The end of 35mm adapers and hv20s....

Could the Admin please add a Nikon camera forum? I think you'll already have several users that will be posting regulary, about 5,000 readers, and about 50 readers posting questions.

This thread is way out of hand. When you move it, you might want to get some extra help clicking that button. You don't want to hurt your back. :)
 
Anhar Miah said:
Thank you for PM and the references:

On page 229 I stated:


This is the fundamental reason why I am saying that these correction algorithms will not be able to fully correct.

Now I understand the principle of how the correction works either using sensors to ascertain the motion of the camera OR using post image analysis to calculate the camera motion (and local object motions in relation to the camera), and then using this information to apply the correction.

However, as the camera pans, we know that scene skews, this skew can be corrected as described above, however the parts of scene which are outside of the image (due to the skew) can not be corrected , simply because that information is not captured. This would not happen on a global shutter.

That was my concern when I said it was not “adequate”, I hope that is a little clearer.

I’m sorry if I sounded like I was “ranting”.
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Guys,if is not much to ask.Please continue this subject on PM as suggested.Thread is way to long and we have way to many fatigued members looking for D90 answers.

Thanks for your consideration!!!
 
Car3o said:
You newbies just coming to the thread are just gonna have to suck it up and read.
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I've read it from the beginning, and been here since page twenty watching the revolution unfold, buddy.

It's pretty obvious at this point from the testing and samples posted, indie film makers will be buying the D90 in droves for various purposes in the production process.

From the intense response, it seems that Nikon has earned a place under the Canon cameras forum labled Nikon camera(s) or "The new Guys" forum. ...........or they could just leave it under "35mm adapters". That would work just as well I guess.
 
My D90 is looking better today, day 2. I hooked it up to a monitor and was very surprised at how good the image looked. Noise seems to be geting better. I have no idea if it really worked but there are two Noise Reduction settings there that I set. I don't have the camera on now to remember exactly where they are, the battery is charging yet again, but i'll post it later.
I set the color space to Adobe RGB and Picture setting to Standard and the image looks good to me. If only the wobbling wasn't there. Well, I am actually getting better at steading the hand held shots. On the tripod the image is as solid as it gets. The stills are amazing.
 
From the NIKON BROCHURE

Innovative D-SLR movie function: D-Movie
The D90's new movie function allow users to shoot 320x216 pixels, 640x424 pixels or HD720p *1,280x 720 pixels) movies at the professional smoothness of 24 frames per second in motion JPEG format. The D90's sensor, which is larger than the sensor of the typical camcorder, ensures higher image quality and exceptional low-noise nand high ISO sensitivity performance even during movie shooting. Capturing creative movie clips or the drama of life's moments is further enhanced by the wide selection of sharp NIKKOR interchangeable lenses, from fisheye to wide-angle to super-telephoto. Micro NIKKOR lenses bring the magic of extreme cloe-up imagery to movie making. Note: Autofocus and some other functions are not avaiable when recording movies.


I don't know why I'm posting this but it's nice to read and then revert in my mind back to the time when I wasn't aware of median, jello, and other issues.

Still buying one though!!!

John, nice to see you switching to a mellower curve and feeling the results, very exciting news.
 
Note: Autofocus and some other functions are not avaiable when recording movies.
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How brochure-like. Well, they sure weren't lying. :D

bearing: Long time no post for me now. I'm still very interested in what you can find out using your trick. As soon as I get a D90 I will ask you for the PAL file and do some testing, but then again, I have a feeling you will get a hold of one before I do.
 
John Caballero said:
My D90 is looking better today, day 2. I hooked it up to a monitor and was very surprised at how good the image looked. Noise seems to be geting better. I have no idea if it really worked but there are two Noise Reduction settings there that I set. I don't have the camera on now to remember exactly where they are, the battery is charging yet again, but i'll post it later.
I set the color space to Adobe RGB and Picture setting to Standard and the image looks good to me. If only the wobbling wasn't there. Well, I am actually getting better at steading the hand held shots. On the tripod the image is as solid as it gets. The stills are amazing.
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Adobe RGB space has too much banding for my tastes. Does it look okay to you?

Noise Reduction -- I realized that I had High ISO NR on and yesterday I saw some ghosting in my image. NR has been turned off for me. For still shots it should be okay.

