What is the ACTUAL resolution of the HVX200a?

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Blackout

Blackout

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So a few days ago I walked into B&H in Manhattan to get my hands on the HVX200a but WOW was I steered away from it by several sales people. I told them I was a big fan of the DVX (I got one of the first releases of it and then dumped my XL1 into the garabage and neve rlooked back) and that now I was ready to move up into the HD world.

This is the gist of what I was told:

If you really want HD don't get the HVX200a because it's not really HD. 720p is pseudo HD and it's ok but just not real hd.

"But it shoots at 1920 x 1080 at 24p if you really want the highest quality right" was my response to which I was told yeah, it records in that format but it's basically a garbage data waster because it doesn't get anywhere near that resolution.

Is this true?

I was told it barely gets over 500 lines of resolution and that 'it was great when it came out but now there are 'real hd' cameras out and the hvx is considered outdated for real quality work and while the colors and saturation might be nice the resolution is just not there.

They kept hammering this point and really pushing the Sony EX1, the EX3 and the newer Canon XLH1S or A. I would think they were reps for Canon or Sony by how much they were steering me away fom the HVX.

I wanted to see them all on some high end HD screens but they were updating the whole camera section and didn't have any of them hooked up so that was rather dissapointing.

I really want variable frame rates so I think I am going to pass on the XLH1 and while I have seen some stunning images off the sonys and had a chance to play on the EX1 I am upset about some weirdness I notice on a bunch of shots like some sort of weird artifact where it looks like it's taking different parts of the picture at different times or compressing something badly. Perhaps this is because it's still HDV or the long gop issue but it looks weid is all I know when it happens. When it doesn't happen it's stunning. I haven't seen an HVX200a on a real HD monitor yet, only what i can find on the web.

ANYWAY - WHAT is the REAL resolution that the HVX200a chips produce? I can't find it anywhere. I find a lot of literature and promo gunk that says that the HVX200a has higher resolution chips than the reg hvx200 but then I find people saying that's bunk.

Why would the camera have the ability to record at 1920 x 1080 if it is not getting anywhere near that resolution? I don't get it.

Also if anyone has links to full resolution clips/movies/demo reels done with the HVX200a I would love to see them.

Thanks alot,

Blackout
 
WTF!
They were bullsh1tting you. I guess the Sonys are backing up and they are trying to get rid of them. You should go back in there and say you posted this on a public forum and named them and see what they say. I bet they start to back peddle fast.
 
Well I don't take sales people very seriously ever.

But.. umm..
cough..

Seriously what's the real resolution on the hvx200a?

I really don't hear of anyone shooting with it in 1920 x 1080 mode.
 
The actual resolution at the sensor level is 960x540 pixels on each of three (RGB) sensors, which are slightly offset from each other to improve luminance detail. In real-world tests this yields measurable resolution of about 540 lines vertical by 700 TVl/ph horizontal, or about the same as a good PAL SD camera. So the salespeople were right about that but could have have also told you that the HVX has a robust recording format with more bandwidth and more color depth than competing options, and a resulting "look" of recorded footage that many people like.

I'd suggest learning more about both the HVX200a and the Sony EX1 before making a buying decision, as there are advantages to each depending on your needs and preferences. I like the EX1 myself, but it's hard to argue with the success of the HVX cameras for some purposes.
 
just go on vimeo.com and check whatever you want to shoot. if you want to shoot music videos for example compare the EX1 & HVX music videos there. I personally never saw any music video or narrative shot with the EX1 that doesn't look videoish. but if you want to do documentary, weddings, etc. and need resolution and details EX1 is a winner. The HVX is a super DVX, it means that you can fill your HD screen with the dvx look, without pixelating etc. BUT you will not have the EX1 crisp look. I think the HVX "softness" and colors is what makes his film look. The EX1 is more the "discovery" HD.

It's just 2 different looks. Numbers will not change that fact.
 
