Looks of the camera?

Golf is a bad example at least to me ( In Hong Kong ) , and they are old fashion and traditional walk of life people , like our Richest LEE Ka Shing who like to play golf ( 70s years old richest but do not need to change or other people in their retirement stage )

Examples like:

1) B&O has their personal design look !! compared the traditional CRTs look back in many years ago.

2) Apple in computers, Ferrari in cars, Fender in Guitars jsut to name a few,

Again RED is next in Digital Cinema Camera, and we need a design and technology to " skip several generations of Evolution.. "

REDHKSC
CHINA / Hong Kong
 
For Landon its all about looks.

Landon, you're as shallow as RED's DOF capabilities!
 
HKSC 2007 said:
Golf is a bad example at least to me ( In Hong Kong ) , and they are old fashion and traditional walk of life people , like our Richest LEE Ka Shing who like to play golf ( 70s years old richest but do not need to change or other people in their retirement stage )

Examples like:

1) B&O has their personal design look !! compared the traditional CRTs look back in many years ago.

2) Apple in computers, Ferrari in cars, Fender in Guitars jsut to name a few,

Again RED is next in Digital Cinema Camera, and we need a design and technology to " skip several generations of Evolution.. "

REDHKSC
CHINA / Hong Kong
Click to expand...

Please excuse me for being off topic but I just have to say to HKSC 2007... I completely agree with you! Nice example w/ the Bang and Olufsen reference, etc. Nice one!

Now, as a far as design... I cannot wait for the full reveal. These guys still have alot up their sleeve that has not been revealed yet as far as the options (and look of said options)... Break down say a arri bl4 or a panavision xl... no mags, no lenses, plate/rods, lenses, ovf, etc... What is left? An obtuse, kinda box design.

bl4side__250.jpg
xlstudio.jpg


RED is just fine by me and my production needs. Do any of you honestly feel they are in this to half ass the final design? As far as clients not taking you seriously, well I have already let some Broadcast and Corporate clients in on what I am planning and how this camera system will impact their respective brands. As far as looks, when a GM of a broadcast entity exclaims an expletive... I have their undivided attention when specs are mentioned and further expletives are muttered. Are you guys getting these results? Clients really do like to know in advance what is coming down the road AND that can really help them do what they do --- better.

My 2 cents, what kind of feedback are you guys getting?

Cheers:beer:

Andrew
 
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For Landon its all about looks.

Landon, you're as shallow as RED's DOF capabilities!
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Not sure of that was suppose to be punny or not.... But no, its not all about looks. I was just looking for others input on the design.
 
HKSC 2007 said:
Golf is a bad example at least to me ( In Hong Kong ) , and they are old fashion and traditional walk of life people , like our Richest LEE Ka Shing who like to play golf ( 70s years old richest but do not need to change or other people in their retirement stage )

Examples like:

1) B&O has their personal design look !! compared the traditional CRTs look back in many years ago.

2) Apple in computers, Ferrari in cars, Fender in Guitars jsut to name a few,

Again RED is next in Digital Cinema Camera, and we need a design and technology to " skip several generations of Evolution.. "

REDHKSC
CHINA / Hong Kong
Click to expand...

You're using a blanket statement to sterotype golfers, which diminishes any valid point you may have. Apparently you missed my point, which was not about golf, but about how people behave and the motivations behind them with respect to sales and branding. I've worked on accounts for companies such as BMW, Sony and Apple. If you haven't worked in advertising at this level then you may not understand the nuances of building a brand and the human impulse buttons that advertisers seeks to push.

Like I said, I like the design of the Red camera -- at least the one photo that I've seen. I don't know if the camera will be a hit or miss, neither does anyone else. But I do hope that their camera is everything they suggest it is and more -- and wish them well. There seems to be alot of defensive posters doing alot of name-calling. These posters don't own the camera, nor have they ever used it. Their defensive nature is a knee-jerk reaction to the pain they are experiencing when the product's value is called into question. They clearly have vested alot of hope into this camera and need to believe that it will live up to its hype. I hope so too.
 
Just to throw fuel into this already huge fire, I've always favored camera designs off the beaten path. Some of my favorites were the 16mm GSMO, Aaton 35-III, and the rare Kinor 35 PII. I love the concept of RED, the look, the setup, everything. All I ask for is 300fps in 4K, is that too much?
 
Landon D Parks said:
Not sure of that was suppose to be punny or not.... But no, its not all about looks. I was just looking for others input on the design.
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Sure
 
I was ex-Marketing & Sales senior executive / System integrators / Distributors for many cameras vendors ( Prfessional & Broadcast Grade ) in ASIA outside Japan ( Tube and 1st CCDs JVC / SONY in 1986 / BTS - PhilipsBTS - Thomson Grass Valley / Ikegami / Panasonic ) Digital Camera/corders for nearly 20 years !!!.

We are professionals, and we are the users as well. And you ?

And now I choose RED, and they are doing damn right to change the Film or Digital Camera world not just a little bit but " Quite a bit " .
 