Glad that you now have it and you can see what I've been doing and why I've been ploddin' away with settings and figuring this thing out.
 
Reading this thread has become my full-time job. The pay s*cks, btw.

Here is the 8 million dollar question: who bests this--Nikon or Canon or other DSLR?

I figure if Nikon comes out with the next revision, I'd already be working on buying some decent glass and really the body will end up being the cheapest part (relatively speaking). However, if it is Canon I'd be ticked that I choose the wrong brand. Make sense?

I have a Blackmagic card just dying to try the HDMI out on the D90, too!
 
kevm14 said:
The fact is, the same lens will vignette worse on FX digital than 35mm film, and that is the problem I was talking about. In general, today's lenses on FX wide open produce substantially more vignetting than DX lenses on DX do wide open.
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This is not really true in the general case. The FX sensor can increase vignetting when wide angle lenses are used. This is caused by the finite angle of acceptance of the microlenses. There is no other possible physical reason why additional vignetting, would occur on FX cameras relative to 35mm film. And my practical experience, with 17 lenses tested on D3, supports this conclusion; that only really truly wide angles are affected. Most other lenses display far superior image quality than they do on 35mm color film.

Lenses designed for DX but not designated so such as the DX-era 105 mm VR and the 70-200/2.8 VR do have unpleasant vignetting wide open but at least the 70-200 did that on 35mm film too (most people don't see it because they use slide mounts or printing systems that crop the edges, and conveniently ignore this), but so does the FX-optimized 24-70 at 24mm if you do not use Nikon's software for raw conversion which reportedly fixes this problem to some extent (or so Nikon says). Of the 15 other lenses I use on the D3, the 25mm Zeiss has some vignetting wide open. None of my longer lenses (28mm and up) show bothersome vignetting at any aperture, apart from the two DX-optimized pseudo-FX lenses mentioned.

I find it ironic to see this kind of comments ... I think they originate from Nikon's own 35mm-bashing PR in which they claimed that 35mm sized digital sensors have all of these problems, yet suddenly miraculously they produce a camera which in further testing doesn't have these problems, with the exeption of a handful of odd lenses. Some of them popular, yes, but still odd exceptions rather than the rule. Get some old primes and you'll be happy.
 
Kohli, so far is looking ok but i am still testing away. The noise seems to be much better since I did the NR settings. I don't know about the ghosting. I wonder if there was a way to save a complete set of settings you put together in a single file to memory card like you do with the HVX?
There are so many settings in the D90 that may or may not really affect the image is going to take a lot of testing. A good thing would be that once somebody think a group of settings is working to post it for the others to try out and provide feedback.
 
This whole thing is a very interesting development, and I have read MANY pages of this thread. If Nikon is next (D100?) and fixes the most glaring issues:

1. Kill the Jello™ (Add global shutter or at least a faster scan rate.)
2. FULL manual controls, no limitations whatsoever. Set the ISO and it STAYS. Set the exposure and it STAYS. Set the aperture and it STAYS.
3. Higher res output? Why not 1920x1080 or higher? They're down-sampling anyway, maybe a dual SD card setup, raid/striped, etc.?

If this takes off, then Canon et all will have no choice but to dive in and cannibalize the rest of their lines just to compete. RED will soon be DED, although they may be ultimately responsible for this development happening in our lifetimes, and certainly the 35mm adapter builders will have to find a new line of work. It's too bad, because I LOVE my Brevis and Minolta glass, but I would use this MORE, you know?

I have canon bodies and lenses, and so I would love to see them throw their hat into the ring, but with so many other divisions in direct conflict, I don't see it happening soon enough for me.

BTW, what's the largest CCD commercially available? Surely there would be a way for someone to come up with an APS-C sized CCD block to compete with this, and eliminate the jello-vision.

Anyway, thanks to Kholi and all you other pioneers for taking all those arrows in your back for the rest of us.


[EDIT] Any possibility of some brilliant engineer coming up with a Digital Signal Processor (DSP) in concert with motion accelerometers to eliminating the Jello effect before it's recorded? Not in this version, obviously, but somebody's got to be working on it - the effect just screams "cell phone" video...
 
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