major questions before I film my show.

S

Saiaf

Active member
I've searched around a lot here but the problem is you guys talk like wise guys, your sentences full of numbers and lens mm lengths that I have trouble keeping up. I get credit for the way I direct things and my writing, but I'm obviously not doing it the right way if I'm gonna do this professionally. I own a DVX100b, an Octava microphone and my partner owns a sennheiser (insert number and letter) which cost him about $1,800. So we have some kick ass equipment, and thankfully I work hard so I got some good cash. You know how I stand now, so these are the questions...

1. The REDROCK M2 allows me to attatch film lens to it, but I dont know what I want...Nikon or Canon, or the other stuff. Any prefrences? Please dont give me "its your choice", just tell me what YOU like. You guys know enough sh!t to make better movies then the stuff we see out there today.

2. These lens numbers f/2.8 f/24.5 what is this exactly? What do I need for a CLOSE UP and a ZOOM. If you can just tell me "buy this for this much, you can't go wrong" I'll do it. I like those kind of answers.

3. These films, in order to be films do they have to be shot and transferred directly to laptop, I hear no from all of you guys, and that shooting on DV is fine. True? That quality is same.

4. External monitors that you guys can give me names of? I got one from ebay but can't even use it, I believe it was a rip off. An external monitor that can sit right there on my dvx so I can see what I'm shooting rather then to have to look at that small lcd.

I know these are completely amatuer questions, but I've read so much here and these are the things you guys talk about with the assumption that everyone knows what they mean. Sorry that I don't know this stuff, I'm always writing or working with actors, knowing nothing of technical stuff. Appreciate all the help you afficianado's can give.
 
I'll chime in on 1-3. I have no experience with external monitors.

1. I just happen to be a Canon fanboy. I own Canon dSLR equipment and lenses, so I'd definitely end up getting a Canon adaptor for my A1, if someone here managed to convince me to get one at all at this point.

2. The f/2.8 is the aperture level of the lens. f/5.6 is a narrower aperture, whereas f/2.0 gets a little wide. First, if it's narrower, obviously, less light gets through in the exposure. Wider, more light. If you have it too narrow, grouped with a fast shutter speed and low gain, then you'll obviously see that it's too dark.

Second, the narrower the aperture (f/8 for example) then the more depth of field you have. So, to say, if you focus on Joe Smith who stands 5 feet in front of the camera, then Billy Valentine, standing 5 feet behind him, would be less blurry than if you were using a wide aperture (f/2.0 for example). Using the wide aperture is a popular technique in filming, as it creates a wonderful blur on everything but the subject, directing the eye of the viewer to what you want.

You didn't mention the mm in lens numbers. It's fairly simple so I'll chime in about that even if you know. If a lens is 28mm-135mm, 28mm is it's widest shooting angle, and 135mm is it's more telescopic. As I figure, 50mm is close to 'real life perception'. As to say, shooting at 50mm will not make any items appear any smaller or bigger than it would with the naked eye. So, a lens that goes to 135mm will appear at least twice as large, to say. Wide, at 28 mm, it would be successful in showing a wider picture. Some lenses don't adjust, they're just a 50mm lens and doesn't move.

When shooting at the widest angle, though, sometimes you could get barrel distortion, which looks like the tops and bottoms of the picture are leaning inwards. Similar pincushion distortion could happen at the longest zoom.

Also, when zooming from 50mm with f/2 to 100mm will narrow your aperture from f/2 to something like f/5. So, less light gets in. Though, when you zoom in a lot, your depth of field blur can increase. Keep that in mind, general technique.

So, an f/2 to f/8 18mm-55mm lens doesn't offer as much control as a f/2.5 to f/16 28mm-200mm lens, but it does give you a wide aperture option which will help in low light or using high shutter speeds, increasing depth of field blur, and the 18mm lens would be wider, which could be handy for indoor shooting in smaller areas, or just getting more of the picture.

Unfortunately, these numbers don't directly correlate to how good the lens is, just what you can do with them. A bad lens could have dark edges (vignetting), chromatic aberrations (crumby color things), low detail, etc. Go by recommendations and reviews.

3. I have overly satisfying results recording to DV. It's not always convenient for me to record directly to laptop, and I haven't had unsuccessful attempts just capturing from the DV tape.

Allow anyone to correct me if I'm wrong on anything, and add what I missed or am ignorant of. Let me know if something I said doesn't make any sense or if you have another question.
 
Bro I appreciate that greatly if anyone else wants to jump in that'd be awesome. Like perhaps on the lens I should buy, a more preffered type, etc.
 
Saiaf said:
Bro I appreciate that greatly if anyone else wants to jump in that'd be awesome. Like perhaps on the lens I should buy, a more preffered type, etc.
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Wish I could be of more help on making some picks. I couldn't really explain why I went with Canon.

