Some features of the canon A1

[rawfa]

As crazy as it sounds, as far as HDV goes, the A1 is probably going to be *even better* than the H1, because it will have finer incremental control of just about every aspect of the image. The lens will be improved, the processing...the works. The only thing that won't be better is the simple fact that you won't be able to change the lens, or be shoulder mounted. Believe it or not, I know that Canon monitors these boards even if they don't participate (yes, even DVXuser) and they have learned a lot about what people want improved and I think these little cameras are going to be serious contenders.

I predict the A1 will be the new DVX.

I agree with you, Elton. The image control on the A1 is absolutely amazing. I've seen footage from the H1 that looks VERY film like for a non progressive camera. If the A1 works even better thant the H1 (and I think it will), it'll be a clear winner for the masses and professionals.

And with that in mind, Barry could write an A1 book, wouldn't you say

 

[Noel Evans]

And with that in mind, Barry could write an A1 book, wouldn't you say

Now that would be a treat........ GO ON BARRY!!!!!!! I guess if the cam is a hit then you might consider it?

I will get the canon propriety software. I am glad this cam has a tapeless (albeit connected) workflow and a tape workflow. I need to use in many variable situations so thats a big plus. If the HVX had the additional feature of HD to tape I would have bought it long ago.

 

[Emanuel]

The nice thing about Canon is that they have no high-end video cameras to protect against the A1/G1. A lot of people think Panasonic will come out with an AVCHD version of the DVX but I don't think they will because it would eat into sales of the HVX. The HVX is Panasonic's HD baby. They wouldn't let that happen. If they did come out with an AVCHD camera, they will have to make it different than the HVX. They will probably de-feature it somehow like leave out XLRs, imaging tweaks or focus distance readout, etc.

That's the point!

The more I read about the A1 the more I love it. I LOVE the lens range. If you want to go even wider there is the 0.8x HD wide converter which takes you down to 26mm! The stock battery is also suppose to last 5 hours!

So far the only bad things about the A1:

- Can't attach gear to lens for gear-driven follow focus (Instant Focus module physically in the way)
- Matte boxes will block Instant Focus sensor
- Wish the VF eyecup was larger like on a DVX or HVX to block out light
- Wish it was lighter like the GL2

How is it going pal?...that's incredible man! Have you been reading my thoughts? :laugh:

 

[Emanuel]

It's very tempting to sell the H1 and get an A1 and maybe a G1 too. (I'm an SDI believer)

I'm afraid also a G1 reseller :laugh: 'cause of you and your tease clips too I'm there with $3,000 plus...

 

[Emanuel]

Firestore's another option, but I can't afford that. As said before, I'd rather spend my extra on a Lens Adapter.

Wait for the external recording device from Cineform instead the Firestore. With the G1, of course. David assures they're following the clue.

10-bit 4:2:2@5:1 compression will surely rock and, at least to me, it will be enough. I will not need to go to uncompressed but I want better than HDV and a solid future stream.

BTW, Kholi do you remember those times:
http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?t=43964

It's interesting to follow up -- it's meaningful to anyone in order to understand why we are here discussing these new babies.

 

[Kholi]

Oh wow. LOL.

Yeah, sadly that project fell through. =( But I'm working on another right now.

And I don't think I'll be getting a G1, though the option to record 4:2:2 sounds really nice.

At that pricepoint it ends up being around the same as an HVX200. The thing for me between the two versions of the XH cameras is definitely the A1's price.

 

[Drew Ott]

This camera is going to be sweet.

 

[Drew Ott]

Do you think $4,000 will be the manufacturer price, with resellers selling for less (like $3,500), or do you think $4,000 will be what the resellers sell for?

 

[Emanuel]

Oh wow. LOL.

Yeah, sadly that project fell through. =( But I'm working on another right now.

And I don't think I'll be getting a G1, though the option to record 4:2:2 sounds really nice.

At that pricepoint it ends up being around the same as an HVX200. The thing for me between the two versions of the XH cameras is definitely the A1's price.

It's fair Kholi. First, I thought the same. After hearing the Canon shooters -- people like the HD-SDI master Barlow E., I've decided to go to the G1 via (HVX isn't for me mainly after that macroblocking and lower res features). With a tablet laptop I can have a portable 96 megabits 4:2:2 10-bit stream (avoiding HDV broadcast restrictions like those coming from Discovery HD) and a camcorder to the future. Otherwise, I'm very affective with my gear and if I can work with it during the next years why I might learn again how to work with new gear etc etc. It looses a lot of time that I will need for producing my content results. I'm not a geek.

 

[Emanuel]

Do you think $4,000 will be the manufacturer price, with resellers selling for less (like $3,500), or do you think $4,000 will be what the resellers sell for?

