1080p 2/3" PL & C mount Lenses - NAB just got NAB-ier

I think I must be looking in the wrong place. Im on the gallery page, then I go to 'sample footage' but I can see no more clips than the ones from Duck Variations.
 
The new images are very impressive. Would love to see them color graded and out to 35mm blow up.

Can't wait to see this thing.
 
FullRez said:
I'm shocked at the pounding of this camera and its footage - Some of you love and embrace RED but haven't even seen a single frame. Here you actually have some still images to view. Obviously the motion samples are not the best but remember these are encoded for the web.
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I'm not so much pounding the camera.

As I've already said I think it seems like a dream come true on paper. The specs and workflow are utterly fantastic and if I were just basing it on that I'd be sold. Unfortunatly the screens just really underwhelmed me (especially after reading all those amazing specs). I'll be happy to see what some talented people manage to come up with but right now the screens have really put a damper on the camera for me. I mean, if these are the first shots they're going to show to the world then they really should look better than this. The first HVX200 clips I saw looked gorgeous. Same with the XL2.

As for RED, I'm excited as hell about it but I actually have the exact same fear. I worry that it may have the most amazing specs ever at a fantastic price but the images will be somehow underwhelming.
 
Did you look at the new Mpeg clips posted? Pay close attention to the dynamic range of the camera. It's very good, especially for early tests. In my opinion I'd rather see early shots that were done in a non-controlled enviroment than perfect marketing images that were shot in conditions most of us will not have the luxory of.

Lucky for me I have no brand loyalty. This goes for cameras, cars, food, etc. I have no idea how the final camera will be or how it compares to RED. I just thought it was interesting how people were questioning this camera but not RED - especially considering RED is complete hype at this point with zero images shown.

I hope they both make a splash - maybe this will light a fire under the major players and help us all.
 
David,

JFYI, the new MPEG clips uploaded are not really lit other than what was available at the site . . . that means "natural" light outdoors, and inside overhead flourescents. I think there may have been one 650W Arri bounced into a white card at some point in time, but I can't remember which shots had that light in them and which didn't . . . suffice to say, you're looking at a camera that can capture around 10 f-stops of dynamic range which is quite a bit.

For instance, that shot of the girl going from the shadow of the trees into full direct sunlight, and you can still see the details in her dress . . . that's the power of shooting RAW and extracting the maximum dynamic range that the chip can deliver.

Overall these two short-films were just experimental shoots used to make sure that the camera was actually working . . . great cinematography can't come from a camera that doesn't work :)
 
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Jason,

The camera certainly looks promising - and already seems to show good latitude -, however a lot of folks are expecting to see much sharper footage from a cam that has so good specs.

Can you upload something less compressed which would give an idea of the camera’s real possibilities?

Thanks in advance, and good luck
 
I'd say definately sharpness is not yet to par on the clips, but the dinamic range is truly amazing. I feel this will be another very cool product coming at NAB!
 
Jason Rodriguez said:
David,

JFYI, the new MPEG clips uploaded are not really lit other than what was available at the site . . . that means "natural" light outdoors, and inside overhead flourescents. I think there may have been one 650W Arri bounced into a white card at some point in time, but I can't remember which shots had that light in them and which didn't . . . suffice to say, you're looking at a camera that can capture around 10 f-stops of dynamic range which is quite a bit.

For instance, that shot of the girl going from the shadow of the trees into full direct sunlight, and you can still see the details in her dress . . . that's the power of shooting RAW and extracting the maximum dynamic range that the chip can deliver.

Overall these two short-films were just experimental shoots used to make sure that the camera was actually working . . . great cinematography can't come from a camera that doesn't work :)
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I completely understand. I'm just saying as consumers, we're used to seeing the early test footage look great fair or not. It represents what the best is that can be done with the camera.

I haven't ever worked with RAW. Maybe it's too complex for me to get out of it what I need and I'd rather have the "helping hand" some other cameras give me. It's really a shame that all these things cost so damn much to rent.

All I'm saying is that I love your specs, your workflow, and your price point but I think you guys need to come up with some really killer images if you're going to sell this thing to the HVX200, XL H1, HD100 market. Just my opinion.

I hope you guys blow me away at NAB (and also force RED to have a similar price tag)
 
Just saw the new stuff and was a bit more impressed. If you're going to do some more tests before NAB, please try some stuff like sunsets or some more ambitious lighting just so we can get more of a sense of what this camera can do.
 
then on the other side !
i prefer the newer images becuase they are more filmed as is .. i prefer them over studio lit - as you either have to have a excellent DP or you end up with a average lit scene and average doesn't make it ...

i already know that pretty much on ANY camera you can light to suit the camera = if the camera'a has a 3 stop range then you'll light if for 3 stops - it will be lit to show the camera good points/range ...
viewing outdoor scenes where there is a HUGE range tells me more about the camera then studio lighting unless you set up a reference for the studio shoot ( say compare to 35mm and give us all the foot candles/F stop etc )

NAB will be the see it for real !!!!
red will have a approx price ?
color space will have pricing on their camera.
and who knows maybe a few more surprises .

i say 2006 is looking GOOD !!!!!


