Any EX1 regrets?

You didn't fix them?!? This girl must have meant a lot to you Phil :) Just kidding of course... but not really.

Joking aside, what is your post solution to fixing flashes if you had too? I have heard of using Knoll Light Factory, but I wonder if people are doing it effectively with like a half white frame over the picture with a special compositing mode?
 
Regarding the DSLR market, some of the footage that I have recently seen that a guy put together using the canon 5D MKII was flat-out gorgeous. But I get the gut feeling that the rolling shutter issues will be worse than the EX1 but we'll have to wait and see. If it is a problem though, Canon has had a very slow turnover rate on the 5D upgrades so we will have to see. Plus, why didn't they include a 24p option????

I get the feeling from RED that the DSMC and the Scarlet might get put together into one product. A guess of course, but with Canon and Nikon offering HD video with their still cameras, it is a logical conclusion. A 3K video camera that takes professional quality stills with tiny rolling shutter effects all in one unit would be sweeeeeet. Apparently, they are still planning on early 2009 even with the revamp...
 
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I have shot 2 weddings with the EX1 after it was upgraded to firmware 1.11 and I can safely confirmed the partial flash has greatly reduced to a extent you will not noticed it. Before the upgrade, I used to put a white frame over the partial exposed frame and set opaque to about 60%. I no longer do this and the client did not notice it either. On the other forum, Philip Bloom also has the same observation. you might want to check it out
 
TheMusician said:
Alexdias, I really appreciate that input from someone who has used both Panasonic and the EX1. I understand what you are saying concerning rolling shutter being a problem with the EX1, but noise being an equally big problem for you on the HVX200. It seems that things are a little different now since Barry Green and others are reporting that the HPX170 has noise levels and sensitivity comparative to the EX1. But apart from the rolling shutter, are you happy with the look that you have been able to get from the camera with your style of shooting compared to the HVX?
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I'll give you my impressions in relation to the HVX. It's fair comparison even if the EX-3 is more $.
Well, I have done much so far, but as far as I did, like any other new camera, it takes a while to get use to the new style, weight, balance, etc...
Here's what I really like (no surprises here):
Excellent viewfinder, your framing and overall shooting will improve, I promise.
The lens is a joy very precise and sharp if compared to the HVX.
The 1/2 chip has a slighter shorter DOF for cinematic shots
The transfer time of the SxS is sooo much faster than the P2.
I really like the in between size and weight, it's smaller and lighter than a broadcast camera but more stable and has a better shape for handheld.

As far as color and settings go, I'm still struggling a bit. But it's a question of time and I know I'll get there.

The problems that I had with the rolling shutter was panning the camera a bit faster, or with a bus moving in front of the lens on a tighter shot, both cases I got the infamous "jellovision".
I'll have to deal with it.

These are my 2 cents.
 
TheMusician said:
Stevet, I was recently at B&H in New York to check everything out and I would have to say that I was pretty disappointed by their service. They had none of the tripods on the floor that I was interested in (Cartoni Focus, Sachtler FSB-6, Vinten Vision 3, Gitzo 1380, Miller DS20) When I asked to pick up the EX1 to see how it felt handheld and how I delt with the ergonomics, they told me that it was locked down and they had no way to release it. 90% of the cameras were all in a bin using the same Sony monitors, but the EX1 was set alone hooked up to a cheap monitor of a different brand that people had obviously adjusted as well as dialing in absurd picture profiles. So it was very difficult to compare the look of the EX1 to the HVX200a. From what I saw that day, even the XH-A1 (which is a fine camera) looked a ton better than the EX1. And to cap it off, the store employees were not supportive of the camera at all saying that they would prefer almost any other camera to the EX1.

