5DII DOES 1080P footage!!!!!!

Yes, and here is why. I already own a variety of Canon EF lenses, so that part is already paid for. I will wait for the 2nd revision of the MarkII in hopes of it including manual aperature/shutter speed control. One draw back is the Canon zoom lens I have does not hold focus thru the zoom range so that is another hurdle to get over. Maybe a Nikon lens that holds focus/zoom w/EF adaptor will work.

I may still go for this camera even if these features are not added as I am just blown away by the image quality for price consideration. Since I shoot mainly nature and scenic topics a camera w/video capability complements my shooting style.
 
DVXguy said:
is anyone planning on buying this canon to exclusively shoot video?
Click to expand...

I'm seriously considering it. The video I've seen is MUCH sharper and has fewer artifacts than my D90. I know I would probably use it for some stills too, it should be an excellent still camera and in many ways it outclasses my D300. But IF I get it I will probably only get one Canon lens, get a couple of adapters for my Nikon glass, and I would probably sell it to buy a new Nikon when they improve D-Movie.

One thing that is swaying me is that I NEED to pull frame grabs from my video for stills on a site I am doing. I'm shooting with 2 cameras now, the other is my HV20 and my frame grabs from it are fairly acceptable, but from the D90 they aren't. Even if they don't give it 24p or 25p I might still need to get it.
 
Otis Grapsas said:
There is serious rolling shutter in this clip:

http://vimeo.com/1815853

Is there any way to control shutter?
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We've seen this video many times before and discussed it so there are some good post to check out in that regard.


The rolling shutter is part and parcel of this particular implementation of software/hardware. The limitations seem to be on the hardware. Specifically the way the CMOS reads the image.


The solution is to lock your shots down or use other stabilization and not to whip pan back in forth especially when zoomed in.
 
I have been looking at a lot of sample videos of the Mark II, D90 and HMC 150 lately which show some of the worst camera skills I have ever seen. No tripod, no white balance, bad focus, bad exposure, neck breaking zooms. This is really doing these cameras a disservice as there is really some bad stuff being posted.

Thank goodness for "Vincent" who has shown us what the MarkII can do in the hands of a person who has a good skill set.
 
On the start of that clip, there is a little handheld camera instability which is quite normal and still displays heavy frame distortion. That would look fine on CCD or film. Many polished hollywood films have this type of instability in some scenes for the sense of reality it gives. A handheld camera is nothing unusual and any camera should be able to handle that. A ccd camera such as a DVX handles even violent moves without problems. Many cmos cameras can do it.

You can't keep the camera locked at all times and I find it suprising that someone would want to deal with such an issue when prosumer CCD and CMOS cameras are available that behave better. It's a very serious limitation to many shooting styles. A rolling shutter that is that slow cannot be used for any action scene, a medium speed pan, mounting on vehicles, walking with the camera, use on an affordable dolly or anything similar. The consumer cmos cameras by Sony and Canon are better in the rolling shutter department because they are optimised for video and not still photography with mechanical shutter.

Control of shutter speed can reduce the problem so that would be useful to have if there is a way.

Focus will be an issue when the DOF is 1cm! We are talking about a camera with much less DOF that 35mm cine film. f1.4 on 35mm cine is similar to f2.2 on full frame still cameras in DOF. So, an f4 used in order to get useful DOF on 35mm film shooting will translate to f5.6 to f8 on the 5d II, so it's a good thing this camera is super sensitive and can handle the light loss.
 
Others have said it more eloquently than me, but I think those that are concerned about rolling shutter need to realize two things:

1. You CAN shoot around it. Good story + compelling action = who gives a f*ck?
2. CMOS scan rates and accompanying chip-sets will only get faster/better from here on out.

It will be forgotten about in 1 or 2 years. (Remember Jello-Vision©? Huh, what's that?)

Besides, the aliens are coming in 8 days, so perhaps we've got our priorities mixed up. :-)
 
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OK. This jellovision thing is going too far.. If you want to make a film
a. Get a stabilizer - look at Vincent Laforet's shots from a helicopter with a Gyro.
b. Plan your shots.

