HMC150 questions answered...

Barry_Green said:
You could always just zip the whole thing up and have it span across multiple DVDs. :engel017:
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NOOO!!!! Please don't do that! If you have an error or you lose a disc all your footage is gone forever! If you just split it up at worst you will only lose the footage from one disc and not all the spanned discs!

Also has anyone reviewed a PAL version of the HMC? I'm especially anxious to find out whether or not it will have a switchable mode. I NEED 60 for slowmo and I can only get 25/50 :(
 
"Choppy is normally a sign of PC issues. How much dedicated memory on the video card and also what card is it? Pinnacle particularily "likes" ATI cards and not friendly with Nvidia. When you step over to the Avid side of Pinnacle then the reverse typically holds true."

Wouldn't you know it, I have an Nvidia card and shared memory. I actually forgot about the shared memory.

Thanks
 
douchebro said:
NOOO!!!! Please don't do that! If you have an error or you lose a disc all your footage is gone forever! If you just split it up at worst you will only lose the footage from one disc and not all the spanned discs!

Also has anyone reviewed a PAL version of the HMC? I'm especially anxious to find out whether or not it will have a switchable mode. I NEED 60 for slowmo and I can only get 25/50 :(
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That is exactly my concern, thus the original question about file system, splitting files up, etc.... I, too hope that Panasonic remembers us Mac folk when they release the file management software.
 
i haven't played with the files a great deal but it seems to me that the .mts files are the only ones of importance.

so wouldn't you be able to just burn the .mts files and leave the rest? I was able to play the mts files in vlc just fine, so wouldn't there be a workaround to open these in your NLE?

what other info do the other files contain? would there be a way to rebuild these files if you lost them?
 
This whole file system thing is so 80's!!! imagine if you had to import a whole folder with all that other crap from your point and shoot before you opened all last nights party pics to put on facebook!!! who thinks up this crap. More forward designers not backwards, we might as well send our sd cards off to get developed at the film lab!!!
 
Here is a good video with Semir Nouri, Product Manager, JVC Europe extolling the virtues of 720p50. While our beloved HMC150 shoots 720p60, his insightful comments still apply.

Of course he is praising the new JVC camera so just substitute "HMC150" wherever "HD200B" is mentioned :Drogar-Love(DBG):

Actually that new JVC camera looks to be very good too!

-DS
 
shrigg said:
Here is a good video with Semir Nouri, Product Manager, JVC Europe extolling the virtues of 720p50. While our beloved HMC150 shoots 720p60, his insightful comments still apply.

Of course he is praising the new JVC camera so just substitute "HMC150" wherever "HD200B" is mentioned :Drogar-Love(DBG):

Actually that new JVC camera looks to be very good too!

-DS
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He makes a good point about low cost non proprietary media like SDHC is the future.
 
Bucknfl said:
He makes a good point about low cost non proprietary media like SDHC is the future.
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I really enjoyed his perspective. Although perhaps not as high quality, I think HDV on SDHC is a still great approach. The FCP editing workflow is already in place, unlike AVCHD's not-quite-there-yet native editing
 
so, if we're not speaking about the price, but just about the film look it can make, which one seems better? hmc150 or hpx170? are the colors identical out of the cam? will dvcprohd still handle color correction a lot better?
 
Aaargh! 30p always "over 60p" or "over 60i" rather than native (like 24p)? Why?
Will slick interframe compression make this a non-issue?
 
ullanta said:
Aaargh! 30p always "over 60p" or "over 60i" rather than native (like 24p)? Why?
Will slick interframe compression make this a non-issue?
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I'm not sure what they mean by "720/30p (over 60p)" Wouldn't that just be frame doubling?

I echo your concerns though. From Barry's experiences I was under the impression all the frame rates were native... Maybe it is necessary for the AVC codec to wrap certain frame rates into 60i/60p streams (kind of like the HV20's HDV)
 
Barry_Green said:
The core image is basically the same. The operation is basically the same. There are lots of features the 200A/170 have that the 150 doesn't (like standard-def, or time lapse, or variable frame rates, things like that.

To a lot of folks, that'll matter. But I think a whole lot more people will look at the $3495 street price, and the dirt-cheap memory recording times, and say "that's all I need."