I would love to get a second look to convince myself that the EX1 would work for me, but I live in Indianapolis and there is nobody here who sells it on a showroom floor. Anybody know of anyplace close to Indianapolis? Any EX1 owners in Indianapolis?
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Next time you are in NY go to AbelCine.
Someone once told me after listening to my complaints about B&H, "they are a electronic store, not a film/video shop. They sell small still cameras and TVs."
The Abel people will be glad to help you they are very knowledgeable.
 
philip bloom said:
first i have heard of it. But everything is possible and more than that v likely. The competition is hotting up from unexpected corners and there are also problems with certain major HD broadcasters refusing to accept 4:2:0 35mpbs so am sure it would be in Sony's interests to bring out a camera which does what the broadcasters want...After all SXS can record 50Mpbs 4:2:2 as proven by the add on for the new 700 XDCAM camera.
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Of course you can do 50mbps 4:2:2 now with a Flash XDR or NanoFlash, but it would be nice to have it built-in the camera. The 4:2:0 is one of the shortcomings that Panasonic likes to bring up in comparisons, and as you say, it's frowned upon by some broadcasters. So it's the next logical step for Sony. I think it's just a matter of when.

Conversely, I think the next logical step for Panasonic is to migrate their AVC Intra codec to the prosumer line, so that they can output full raster 4:2:2 video.

Canon hasn't announced a new camera in some time, so it would be interesting to see what they do. With new competition from Red and the DSLR's, I'm sure there is pressure to shorten product refresh cycles.
 
TheMusician said:
Plus, why didn't they include a 24p option????
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It's impossible, they have the xh-A1, the H1. they can't compete with their own products. I guess they will not launch 25p 5D II in europe neither. Let's wait for the big Nikon event with their big surprise. they can launch a still/video product without interfering with themselves. And they were the first to make the move. Canon then, and now probably Scarlet. It's very exciting but we will not have this kind of product before 6 monthes. Nothing will compete with EX1 & HPX170 at this price range anyway before this period.
 
Yes, I heard that it appears that v 1.1 does have some affect on improving rolling shutter issues.

I have not checked for partial flash improvement, but I have noticed that the AF Peak function is more sensitive. It makes me wonder how they achieved this.

Also, I'm not 100% sure and it may be "just in my mind", but it "seems" like the EX1 appears to have lower noise after the upgrade.
 
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:2vrolijk_08:The EX-1 and EX-3 are BBB Cameras. That does't mean Better Business Bureau, but, "best bang for the buck!" They are really advanced technicaly scaled versions of the Xcam generation designed for the blue-ray disk form of storage. The streem capacity is 38-39mbs which falls below the 35mps HQ mode in the EX-x series. These are entranecy level camras to the Sony EXCAM line. Basicly, they striped the blue-ray disk and replaced it with memory chips to stand side by side with Panasonic in the "new" tapless technology. They are "chips and glass" cameras of the highest technology packed in a small package, a videographers dream! No regrets! - Carl
 
I really have to say that I like what I am hearing. I mean, you come to an EX1 forum and ask a question like this and you expect that people are going to be happy with the choice that they made. But I am really surprised and happy to read that not one person has said "in hindsight, I wish I had gotten camera X instead of the EX1". Despite its horrible ergonomics and rolling shutter, it still seems that people feel that they made a solid choice, and that is great news. I can't tell you how much I appreciate all of the feedback.
 
Noel Evans said:
So now someone says go shoot a wedding, heres a 170 and an EX1. Id take the 170. Why? Because I dont know if I am going to be free from a rolling shutter issue, and that could effect me in a few ways. If it does show up, and is noticeable, well client may be unhappy - and that effects future work and knowing it could be an issue.
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I'm surprised you'd choose the 170 over the EX1 for wedding work. In Event DV magazine the reviewer of the EX1 answered this very question as to why he didn't mention the rolling shutter issues of the EX1. His answer was that he has shot close to a hundred weddings with a CMOS camera (I think the V1U) and hasn't received one complaint about the camera flashes in his footage.

So if that says anything we may notice things more than clients because it's our jobs. But they're not bothered by it. I can tell you that people are a lot more bothered by dark footage (and they'll assume you didn't know how to expose your camera properly) or noisey footage. Dark and noisey lasts 30 (or 24) frames per second. A partial-frame camera flash is over in one.

For any interested parties see my Nikon Sb-800 flash test with the EX1 here: http://www.vimeo.com/1451532 . My skew and wobble test where I run with the camera is at http://www.vimeo.com/1451404

I am also a wedding shooter and a big reason I chose the EX1 was for its low light capability (although the 170 isn't too bad, just not "as good as") and possibly more importantly its recording time. P2's 100MBps data rate and 4:2:2 color information is fine and dandy but the bottom line is it records about a minute per gigabyte. The EX1 records at least 3 times that amount of footage...which saves time with switching out cards and maybe more importantly on hard drive space/transfer times.

