Can i record on to Dv tape WITHOUT P2 cards?

  • Thread starter Thread starter AJSwin
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AJSwin

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Hello all,

Just joined the forum today. I studied filmmaking for 6 years and used a DVX100 to film many Punk Rock bands. After umming and arrhing which camera to purchase now i have graduated, it's deffo a HVX200.

I'm not very technical, and i'm slightly confused. Can i purchase the camera independently and opt out of the use of P2 technology.

I appreciate they'll be beneficial but cost is a factor and i have researched alot tonight and i'm wondering can i just simply record onto DV / HDV tapes as normal. This is all i require for my work (music vid promo's/live shoots).

I'm sure i can but i'd love it if someone verified this and could state any factors that i might need to know as it's took me a long time to save up so want to get it right.

Cheers in advance :thumbup: :thumbup:
 
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You can record DV25 to tape.

This is a DVCProHD camera, so I don't know what the reference is to HDV.

To be clear, the only option to tape is DV25.

If you don't intend to shoot DV50 or DVCProHD, stay with the DVX.
 
OK, forget my first post, i'll ellaborate.

I intend to shoot DVCproHD. I don't own a camera, i meant to say 'HD'. Can i own and run this camera without having to buy any P2 cards??
 
Might want to take a look at the various threads or do a search. And you can run the camera without buying a p2 card.

1. DV Rack 2.0 HD
2. FS-100
3. ScopeBox
4. Final Cut Pro
5. Various PC NLEs.
6. Cineporter when released.
 
David S. said:
And you can run the camera without buying a p2 card.
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Of course, if you buy the camera in the US or Australia from an authorized dealer before the end of March, you'll get a 8GB P2 card for free (not in the box, it's a mail-in-the-rebate-form process).

If you decide you don't need or want the card, you should be able to sell it for $1000 or more.
 
Hi AJ,

If you choose to operate the HVX using tape only you will not be able to use focus assist... this is a very important consideration if you will be using the camera's LCD - it's the HVX's weakest point. Without focus assist, getting good focus is a bit of a lottery until you either become very used to the camera, or buy a monitor.

You will only get to shoot in standard definition with tape, so if budget is an issue I'm wondering why pay extra for a camera, then use it at (for arguments sake) 20% of it's capability. Unless your plan is to future-proof and pick up P2 cards later?
 
AJ - as people have mentioned here, you can shoot and capture directly to a computer without using P2 cards.

But your question relates to tape - and to tape you can only record in SD (DV25), just like the DVX. Further, the HVX needs a lot more light than the DVX, so if you intend to continue shooting Punk bands (or whatever passes for Punk bands these days ;-) in the fairly dim locations I imagine, the HVX using only tape would be a step down from the DVX. There are some upsides to the HVX in SD (native 16:9, some say sharper image), but these are extremely minor compared to the light issue.
 
ullanta,
I understand why you need more light shooting in HD, but how does that apply to shooting in SD where the image is dumbed down?
 
Hi guys,

Apologies for late reply (not sure if this'l work) everytime i reply my comp goes to sign-in screen.

I'll admit i'm confused. 110% forget my first post...all i want to do is but this camera, film in HD, then edit on my mac (FCP 5.1)

Thank you for letting me know abot the P2 cards. I'm confused as aren't DVCproHD classed as tapes?

Someone will have to explain to me. ps the Punk bands are real Punk don't worry (Upstarts, subs, Threats etc ;-)

**Please even ignore the wording of the title of this thread, i'm sure you all know what i'm getting at now with this post!! Sorry for confusion.
 
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beziermask said:
ullanta,
I understand why you need more light shooting in HD, but how does that apply to shooting in SD where the image is dumbed down?
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It applies directly! The sensor needs more light, period.

Now, if you were shooting in HD and reducing to SD, you might use gain and then hope the added noise is reduced in the downconversion, but I'm pretty sure even that wouldn't offset the difference in light sensitivity in most low-light situations. But if you're shootin' to tape this is moot.