For close ups, you probably want to think zoom. Zooming in on your subject rather than trying to get a foot in front of it is usually easier. This will also give you the depth of field blur that's always nice.
 
Saiaf said:
1. The REDROCK M2 allows me to attatch film lens to it, but I dont know what I want...Nikon or Canon, or the other stuff. Any prefrences? Please dont give me "its your choice", just tell me what YOU like. You guys know enough sh!t to make better movies then the stuff we see out there today.
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First, the adapter. I think there are better adapters than the M2. I personally think the Cinevate Brevis and SGPro are better options. The SGPro produces beautiful, shallow images with edge to edge sharpness. The Brevis loses less light than any of the current adapters on the market, looks like a part of the camera, and it's modular. I chose the Brevis. Another option is the Letus Flip Enhanced, perhaps most importantly because any of the adapters you buy flip the image upside down and the Letus is the only adapter on the market at the moment that flips it rightside up. Cinevate is working on a flip module that should be out within the next couple months or so. *ahem*

2. These lens numbers f/2.8 f/24.5 what is this exactly? What do I need for a CLOSE UP and a ZOOM. If you can just tell me "buy this for this much, you can't go wrong" I'll do it. I like those kind of answers.
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I don't mean to sound like a jerk, but if you have these sorts of questions, you should either take a basic photography class or buy a photography book. Start with shooting 35mm stills and work your way toward digital. It will give you a lot of the principles necessary to understanding photographic technology. Video is a completely different bag of tricks, but if you intend to enter the 35mm adapter world, learning photography will be essential, even if you're a "just a director."

If you're not familiar with aperture, then you shouldn't look for help on a thread on a geek site like this one. You should buy a good photography book or enroll in a photography class. You'll love it.

P.S. - I prefer Nikon lenses.

3. These films, in order to be films do they have to be shot and transferred directly to laptop, I hear no from all of you guys, and that shooting on DV is fine. True? That quality is same.
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I'm not even sure what you mean, but are you still shooting with the DVX100b? If so, just out of curiosity, why'd you post your questions to the A1/G1 forum?

4. External monitors that you guys can give me names of? I got one from ebay but can't even use it, I believe it was a rip off. An external monitor that can sit right there on my dvx so I can see what I'm shooting rather then to have to look at that small lcd.
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This is a topic you'll want to extensively research. The current trend, from my perspective and level of knowledge, is that you get what you pay for. Marshall makes the most expensive, but probably the nicest external monitor you can buy. At $1900 for the kit from B&H, it's also worth more money than your camera, so unless you're using a 35mm adapter and want to use the video tap (monitor) to flip your image by mounting it upside down, this might not be essential to your production.

I know these are completely amatuer questions, but I've read so much here and these are the things you guys talk about with the assumption that everyone knows what they mean. Sorry that I don't know this stuff, I'm always writing or working with actors, knowing nothing of technical stuff. Appreciate all the help you afficianado's can give.
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I personally think the more you know technically, the better you'll be as a writer or director. This is a collaborative, synthetic discipline and if a director understands the nuances of all the various aspects of filmmaking, his or her DP will like him more, his or her editor will like him more, and ultimately he'll be a much better director. It's perfectly normal to strongly prefer one discipline of film, but you shouldn't dismiss or undermine the necessity of learning other aspects.

Then again, I'm one of the rare advocates of attending a "good" film school.
 
Oh that's excellent, those are some great suggestions. I actually posted the questions on this forum and a dvx forum to get the most out of it. Your right, I do need to learn about the whole field so that the editors and DP's can appreciate me, that REALLY is why I'm asking these amatuer questions. I wish I could take a class but I never find time, I'm always working lol makin money. So now you are suggesting BREVIS or SGPRO? You bought the Brevis, do you have regrets or perhaps....would you have rather gone the other way? And why is it that you prefer Nikon if you don't mind me asking??? What makes Nikon preferable, do you have an argument that can convince me? You have already convinced me not to go with Redrock M2 because the others are so much better. Appreciate your help.
 
It really is a user's preference which 35mm adapter they referred. Mirezzi said that the M2 isn't as good, but ask somewhere else and you'll get a completely different answer. The best way to make a decision is to educate yourself in the strength and weaknesses of each adapter by visiting the manufacturer's sites, look a the footage and decide which you like best.

As to the lenses, same thing. It's best to do your own research and learn the concepts before going out in the field. To start with, get a basic set of prime lense (fixed focal length). A 50mm 1.8, 28mm 2.8 and 135mm 2.8 would serve you well in most conditions and you can get them fairly cheap for about $50 each.

And BTW, you shouldn't post cross-post.
 
"And Btw you shouldn't post cross-post"

I don't even know what to say to that. Am I pissing someone off? Is it slowing the servers down, have I talked too much?
 