IMO the camera is not in the same market as HDV/HVX .. more in with sony XDcam, infinity ..
 
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David, pay close attention to the scenes where the girl walks from dark shadows to full sun lit areas. This is no easy task for a camera like this to resolve.
 
Finally had the chance to see the new clips, very interesting.

I don't think it's soft, just that the focus is a bit off for most of the footage... when it's on, it seems very sharp, like the hair on the two talent in the gravestone scene. Every fine strand in sharp focus. And people shooting HD with a small crew or semi-skilled A/C's want even less depth of field than this 2/3" sensor gives... well, don't get me started...

There does seem to be a very definite noise pattern, but it seems more of an overall noise. Don't know how I feel about that yet. Need examples without QT compression to tell.

As to the color/gamma/levels... this footage feels a bit like the results I get when I use my slide/negative scanner to bring in 35mm still camera negatives and adjust in Photoshop... and since I'm no colorist, this footage feels a bit "off" in the CC department, just like my scans. I really want to see some nice CC and sharp studio shots and landscapes soon... hopefully at NAB...

I can't wait to see the actual capture rig, and see if the LCD panel seems bright enough to use in bright conditions... and focusing using it, etc.

I wonder if you could rig a Mac Mini running WinXP as a potential capture station?

And long exposures... how long? Is there a sync or contact socket to trigger exposures, etc...

Jim Arthurs
 
Hi Jim,

Again, this footage was with a VERY early prototype system. Colors are "off" because we weren't able to really figure out the matrix before this shoot, and then the indoor office scene had flourecents which threw some of the colors off again.

Also yes, some of this footage is out of focus . . . focus is hard, especially when you start dollying around, etc.

We are *hoping* to have a new high-brightness LCD at NAB, but this may not come to be, as the unit we just got in has some issues with the control board, so if you're looking to be impressed by the LCD brightness . . . well, if it's our older LCD (non daylight readable-it's like a laptop display), you probably won't be (I know I'm not, but the newer one looks really good).

Mac Mini running WinXP . . . hmm . . . theoretically yes! But we've never tested it, so there's no real way to know.

Thanks,

Jason
Silicon Imaging
 
donatello said:
IMO the camera is not in the same market as HDV/HVX .. more in with sony XDcam, infinity ..
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I agree with the first statement, not the second. The workflow seems squarely aimed at 'cinema' type projects, where extensive post work is the norm and expected. And the more raw data available to do that the better, so far preferable to HDV, DVCProHd or any other 8 bit codec.

Sony XDcam, infinity seem more aimed at the sport, news, ENG type workflow where an instant 'pretty good' product is worth ten 'digital cinema' products in the bush. Nothing wrong with that, it's just horses for courses.

What this camera and the Infinity ARE doing is redefining the larger (than 1/3") sensor market, pricewise. Increasingly the question may be asked of the more expensive 1/3" cameras, "why not pay a relatively small amount extra, and get a 2/3" camera"?
 
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The new footage really impressed me, those clips with the little girl and the woman just remind me an old "1970 look", typical pictures that often I've seen in old fashion magazine (maybe sort of "crochet-hook" magazines of my mother) or very old stock photos from "Unedi encyclopedia of 1970" that I own.
It's strange feeling, really like the look...they seems printed on an art paper :love4:
 
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Jason Rodriguez said:
Again, this footage was with a VERY early prototype system. Colors are "off" because we weren't able to really figure out the matrix before this shoot, and then the indoor office scene had flourecents which threw some of the colors off again.
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That shot is impressive because of the range of exposure and color temp you moved through. I wonder if there would be a way to dissolve between these matrix settings, similar to ramping iris or auto white balance?

Thanks Jason, I appreciate your responses, knowing how close the show is and how busy things must be in prep. I "get" your camera, as I followed the original thread that inspired it.

The workflow for post is very well though out, and I can't wait to see the prototypes in person (and you and Steve) on the 26th...

Has anyone done greenscreen/bluescreen tests with it yet?

Regards,

Jim Arthurs
 
Theoretically yes, you just duplicate the AVI file at the file-system level, and then in Premiere Pro, make different matricies for each part of the shot and dissolve them together. Or you can simply turn off the matrix entirely, and just do your own color-correction, and keyframe the color-corrector.

Thanks,

Jason
Silicon Imaging
 
Okay obviously this camera is revolutionary, but what should I call it. I called a film guy I know to tell him about it he asked me the name. I said the SI-1920HDVR. Can we get some sort of shorter or cooler name to call it.
So how about we find a name that doesn't sound like a prop on CSI.
SI-1920
Silicon BLUE
The WOW BOX
Brokeback HDVR (I had to sneak that in.)

Also their is a DP that shot a Brad Pitt commercial of him walking to the store at night with a Genesis or Viper and it was washed out until they color corrected it. Anybody know the website? This cameras images do look alot like that.
 
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