Thanks for the responses guys. I have been doing a lot of research on all three cameras I have just never been able to find hard numbers on the HVX or see one actually hooked up to an hd monitor. I admit I really do prefer the look of videos on the web I have seen shot with the HVX but I am seeing it at low resolution over the net I don't know how it will hold up on real 1920 x 1080 large screens. I will be doing primarily narrative film making & then some commercial work so it is a little upsetting to know the resolution is so low (PAL SD??) why would they do that? Yeah I know the pixel shifting increases the light sensitivity but why have a 1920 x 1080 recording option if the chips are only resolving 700 x 500 in the real world? Does anyone actually use the HVX200a at it's highest recording setting or that really a useless endeavor as the salespeople were saying?

If the HVX had the same resolution as the EX1 this would be a no brainer as I agree that it looks like it has better colors and film like motion characteristics but damn I want the option of going out to film if it should so present itself and I will also be playing a few films on a very sweet high end 1920 x 1080 dlp projector and was hoping to shoot and project at that resolution to avoid any scaling whatsoever.

Just out of curiosity is there a Panasonic camera that actually does get real 1920 x 1080 resolution and shoot 24p? Does the varicam. Yeah I know might be out of my buget range (for now wink..) but I'm curious.

Again thanks for the responses.

- Michael Biggins - Blackout
 
We just shot a feature in 720p and were screening the dailies on a 50 inch 1080p plasma from the camera and it looked very good to all of us. I thought there would be some kind of artifact but it looked like we were watching a blu-ray dvd.


IMG_2139.jpg
 
The HVX200A output at 720p pr 1080p looks nothing whatsoever like SD, regardless of what anyone with his face buried in a spec-sheet tells you. It's an HD camera, period. Is it as sharp as an EX1? No. Is it vastly sharper than a DVX? Yes. Is it good enough to shoot a feature film on with no apologies necessary? Absolutely.
 
My approach seems to be mirrored by many others.

What does the footage look like.

If it looks good to me and my clients, then that's what I'm concerned with
 
The HVX resolves within a couple of hundred lines of 1920X1080

The chips are 960X540, but the chips are analog. Saying the camera isn't getting a 1080 image is like saying that you're audio guy is not sampling at 48khz 16 bit because of the microphone.

THE CAMERA BEGINS RECORDING FOR EVERY MODE IN 1080 AND DOWN CONVERTS TO EVERY OTHER MODE!

The only reasons to shoot 720 are for variable frame rate and storage space. It is not a NATIVE 720p camera, as it begins recording in 1080, it's just that most of the cool features are available in 720.

I was just DIT for a feature and we shot 1080 for the extra resolution because they are going to blow up to film eventually.

When the HVX first came out even 4 GB cards were scarce and then 8 GB cards came out and were scarce. At that time BARRY GREEN and the HVX BOOTCAMP bunch were proselytizing 720, 720, 720, saying it's within 10 or 15 % the resolution of the 1080 mode and all the cool frame rates are there and you can shoot true 24p with no pulldown.

Fast forward a year later and now the Bootcamp Dogma is 1080, 1080, 1080, shoot your variable frame rates in 720, they'll intercut fine, but the overall look of the film will be perceptibly sharper in 1080.

Why the switch? 2 things - 1, 8 gig and 16 gig are easy to find and there's even 32 gig card now, 2 - someone actuall tried it and it looked awesome.

There's a lot of misinformation out there about the camera and myths. The fact is that in 1080 you get all the image benefits you get in 720 and its sharper and there's no weird artifacting or interlacing or any of that other bull you hear - IF you know what you are doing. Some people shoot 108024p vs 24pA and then wonder why their footage is interlaced - ANSWER: Did not read or understand the manual or Barry's book or did not see or undertsand the BootCamp DVD's.

There are some cameras that are sharper. But not by much. P2/DVCpro HD are professional codecs with workflows that are widely supported, add variable frame rates and panasonics famous cine-like gamma curves and colors and many opt for the HVX over a couple of hundred lines of resolution.




 
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