Has anyone tested a SD lens on the HPX500?

http://www.flickr.com/photos/23608333@N03/?saved=1
Photo at this site
Lens Canon IF J15x8B4 IRS
HPX2000

1203013523.jpg




Video at this site
http://www.vimeo.com/686230


Mule Ferguson
 
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You know what would be very helpful is a list of lenses with prices and how they perform as based on user experience. I am very interested in this thread, getting a cheaper high quality SD lens over an expensive sub par HD lens is what i'm in to!
 
NorthernFilmMaker said:
You know what would be very helpful is a list of lenses with prices and how they perform as based on user experience. I am very interested in this thread, getting a cheaper high quality SD lens over an expensive sub par HD lens is what i'm in to!
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And that's exactly what we're talking about here.

So check this out - I don't have time to post any screen grabs tonight - I will do so hopefully this weekend, but here's a quick picture of the lenses we are using:

IMG_5678.jpg



I purchased these lenses on Ebay for $125 Each and they work perfectly. They are Canon J15x9.5B4 KRS SD lenses. They're pretty old, but they function perfectly (I had to change the connector on the lens from a 6 pin to a 12 pin, which cost me $32 each, if you have questions on how to do this, let me know). The images coming from these look wonderful and I will post as soon as I have time (gotta get the grabs and footage from the office). This just goes to show that you can find some great deals on some nice used lenses and not spend a small fortune doing it. SD lenses are only going to get cheaper and easier to come by too.
 
That's awesome Kit, I've done a bit of looking around on ebay and different online stores... which lenses would be the best choices? I've noticed alot of different lettering on the model types.... i read an earlier post that said, Canon YJ...Fuji A models were a good choice? any other types I could keep an eye out for? Thanks Kit.... much appreciated :thumbsup:


I'd be very interested to know how the Canon YJ13x6 BIRS w/ 2x would perform, that looks like one nice lens..... its about 8600, which is about the cost of the Fuji 17x HD lens w/2x extender.... the Canon would definitely take care of the wide angle and the telephoto, all in one lens
 
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NorthernFilmMaker said:
That's awesome Kit, I've done a bit of looking around on ebay and different online stores... which lenses would be the best choices? I've noticed alot of different lettering on the model types.... i read an earlier post that said, Canon YJ...Fuji A models were a good choice? any other types I could keep an eye out for? Thanks Kit.... much appreciated :thumbsup:


I'd be very interested to know how the Canon YJ13x6 BIRS w/ 2x would perform, that looks like one nice lens..... its about 8600, which is about the cost of the Fuji 17x HD lens w/2x extender.... the Canon would definitely take care of the wide angle and the telephoto, all in one lens
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Not YJ - I don't know how those would work as they are not Canon's top of the line lens.


They need to be either Canon "J" series or Fujinon "A" series. Both of these are their top of the line lenses. The YJ series is a midgrade model, so the optics on those lenses are going to be inferior.

You can get some really nice Fujinon wide angle lenses in the $2000 - $5000. I know Hunter has used a couple of the wide angles with great success.

And there should be no need to spend $8600 on most lenses. Here are some links to a few lenses that would be nice:

http://cgi.ebay.com/Fujinon-A18x7-6...oryZ3319QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

http://cgi.ebay.com/Fujinon-A17x9BD...ryZ21165QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

http://cgi.ebay.com/Fujinon-A17x7-8...ryZ21165QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

http://cgi.ebay.com/Canon-J8x6b-Bro...oryZ3319QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

There's lots of deals to be had out there, you just have to watch. The last lens is the one Hunter is selling I think... the "J8x6"

Kit
 
I have an old Fujinon A12X10BRM-88 1.7 10-120mm
2/3 format, sony mount, manual focus,servo zoom
will this work on the HPX?
 
1203100652.jpg

1203100630.jpg


The kit Fujinon lens on an HPX500 and the SD Canon lens off of my DSR-500.

Thanks to Emmanuel (screen name "emmanetim") from RHED Pixel for the help in this test.

I'll be selling the DSR500, but I think I'll KEEP the lens!
 
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Okay, here's some perspective from the manufacturer's side. Canon has written up many white papers on HDTV lens design and usage, many of which are available for download off Abel CineTech's website here:
http://www.abelcine.com/articles/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=43&Itemid=45

I would advise those planning on skipping HD lenses to look at maybe this paper: SDTV Lens on HDTV Camera: To Be or Not To Be?

Note, I'm not telling anyone to use, or not use, any particular lens. Furthermore I'd say the mere idea of classifying lenses collectively does a great disservice to the better lenses; there's a reason that certain lenses cost $80,000 and a JVC HD100's "HD" lens is $800. So: read up for yourself, test them yourself, and make your own determination. Just because an SD lens may work out in some circumstances, it may not work out in all, etc; you'd better be properly informed beforehand. And it's also possible that a great SD lens might outperform a lousy HD lens too... there is no one simple answer. Do your homework.
 
