, I was 120ft or more away, shooting 1080i. Other than a rudimentary change to progressive 24p, this image is unaltered. There is zero color correction on it.

Then go look at my 1 footcandle test:
http://vimeo.com/2077500

When I gave the same subject 10 footcandles, I might have given them 100 in terms of how clean the video came back.
 
PerroneFord said:
My choice came down to a few things (and I also came from a DVX)

1. Compatibility with our current Firestore since that is my primary long-format recorder
2. Media costs
3. Image Sharpness and control
4. Features
5. Predictied longevity.
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Hey Perrone

Thanks for the insight. Have you used the cine curves with the EX1...do they at least come close to the DVX100? How about the 24P...is it nice and smooth like the DVX or is it like a fake strobe?
 
You've been on this forum for years Super8 is there really a need to ask this same, mind numbing question? It's like we know the reason why each person likes their respective cam off by heart?

Did you honestly not know that most EX users use it because of higher Resolution? Longer Record times etc... and that folks who use panny's do so cos they prefer the organic look, intraframe codec, no rolling shutter.

Naturally BOTH dudes who own each cam will dispute criticisms of the other, ie EX guys will say 'BUT no... my cam can look cinematic' and vice versa!

Heres a solution... if you have enough to buy one, you have enough to go find one to try out. If you can't do that, why not watch the films entered into TwiFest- check out the EX ones and the HVX/HPX ones. It's abstract but will give you a much better impression if 'image quality' is better.

Your thread title just smacks of a guy wanting reassurance, as if your wanting these EX users to give you some man cuddle to make you feel good about a purchase. In some parts of the city you gotta pay for that kinda treatment ;)

It makes no difference asking 'hey guys can you tell me what to buy?' or 'hey why is camera x more awesome than camera y? Its lazy and it just means poor old Buck has to copy and paste his laudets and it gets ol' Perrone excited!
 
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I had both for a considerable period of time. Was still shooting on my HVX200 while I was getting used to the EX1. I have now sold my HVX and with the money purchased a few bits and pieces for the EX1 including a Letus Extreme.

Once I began using the EX1 I just couldn't go back to the HVX (even though the HVX is a quality camera itself). I found myself having to overlight stuff using the HVX with a 35mm lens adapter, as did the DP on our feature (probably not a problem on the HVX200a/HPX170. Also the EX1 seems to handle highlights better and has a much better LCD and focus aids.

All in all I just found it to be a much better camera. And if you practice a bit you can make things look filmic (with Letus). I did this recently, run n gun style with the Letus/EX1. Bit to check out is the forest stuff I shot. We purposely shot without lights and reflector as a worse case scenario for guerrilla filmmaking. So ignore the flicker in the interiors. If it hadn't have been a test we'd have lit that with a couple of Kino's.

http://vimeo.com/2246312

Shot some really nice frost footage today. Hope to have a montage of it up soon.

Without Letus it looks like really nice broadcast video.
 
I owed an HVX200. Dumped it as soon as I saw the EX1's image which is basically a whole class above. But then it is more expensive.

We are on a DVX forum so a lot os people on here will bleed Panasonic if they were cut. me, I like a camera that gives the best bang for th buck, and don't care which company manufactures it.

Massiva advantage the EX1 has over HVX200 is SXS. P2 and you are stuck with massive costs on media. With the EX1 a 16Gb card cost $75( SDHC), and records for nearly an hour. To get the same on P2 is a $3000 dollar outlay.
 
Let me chime in as I was on the fence rcently about the ex1 vs. hvx. I went with the 200a which is a major step above the hvx200 in terms of image quality and truer color rendition. not to mention better than the original 200 in reguards to light sensitivity.

I was trying my best to like the ex1 and all of its resolution glory, but could not shake the organic filmic qualities that panasonic renders naturaly with no perservatives added. I did a lighting test with the 200a andletus ex lastnight and it made me want to sale every other peice of equipment I had laying around to build around this sick combo.

This cam is plenty enough resolution for what the common indi filmaker is doing. The ex1, even with an adapter on it could never shake the stigma of its video nature to me. and there has not been one example on this forum yet that has matched the color rendition of a hvx, even with the hvx being flat.

If you are a broadcast shooter, or nature shooter. The ex1 to me seems to be the best choice, but by no stretch of the imagination is the ex1 releasing shorts on this forum that has the vast majority going wow. just look for yourself. There is a reason why panasonic is still the most sought after cam for rentals by indi filmakers.

And as for highlight handeling. If you google highlight handeling on the sony ex1 you will find horror stories on the way the ex1 handles its highlights vs. the 200a.
The roll offr is just plain harsh and unforgiving.

A the end of the day I could find very little to love about this cam except for resolution to shoot a narrative film, but we who shoot narrative understand that good color and organic look acompanied with good lighting is what sales the story not res.
 
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