Saiaf said:
"And Btw you shouldn't post cross-post"

I don't even know what to say to that. Am I pissing someone off? Is it slowing the servers down, have I talked too much?
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Don't take it too harshly, it's simple forum etiquette. Posting in multiple places at once split the responses and increase the signal to noise ratio. Pick the right forum and post once.
 
... besides, it's a violation of the terms of service you agreed to when you joined the forum. Cross-posting splits up conversations, makes the search function less efficient, and is officially discouraged on just about every forum in existence.

Please pick the one forum where your subject is most applicable. Posting in multiple forums will just annoy the moderators and the users, and get your duplicated threads deleted.
 
Apologies, besides lol no one reads terms and agreements for anything...ever...at anytime, anywhere. Won't do it again :)
 
1. The REDROCK M2 allows me to attatch film lens to it, but I dont know what I want...Nikon or Canon, or the other stuff. Any prefrences? Please dont give me "its your choice", just tell me what YOU like. You guys know enough sh!t to make better movies then the stuff we see out there today.

I like Canon FD lenses. High quality can be hard to find - inspect your lenses whatever you choose and first of all get some info so you know how to pick a good lens and a bad one. Great quality can be a bit more expensive.

If you choose the Canon FD mount - make sure you have one of the S.S.C lenses. There are two types that do. The first is the original S.S.C. lens which actually has S.S.C. marked on it - fairly easy to identify. The second lens with S.S.C. are the Canon NEW FD lenses - these are also pretty easy to identify as when you attach it to the 35mm adapter or still camera you need to twist the entire lens to lock it in position.


2. These lens numbers f/2.8 f/24.5 what is this exactly? What do I need for a CLOSE UP and a ZOOM. If you can just tell me "buy this for this much, you can't go wrong" I'll do it. I like those kind of answers.

As already mentioned this number represents the widest aperture size. In laymens terms a number say f1.4 will give you a shallower depth of field and also enable more light in - the "light in" can be a factor in budget productions with limited light sources. Most people Are getting best results using low aperture lenses - f1.4 or the like and setting the lense apertures to around f2.8 for a sharper image.

From the Canon FDs Im going to recommend the following as a starters prime package: (wide angle)35mm - f2 / (normal)50mm - f1.4 / (telephoto)85mm - f1.8

3. These films, in order to be films do they have to be shot and transferred directly to laptop, I hear no from all of you guys, and that shooting on DV is fine. True? That quality is same.

I'd say to you that shooting HDV to tape will be fine.

4. External monitors that you guys can give me names of? I got one from ebay but can't even use it, I believe it was a rip off. An external monitor that can sit right there on my dvx so I can see what I'm shooting rather then to have to look at that small lcd.

Some names for you to check out, Ikan, Varizoom, Marshall.
 
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Akh, awesome information, all of this is being put to use. I really feel like an amatuer because all of you guys talk in this language and I never understand what it is you guys are saying. But now I do, I'm still curious about a few terms but other then that I feel like I'm catching up.
 
I'll chime in a bit here, since my opinions vary a bit from others. So you get the most out of my perspective, I am a director who has also worked (albeit briefly) as a professional photographer, DP, and VFX artist. Even though I know pretty well how to do these things, I much prefer to have a dedicated DP on board to handle those aspects specifically, so that I can concentrate on exactly those more "artistic" aspects that you've mentioned.

First of all, the adapter. I am an M2 owner, and fairly happy with the unit overall. I've seen footage and have to admit that it's not as sharp as the SGPro, but I don't regret the purchase at all (a year ago). If I was buying today, I don't know. My point is I don't think any of these units blows the others away. Redrock is good in terms of supporting their customers.

I think if you have no interest in taking up actual still photography, Nikon lenses are a better choice. They are more plentiful on the used market, and easier to operate. Glass quality and price are basically the same, so unless you had a lot of Canon lenses sitting around, I don't know why you'd choose them.

I agree with Mirezzi that your other technical questions indicate you're out of your depth. But I'm not sure I agree with his suggestion. I think anyone can benefit from a little technical education, but people have different talents. I have a very neat split down the middle in terms of technical/creative, but if you aren't interested or adept at picking up technical usage, why bother? There are plenty of talented directors who are never going to use the word "f-stop" in their lives, and I don't think they should be faulted for it. Do whatever comes naturally to you. If you feel overwhelmed by the need to learn photography skills, consider instead finding a talented camera operator or DP that you can work with. You say you have a little money saved up, so you should have no problem.

Additionally, you can then leave so many of these other questions in the hands of your DP. I own the M2 and lenses, my company owns monitors and accessories and so forth, but on the last shoot I did it was far better to just use the gear that the camera assistant had in his own kit. He had it, it was cheap, and he knew how to use it, fast. Focus your attention where it needs to be. Don't waste your resources.

Hope that helps.
 
Much appreciated, that info is great. It looks like I might be getting the SGPRO and perhaps some Nikon lenses. A great DP is something I can't wait to have. Thanks again.
 
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