Its late at night over here. And instead of a productive discussion on this cam, there are way too many people complaining about a rolling shutter issue.
No filmmaker would go around waving their camera like a baseball bat.
 
wjm said:
1. You CAN shoot around it. Good story + compelling action = who gives a f*ck?
2. CMOS scan rates and accompanying chip-sets will only get faster/better from here on out.
Click to expand...

About point 1, good story and compelling action are also a good excuse for having 1/6" sensors with infinite DOF, bad color, soft lenses, SD resolution, interlacing, high compression and sometimes, bad acting and photograhy:) What about sound? If the song and the singer are top notch the song will not suffer from a cheap dynamic mic on a cheap desk, but still engineers spend a lot of money on mics and mic preamps.

About point 2, I have no doubt CMOS will get there is 5 or 10 years, but the future CMOS performance does not make me feel better about the limitations in the camera I use today.

CMOS is well marketed and millions of dollars were spend to make it appear better than it really is but it is a low cost approach to imaging that suffers from some basic flaws. It's excellent for still photography imaging, and for helping the constantly changing and badly shaped mobile phone and consumer camcorder segments make some extra profit, but CMOS performance is obviously not acceptable at the high end of the camcorder market. This shows many people do not want compromises in the camera motion department. It's cinema, kinesis, motion after all. It's supposed to be unlimited.

I believe the rolling shutter sample above is very useful. It's what I would shoot to test rolling shutter. Show it in all its glory from low to violent camera motion. Hiding it by not moving the camera is not helpful at all.
 
Otis Grapsas said:
...
A rolling shutter that is that slow cannot be used for any action scene, a medium speed pan, mounting on vehicles, walking with the camera, use on an affordable dolly or anything similar.
Click to expand...

I strongly disagree with this. I have shot "action" scenes with my D90 and with sane camera placement the blur in my shots covers any skew of moving body parts. I have shot hand held with the strap only for stabilization, including a little test footage that was acceptably jello free with a 135mm f2.8. Unless you shake it or whip it around its OK. The 5DM2 looks to have half of the rolling shutter or less. It will be fine as long as its handled by someone who respects it limits.

Focus will be an issue when the DOF is 1cm! We are talking about a camera with much less DOF that 35mm cine film. f1.4 on 35mm cine is similar to f2.2 on full frame still cameras in DOF. So, an f4 used in order to get useful DOF on 35mm film shooting will translate to f5.6 to f8 on the 5d II, so it's a good thing this camera is super sensitive and can handle the light loss.
Click to expand...
Focus will be no more of an issue than with a DOF adapter, and you will have 6 stops less light requirement, so stopping down isn't really an issue. I can shoot under normal residential lighting with my D90 at f5.6 without grain problems, and the 5DM2 will be even better. Vincent supposedly shot at 3200 ISO, or about 5 stops faster than I like to keep my HV20- and if I stick my DOF adapter on the front I loose another 2 1/3rd stops including the HV20's lens.

What shots are you thinking with 1cm DOF? ECU of a nose and eye with iris wide open because you are shooting under candle light?
 
The D90 is not full frame, so no difference with 35mm cine film or DOF adapters (these also crop the image, so more DOF). The 5D II is full frame, so for the same DOF with D90, multiply the aperture with 1.6x.

Candle light is not an extreme scenario. I have shot 2/3" at f1.4 and the DOF is quite usable. On a full frame you need f5.6 for the same DOF. Which is 16x less light. 24dB gain vs 0dB gain. ISO6400 vs ISO400.
 
Some DOF figures:

full frame (36mm wide) 50mm lens, f1.4, 100cm distance, 3.23cm DOF (enough for eyes perhaps)

full frame (36mm wide) 100mm lens, f1.4, 100cm distance, 0.76cm DOF (enough for half a eyelash)

full frame (36mm wide) 50mm lens, f5.6, 100cm distance, 13cm DOF (good enough for portrait)

full frame (36mm wide) 100mm lens, f25!, 100cm distance, 13cm DOF (good enough for closeup)
 
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