Who knows? But 'cause we have a mass operation I'd bet @$3,000 - $3,500 range.

 

[Kholi]

Who knows? But 'cause we have a mass operation I'd bet @$3,000 - $3,500 range.

I'm thinking, realistically, 3400 to 3700. Even if it were 4k, I think I'd still be getting one sooner than later. I mean, the 4k is straight HD shooting.

You don't have to do much more than purchase a few tapes to record too.

 

[Emanuel]

3400 - 3700? Yeah it can be... But you're right it will be affordable and that's what is relevant now. As Barlow said: a $4,000 Mini-CineAlta is a dream came true.

 

[Kholi]

Well, I think 3k would be a bit dreaming. I mean, the HVX isn't too far beneath the MSRP. Maybe five hundred? So it's plausible to see it around 3300 or 3500 but 3000 would be pushing it hard.

 

[Elton]

And I don't think I'll be getting a G1, though the option to record 4:2:2 sounds really nice.

I'm pretty sure you can get full raster uncompressed 4:2:2 from the component HD analog live signal of the A1, just like you can with an H1. I've captured this before with the Kona card and it's basically the same as the HD-SDI port. The SDI is way more convenient but the live analog HD signal is essentially the same thing so if you really needed something better than HDV for certain shots or an entire production, tapping the component output of the A1 would probably work well.

 

[Kholi]

I'm pretty sure you can get full raster uncompressed 4:2:2 from the component HD analog live signal of the A1, just like you can with an H1. I've captured this before with the Kona card and it's basically the same as the HD-SDI port. The SDI is way more convenient but the live analog HD signal is essentially the same thing so if you really needed something better than HDV for certain shots or an entire production, tapping the component output of the A1 would probably work well.

Now that's something you should show me a test of. I had no idea you could go component out on the H1, I thought it was just SDI. So how does the image hold up when captured like that? Is it any better? Or do you simply have the 4:2:2?

Will the Cineporter allow me to capture from the Component to 4:2:2 DVCproHD in 720/24f?

 

[Elton]

You'll need either an analog-->SDI converter or an HD capture card with analog HD in...like the Kona/Xena/Blackmagic extreme.

It's not likely the cineporter will have AD conversion like one of the aforementioned HD cards.

The analog HD image is very similar to the SDI signal and allows true 4:2:2 capture if you use the correct codec like CineForm, PhotoJPEG, Sheer, Uncompressed. You get subsampled 4:2:2 (1280x1080--NOT--1920x1080) with DVCProHD 1080. (it looks nice in this codec too however)

 

[Kholi]

Have those cards been established for laptops yet? Mac? PC? I'd surely love to look into something like that.

I already have the latop, and my MacBook will be around soon. M'thinking that it'd be a toss up between a portable solution such as that or the M2 when it's available.

 

[Emanuel]

But with the uncompressed HD we'll have a digital signal better than any analog component out.

My question is if will there be substantial losses from the analog port? Barlow, any test already done?
<specially for broadcast or theatrical purposes>

On the other hand, with the analog component out there isn't embedded audio nor other uncompressed audio option, right?

Without a SMPTE timecode port option how can we handle with the audio? Manually @clap_mode? Or from the compressed feature using the HDV itself (without external timecode syncro)?

 

[Elton]

SDI and analog HD live signal (NOT hdv tape playback!) are virtually the same signals with the same image characteristics. Honestly, the SDI is maybe less than 5% cleaner--if that.

I'll tell you what though, I am much more comfortable with the BNC SDI connector than the D4 analog cable. BNC is solid whereas the other you need to tie a snag loop around it just to feel a little better about it.

There is no embedded audio and because there are no timecode ports with the A1 you would likely need to go old school and use the clapper.

HDV doesn't sound so bad now, does it? But if we're talking about a shoot with a substantial crew and an actual "video village", then going tethered even from the A1 isn't such an absurd proposition.

 

[Kholi]

SDI and analog HD live signal (NOT hdv tape playback!) are virtually the same signals with the same image characteristics. Honestly, the SDI is maybe less than 5% cleaner--if that.

I'll tell you what though, I am much more comfortable with the BNC SDI connector than the D4 analog cable. BNC is solid whereas the other you need to tie a snag loop around it just to feel a little better about it.

There is no embedded audio and because there are no timecode ports with the A1 you would likely need to go old school and use the clapper.

HDV doesn't sound so bad now, does it? But if we're talking about a shoot with a substantial crew and an actual "video village", then going tethered even from the A1 isn't such an absurd proposition.

I'm liking the sound of that. I would love a more portable solution, though. A laptop with a kona card or something similar, but I'm guessing you'd still need a lot more power to deal with the live recording.

It's great to know that you can get this from the A1!!!! Video Village or not.