I used to use a GL2 (now a secondary backupcam) and switching to the DVX, the low-light capability opened up whole new worlds. Situations where with the GL2 I absolutely had to bring in lighting I was able to get very acceptable images from with the DVX without lighting. And of course, many live situations where I could not light left me with footage I was extremely unhappy with with the GL2, but are easily handled by the DVX.

The HVX in many situations gives me that ol' GL2 feeling.

On the other end of the spectrum, dealing with theatrical lighting extremes, the HVX sometimes can do a little better than the DVX (perhaps mainly because I have an original DVX, with the single Cinegamma with no knee at all). But I still consider that pretty minor compared to the low-light issues - the DVX remains my main camera for theatrical events (in SD, anyway). The HVX is an HD "backup" that is left unattended, and can be re-framed a bit in post.
 
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The HVX is a DVCProHD camera that doesn't use DVCProHD tapes... that's why it reaches the price point it does. DVCProHD tape mechanisms are very pricey (as are the tapes themselves). That's why the tape mode writes only DV25 to miniDV tapes.
 
Right so to record in HD i do need the P2 cards? If it doesn't need DVCpro-HD tapes, or rather use them, then what does it record onto??? Is DV25 HD? My heads gonna fall off haha. I'm not taking the piss i need to know.
 
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Yes, there are tape-based DVCProHD cameras and decks, but the tape mechanisms they use are by themselves far more expensive than the whole HVX200 camera and P2 media.

The only thing the HVX200 can record to tape is standard-definition DV. If you want to record HD, then you must record to P2 media, a computer, or a DTE solution like the Focus Enhancements FS-100.
 
AJSwin said:
I'm not taking the piss i need to know.
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Hmmmm

The HVX200 records DV25 to tape. Nothing else.

You can work with the Firestore FS-100, or record to a computer with Scopebox on a Mac, or DV Rack HD on a PC with p2 cards.

Or you can record in the capture function in Final Cut Pro and certain PC NLEs.

Hope this doesn't hold you up.
 
THoff said:
Yes, there are tape-based DVCProHD cameras and decks, but the tape mechanisms they use are by themselves far more expensive than the whole HVX200 camera and P2 media.

The only thing the HVX200 can record to tape is standard-definition DV. If you want to record HD, then you must record to P2 media, a computer, or a DTE solution like the Focus Enhancements FS-100.
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I see. mmmm. I'm going to look into this now. Thank you very much mate, i'l post back when iv'e read more into the P2 system.
 
David S. said:
Hmmmm

The HVX200 records DV25 to tape. Nothing else.

You can work with the Firestore FS-100, or record to a computer with Scopebox on a Mac, or DV Rack HD on a PC with p2 cards.

Or you can record in the capture function in Final Cut Pro and certain PC NLEs.

Hope this doesn't hold you up.
Click to expand...

Thanks. so i take it the HVX200 must be firewired up to my mac when i'm recording!? That can't happen (if it's the case) as it's not practical for me.
 
The HVX is designed to record primarily to P2 cards. You can record in HD to those.

Since the largest P2 cards available today are 8GB, that means each card holds up to 8 minutes of 1080, 8-20 minutes of 720 (depending on framerate), or about 32 minutes of DV. So you'd have to have a large supply of cards, or some means of offloading the cards while you work.

You can also record via the Firewire port. This requires that you have a computer connected by Firewire to the camera, and that the computer be running some appropriate capture software (such as FCP on the Mac, or DVRack on the PC). Some devices (like the FS100) include a small simple computer that can capture to a hard drive from the HVX firewire port. You can capture any of the HVX's modes (DV, DVCPro50, DVCProHD) via firewire. Of course, being tied to the computer is not always convenient; and the FS100 has a somewhat limited capacity.
 
AJSwin said:
If it doesn't need DVCpro-HD tapes, or rather use them, then what does it record onto???
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Many things. See post #5 for a list of various options besides P2 cards.

DV Tape = standard-def DV and that's all.
 
Dare I say it, for long-form HD shooting some of the HDV offerings are looking a little better than the HVX. Especially the short-GOP JVC, and the ones with HD-SDI or even HDMI outputs that allow you non-MPEG capture in situations where you can tether them...
 
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