Yes, you can tether P2 cameras to a hard drive but that's a whole other issue. Working around headphone cables is hassle enough, add a firewire cable to the mix that can come unexpectedly unplugged and that also requires a battery that only lasts 2-3 hours or so and we have issues. But even then transferring 100GB of data (and you'll need two of these Firestore drives for a full day of wedding shooting) to a laptop is not quick and easy.
 
Adam, when you were changing the settings in your flash series, were you changing the shutter speeds on the camera or were you changing the power ratio settings on the back of the flash?
 
thxdave said:
Adam, when you were changing the settings in your flash series, were you changing the shutter speeds on the camera or were you changing the power ratio settings on the back of the flash?
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I was changing the power settings on the strobe. The EX1 was set to shutter on at 1/60 for most of the video until the part where I turned it off. I didn't see much of a difference with the EX1 shutter off like many have said on these boards and others. If I could do the test again I would fire multiple shots off again in succession at the camera at different settings. I think the middle part of the test video (with my TV in the shot) really tells the tale of the camera/what to expect from the effect.

Just as an aside my camera has the 1.05 firmware installed. As others have said the new firmware has improved this even further.
 
TheMusician said:
Adam, do you shoot your weddings at 24p, 30p, 60i? What is the most common framerate for professional weddings?
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Looking around most videographers still shoot at 60i. Myself included. 24p is a lot more popular with the indy film crowd and event shooters haven't embraced that frame rate as much (I still hate the look of strobing). I'm not saying shooting 24p isn't good but most don't. I'm not sure about the high end market but the low-medium market is still 60i for the most part. Had 24p been an option twenty years ago who knows what would be the favored setting?

1080/60i is the mode the EX1 is most light sensitive at anyway (ISO 800). In the 1080/24p mode it's only about ISO 400.

I haven't had it happen yet but if a client requested a "movie look" or 24p specifically I would shoot at 720/24p IF the ceremony and/or reception was indoors and low light. 720/24p is approximately ISO500, so you gain about a third of a stop of light in exchange for resolution. Keep in mind the base shutter speed for 24p is 1/48 so if you're shooting 1/60 at 1080/60i and 1/48 shutter at 720/24p your 720 setting's sensitivity is about ISO640 due to the extra shutter gain.
 
Actually cancelled my HPX170 two days ago just before shipping, I found a great deal on an EX-1. I'm sure I'll be as happy about my decision as you all are. :)
 
Arrik, what was your biggest reason for cancelling the HPX170 order - was it features and performance, money? I am interested in seeing the reports from new owners of the HPX170 since they have started shipping. Fun time to be buying a camera!
 
First off, I'd be happy with the 170. I know this. I'm just tired of noise, and while I know the HPX170 would've given me a cleaner image than my 200, the Sony can do that with some more resolution. Reading Adam's review, it was all music to my ears. However, these improvements and features seem to make it a smarter tool and improve its utility, not necessarily an improvement in image over the HVX200A. Again, I'm ready for more resolution. I almost always shoot with a 35 adapter, and the resolution will be warmly welcomed. Price difference has kept me in 170's camp, but since I've found a great used deal, price is no longer an issue.

Also, Beat Takeshi and I will receiving our RED in a week or so, and I think the EX-1 will compliment the RED as a b-camera more appropriately than an HPX170. I've heard alot of good things from others who've used it in this manner.

Lastly, we'll still have one HVX for those requests for pana cine gamma magic so I'm not completely leaving Panny camp. We'll have the best of both worlds. I feel very fortunate.
 
Congratulations on finding a great deal, and even more so on getting a RED. That was a distant consideration for me as well, not with a RED ONE, but with a Scarlet. I will definitely be getting a Scarlet, and I remember seeing some posts by Jim Arthurs comparing the EX1 and RED footage and felt that the look was very comparable. So when I get a Scarlet, I feel that the EX1 will make a good B camera match and fear that the HPX170 will look a little too soft to cut well. Good luck with your new RED! I can only imagine how excited you must be.
 
Congrats. You're going love the EX1.

One thing for sure, regardless of what cameras we own now, we ALL will own the Scarlet considering the $3K price.
 
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