Mr. Parks I totally respect your opinion on the look of the camera. I don't think I quite agree with you but I can totally understand that your visual taste does not find the camera appealing and that is fine. In fact I have not even made up my mind on if I love the design or not myself. I have been much more focused on camera stats and if it will be functional or not. I'm not sure if bad blood goes back with you and some of the members here because I don't quite understand all the personal attacks on you just because your not a big fan of the visual design of the camera. I think it is admirable for you to state your opinion in the face of all this abuse.

HKSC 2007- I have not quite figured you out yet? Deezie makes a totally valid, well thought out analogy and you jump all over him because you don't like golf. I hate golf personally. Don't have the patience for it and am far more in to adreniline sports but can totally appreciate the points Deezie touches on. As far as you talking down about golfers that is crazy as there are a lot of amazing people of all ages in all walks of life that love golf. I mentioned earlier that I can't quite figure you out because with all the different threads of yours that I have read one time you come across knowledgable and intellegent and another you hardly even make sense.

It would make sense to me that there is more then one of you. Is there just one of you using the HKSC 2007 or what?

Does your hate for golfers stem from being sodomized with a golf club?(just kidding)
 
Finner said:
I'm not sure if bad blood goes back with you and some of the members here because I don't quite understand all the personal attacks on you just because your not a big fan of the visual design of the camera. I think it is admirable for you to state your opinion in the face of all this abuse.
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how would you qualify all the abuse suffered by this project and its mentor at cinematography.com if you know it?.. if you don't, try to figure why has it been?.. not just here but also there.. before posting anything on the matter..
 
firewallet said:
Break down say a arri bl4 or a panavision xl... no mags, no lenses, plate/rods, lenses, ovf, etc... What is left? An obtuse, kinda box design.
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That was essentially my point as well; that especially without a lens (but also without all of the other fancy stuff we like to put on a camera), the core Red body alone may seem a little bit lacking to some people. I think already Evin's photoshopped mockup made the camera feel a lot more in line with what most of us are used to seeing, and he didn't change the Red body at all -he just pasted a lens and mattebox on it. Landon even said this:

Landon D. Parks said:
Anyway, The new design of the red looks a little more "beefy" than the one RED has posted on there website, plus I didn't realize the camera was as big as it was. From RED's website, it looks like it smaller than the HVX.
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...which is entirely funny because the "render" that Jim recently put up looks very similar to the one on the website with the one main difference being that for the first time there's a lens depicted on the front. All of a sudden, this gives the impression to people that the whole thing is "beefier." In fact, I'm pretty sure Red IS smaller than the HVX (when you're just considering the body alone), so it's obvious that many people don't have a feel for just how big (or small, depending on how you look at it) the camera is spacially yet. I think that Red should be showing the renders of their camera with a lens attached (could you imagine the promo shot of, say, a Varicam with nothing attached to the body?), as I think it will make people inclined to understand and identify with the aesthetics of the camera more easily. I think Jim has started to catch on to this, and I think that's why the latest renders show the camera married to a lens - especially considering it's a nonexistent lens they made up just for that picture. :)

All this in mind, I've always thought the body looked cool and I'm stoked that we're getting 4K in such a small package. As Jim has said repeatedly, "It is a lot easier to make a small camera "big" than it is the other way around."
 
filmmaker1977 said:
how would you qualify all the abuse suffered by this project and its mentor at cinematography.com if you know it?.. if you don't, try to figure why has it been?.. not just here but also there.. before posting anything on the matter..
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I have been in the film industry for 16 years and come from the cinematography(com) and (net) forums and yes have seen how "some" of members their have treated others badly. Note the word "some", So yes there are some total jerks everywhere the thing is do you really want to stoop to their level? I think everybody could learn a from Jim Jannard a lot of the time it has been dragged through the mud at different sites with his character questioned and he has been nothing short of a class act.

I am not quite sure why you feel that you have to come out swinging at me right off the bat. You seem like you are very passionate about filmaking and thats great, we may even have the pleasure of working together on a project some day. In fact on his point about not liking the look of the camera I do not really agree with him so I lean much more to your side. All I am saying is just because someone takes a different stance then you is no reason to attack that person. In fact I have learned much more in life by trying to see there point and learning what I can from it, even if I do end up not agreeing with there point later.

I hope that we can be friends as in my young brash begining years in film learned the hard way that networking and relationships is much more of a key to success in this industry then talent. So tell me are you a RED reserve member as well?
 
finner.. :thumbup:

peace to all.. :thumbsup: opinions opinions..

survival.. that's the matter here and there..

personal attacks are deepshit.. but points not.. and that's a tough struggle between a lot of interests around and everywhere..
 
Haakon said:
"beefier." In fact, I'm pretty sure Red IS smaller than the HVX (when you're just considering the body alone),
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i dont know about smaller.. but it's definately very close.
 
Jarred Land said:
i dont know about smaller.. but it's definately very close.
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Yeah, hard to gauge exactly, but then again that's essentially the point. :) It's difficult to get a feel for precisely how big the camera is from a body-only render; a lens helps to give some perspective. It looks to me to be about the same length as an HVX but a bit slimmer... the HVX sure is a bloated thing. Either way, compact and modular is definitely the way to go!
 
Hi Landon, wanted to apologize for my harsh words, but I
have put you into the same category as R. Boddington, who´s
nearly incapable to keep on track.

Peace
 
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