The SD lens looks better to my eyes!


Barry, Thanks for posting ( I have very high-respect for you so don't take this the wrong way).

I have read those documents before. But in application, do these white papers mean anything? These documents are for the engineers (or the engineer at heart) at networks and production companies, they see "Oh, these charts show that HD lenses have more resolution and flatter MTF, thats worth the extra money". And maybe thats true to a point.

This thread I think has turned into more of a help thread for potential hpx500 buyers. They get to see that on the hpx500 (and hpx2000), there is little or no visual difference in quality with HD lenses and Broadcast (J or A series) SD lenses. This is good news for the indie filmmaker/DP or small production company looking growing their business/production value/cleintel with full-size HD cameras on a budget. (Like Kit and I)

What I have found with SD lenses is that the coatings permit more unwanted flair.(In some cases) This is probably because of less advanced coatings and possibly fewer special elements. However, there is always flair unless your shooting with extremly high-end glass. I have used now on my hpx500 4 broadcast SD lenses, and 3 HD lenses (2 of them were very high-end). I shot my film "goodSAM" with an older Canon SD j8x6 in 1080/24pA mode. I watched it on a 1080p monitor and it looked like film! I wouldnt use an SD lens for a filmout (I wouldnt use any ENG for a film-out anyways for that matter)

But every tool has its place and most of the time, My SD lenses have their place on my camera for 99% of my business work.And my clients dont care, they see the final image and the last thing on their mind is...you shot this with an SD lens?
 
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Barry_Green said:
Okay, here's some perspective from the manufacturer's side. Canon has written up many white papers on HDTV lens design and usage, many of which are available for download off Abel CineTech's website here:
http://www.abelcine.com/articles/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=43&Itemid=45

I would advise those planning on skipping HD lenses to look at maybe this paper: SDTV Lens on HDTV Camera: To Be or Not To Be?

Note, I'm not telling anyone to use, or not use, any particular lens. Furthermore I'd say the mere idea of classifying lenses collectively does a great disservice to the better lenses; there's a reason that certain lenses cost $80,000 and a JVC HD100's "HD" lens is $800. So: read up for yourself, test them yourself, and make your own determination. Just because an SD lens may work out in some circumstances, it may not work out in all, etc; you'd better be properly informed beforehand. And it's also possible that a great SD lens might outperform a lousy HD lens too... there is no one simple answer. Do your homework.
Click to expand...


So, will an SD lens on an HD Camera cause physical Harm to the camera in any way? if not then i wouldn't hesitate on using a good SD lens if it saves me thousands of dollars!
 
NorthernFilmMaker said:
So, will an SD lens on an HD Camera cause physical Harm to the camera in any way?
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No, definitely not -- as long as it's the same mount it should be fine physically.

if not then i wouldn't hesitate on using a good SD lens if it saves me thousands of dollars!
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Yeah, there's just that old saying of "you get what you pay for" that keeps ringing in my ears. I find it hard to believe that companies like Canon and Fujinon would "get away" with selling lenses for $80,000 that don't have any real-world performance difference from a $3,000 lens, y'know?

There's got to be reasons. The question for you is: do you care? If you get what you want out of the $3,000 lens, then by all means, go ahead.
 
Barry_Green said:
No, definitely not -- as long as it's the same mount it should be fine physically.


Yeah, there's just that old saying of "you get what you pay for" that keeps ringing in my ears. I find it hard to believe that companies like Canon and Fujinon would "get away" with selling lenses for $80,000 that don't have any real-world performance difference from a $3,000 lens, y'know?

There's got to be reasons. The question for you is: do you care? If you get what you want out of the $3,000 lens, then by all means, go ahead.
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Cheers Barry, :beer:
 
hey mule...you said that your hpx2000 isnt making you any money now because business is slow...want to trade cameras for a while? My hpx500 for your 2000...

Have you thought about putting the avc-intra board in? Its really easy to do.

10-bit fullraster 1080p!
 
The AVC Intra Board is on its way. and I will be installing ,. If I have ? I will give you a ring. Thanks for the offer but I welcome slow time. I'm not as young as some of you young film makers :) :Drogar-BigGrin(DBG) 3 projects starting next week.

Mule
 
Hey all,

Well, finally, here are some quick screen grabs from outside of my place using the HPX500 and a Canon J15.95B4 KRS lens (I changed the 6 pin to a 12 pin on the lens). These were shot at 1080 24p & 30p, No menu corrections, nothing done to the picture, just exported.

Although it doesn't look terrible, and some of it is cause by the jpeg compression, but I would like to see if I can get some of that noise out of there. Lemme know what you think.

Click on the picture for a full 1920 x 1080 shot.



 
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