AVC-HD right now is a lot more work than P2 is to work with in post. For broadcasters and people making their living with the camera (other than longform event shooters), it's HPX170 all the way. For indie guys who can't afford $900 for a P2 card and $5200 for the camera, and who have more time than money so transcoding in post is no hassle to them, well then: the HMC150 comes about 80% of the HVX200 for thousands less. And it looks like it'd make an excellent "B" camera to a 170 as well.

Let me put it this way: when Panasonic put out the DVX, they also put out a lower-cost DVC80 which had the same imaging chips, same lens, same body, they just took out a few features to lower the price -- they took out 24p and cinegamma! Totally wrong move, and the DVC80 flopped. Well, with the 150 they took the 170 and took out a few features to lower the price. I'd say that probably 90% of our DVXUser members are going to be thrilled with what they left in, and won't miss what was taken out.
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I'm guessing the 150 would cut nicely with a 170.
 
Sorry to ask, but this thread has gotten too long for me to keep looking.

1) What does a guy have to do to be able to look at these clips on a PC?

2) Does the Panasonic "mojo" look get passed on to the HMC150? I was a little concerned that a little of that special look might be lost using a 4:2:0 codec with half the color information.

Thanks!
 
Quick answer is that Edius on the PC seems to edit it best, FCP on the Mac requires transcoding to ProRes which takes time similar to capturing from tape. I personally think it will be much nicer than working with tape, I hate logging and batch cpturing and time code breaks etc......

The "look" compares very favorably to the HVX200, in fact it is an identical picture to the improved HVX200a. The HVX's 4:2:2 is a marked improvement for compositing and color correcting, so if you do a lot of that then perhps the HVX or even the new HPX170 would be preferred.

Hope this helps... You really owe to yourself to read the entire thread if you are seriously considering an HMC150. In the thread you will find links to actual footage shot that you can download and assess yourself on your system. Worth the effort!
 
Thanks Shrigg. I have read almost all of the thread and have been following all of the HPX170, HMC150, and EX1 clips for months. I guess I was hoping that there was a way to view the clips in something like VLC or WMP but I can't seem to find a .mts player that will work. I just want a chance to get to view the clips that Barry has posted to make an assessment of the footage. I edit with Vegas Pro 8, and so far it is unable to handle the .mts files. Is there a solution that has been found so I can just view the files without Edius on a PC? Thanks.
 
Oh I see what you mean. Actually YES the clips will play in VLC, at least they do for me on Mac....
Someone else will have to advise you on a PC appl that'll do it
 
TheMusician said:
Thanks Shrigg. I have read almost all of the thread and have been following all of the HPX170, HMC150, and EX1 clips for months. I guess I was hoping that there was a way to view the clips in something like VLC or WMP but I can't seem to find a .mts player that will work. I just want a chance to get to view the clips that Barry has posted to make an assessment of the footage. I edit with Vegas Pro 8, and so far it is unable to handle the .mts files. Is there a solution that has been found so I can just view the files without Edius on a PC? Thanks.
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I have the k-lite code pack ( http://www.free-codecs.com/download/k_lite_Mega_Codec_Pack.htm) installed with all codecs enabled, and I am able to view the .mts files through media player classic (it can install with the codec pack). WMP11 will play the .mts files once you rename the file extension to .mt2s (this may be dependent on the full codec install, not sure). The KMplayer will also play the renamed files as well (uses internal codecs, so should be able to install it without the codec pack, although it's a kickass codec pack, let's you watch almost everything). The files play on my desktop and laptop (both C2D). Hope this helps.
 
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shrigg said:
Definitely HPX170. DVCProHD's 4:2:2 vs. AVCHD's 4:2:0 makes it much more solid
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I have to disagree. Even though DVCProHD uses 4:2:2 color subsampling providing twice as much color information for each frame (compared to AVCHD) the typical color correction tasks will not benefit from this at all (unlike other kind of processing like applying diffusion and other types of filters, chroma keying etc).
Plain color correction alter the color of the pixel without taking into account its neighbours. So it's only the dynamic range (bit depth) that really matters. Both DVCProHD and AVCHD have 8bit color. 10bits would be soooo nice...
That's one of the reasons it's very important to carefully set the white balance and camera settings to get the right color out of the camera (before the color information is truncated to 8bits) instead of adjusting it in post.
 
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