HVX200 Footage to DVD

thefilmaddict

thefilmaddict

Veteran
I just finished my first short film using the HVX200. I shot in the 720 24pn mode. The footage looks great playing from Final Cut Pro fed to a HD monitor via a Kona LH card. When Blu Ray or HD DVD burners come out and those players become popular with the general public, I will be able to distribute my projects in true HD. Until then, my clients want DVD's that will play back on their consumer DVD players. Here's my problem:

The DVD I made of my project looks bad. The compression adds big time noise and static shots look very steppy.

To make the DVD, I exported a 720 DVCPRO HD 24p quicktime movie from Final Cut Pro. That movie looks great. I then dropped that file into IDVD (I bought the latest version today) and burned a DVD-R.

The movie plays back fine in all of my consumer DVD players (which is good). IDVD also creates widescreen DVDs which is great. When I play back the DVD on a 4x3 tv, the image is in letter box. When I play the DVD back on a wide screen TV with a DVD player made to be used with a HDTV, the image fills the entire screen.

I just wish that I could improve the DVD image quality using the programs I own. Any ideas (please be specific)?

NOTE: I edit 720 24p HD footage at work all the time and the AVID NITRIS downconverts to SD video in real time and it looks great. I realize that at home, Final Cut Pro is no Avid Nitris, but there has to be a way to get more out of my private equipment. Please help!
 
If your DVCPROHD QT file looks okay then it seems like you are losing something in the IDVD step. MPEG2 compression will of course make things less then perfect, but if the damage is severe check your settings.

I'm not familiar with IDVD, but you would obviously want to set your bitrates as high as possible and be sure to do at least a 2-pass VBR encode.
 
thefilmaddict said:
To make the DVD, I exported a 720 DVCPRO HD 24p quicktime movie from Final Cut Pro. That movie looks great. I then dropped that file into IDVD (I bought the latest version today) and burned a DVD-R.
Click to expand...


You have a $10k camcorder, and a free, consumer DVD application. The explains a lot about your final output to DVD.

Compressing for DVD is part art and part science. iDVD gives you no control over the process, and the results you report are consistent with the lack of controls.

We use DVD SP 4, and BitVice for encoding. Also use AC3/Dolby 2 audio encoding, and brand name blanks.

Our DVDs look almost the same as the high def output at 720pn.

Your tools are not matching your source media.

I hate to sound like I'm lecturing, but iDVD should not be part of a professional workflow using a cam such as the HVX200.

best wishes
 
Owen said:
I'm not familiar with IDVD, but you would obviously want to set your bitrates as high as possible and be sure to do at least a 2-pass VBR encode.
Click to expand...


High bit rates don't necessarily result in better looking footage. You have to take into account the type of footage, the encoder, the amount of footage, your audio encoding, etc.
 
idvd is your problem..... upgrade to dvd studio pro

FCP ----> compressor -----> dvd studio pro

mess around in compressor with bit rates and compression settings, its def part art part science
 
Hey David are you happy with BitVice? I have seen lots of bad compression out of my recent upgrae to compressor and would like an alternative.

Also I agree HVX & FCP...... IDVD does not fit in to the equation.
 
Thanks for the info guys!

It sounds like IDVD is my problem.

Is there a way that I could just use IDVD to burn the DVD and use another program to do all of the compression? Also, is encoding the same as compressing a file (sorry, I'm new to DVD authoring as you can tell by my original post)?

Are you guys using programs like BitVice and compressor to do the compression, then using DVD Studio Pro to handle the menus or does DVD Studio Pro handle the compression, too (I'm a little confused)?

How many programs are used to make a good quality DVD?

Compressor is part of Final Cut Pro HD, is it not? What settings do you use in compressor to prepare your files for DVD Studio Pro? What if, after using compressor, I then tried to burn a DVD using IDVD, would it look better?

Should I just throw IDVD into a lake? It always made very nice DVD's from DVCAM footage.
 
Now is the time to go to FCP Studio 5.1
Support for 1080 24pA
I have Studio 5.0 with DVD SP.
I export the FCP timeline with compressor.
Even using low quality looks OK.
Best quality 16:9 export is great.
Best DVD's I have made after years on A PC.
Do yourself a favor and bite the bullit.
Don't mess around with i-DVD.
 
David S. said:
Our DVDs look almost the same as the high def output at 720pn.
Click to expand...


They do? I was under the impression that you loose TONS of quality when downconverting to DVD.

So, basically, what you are saying is that your DVD's look nearly as good as the original 720pn high-def signal? If so, that's great
 
When the time comes...After post on a short I DPed is finished I will be asking a lot you more post-knowledgable people what settings you use to make your DVDs from FCP Studio.
 
At the bootcamp yesterday, Rush had some HXV 720/24pn video on DVD that he'd shot for a DVD package on filmmaking --- it looked gorgeous! Perhaps someone could pull him into this thread to explain his workflow. I asked, but don't remember well enough to be valuable here.
 
Time for a credit where credit is due post, if any of you all want to see some funny stuff, check out filmaddicts shorts...short films that is.

The favorite in our post house is the one with Reginald Santori. We're even quoting lines from it, "I want scafolding! scafolding everywhere! as far as the eye can see!"

Check these guys out. they are absolutely nuts.
 
brianluce said:
Time for a credit where credit is due post, if any of you all want to see some funny stuff, check out filmaddicts shorts...short films that is.

The favorite in our post house is the one with Reginald Santori. We're even quoting lines from it, "I want scafolding! scafolding everywhere! as far as the eye can see!"

Check these guys out. they are absolutely nuts.
Click to expand...

THANKS BRIAN FOR THE POSITIVE COMMENTS! I REALLY APPRECIATE IT. WHERE DO I SEND YOUR CHECK?

I SHOT THOSE SHORTS WITH THE SONY DSR-500 (NOT THE HVX200). I AM LOOKING FORWARD TO SHOOTING SOME NEW SHORTS WITH THE HVX200. FOR THOSE OF YOU INTERESTED, YOU CAN SEE MY OLD SHORTS AT

www.morrisbrothersfilms.com
 
So is compressor included in Final Cut Pro HD (I think that it is). What settings do you use in compressor that gives you such great results? What kind of file does DVD Studio Pro need? I'm just looking for specifics. I need to make a decent DVD a.s.a.p. Thanks!!!
 
filmaddict, in FCP 5 or HD go to export, compressor

compressor will open up (batch monitor) and you can then choose what compression settings you want to add to your footage.... there are many..... when you see your FCP sequence there should be a little box with some up/down arrows on it, click it and then a hella amount of compression settings will pop up for you to choose from

if youre in a quick hurry just throw the dvd best quality (mpeg 2/48k aiff) on your sequence and start compressing

compressor will save the video and audio as two separate files, open dvdSP and import these files as "assets" ..... if you want to save time and have the dvd play right when its inserted, just drag the files on to the auto play icon and hit preview to make sure its playing right..... then burn away

hope this helps, I really suck at explaining this ****
 
David, you're using the WRONG tool!
And: It is not iDVD's fault. iDVD is no tool to
downscale from FD to SD.
Do the conversion from HD to SD in FCP.
Pretty simply: Open a new sequence with DV-PAL or DV-NTSC as properties.
Take the HD sequence and place it like a clip in the new sequence's timeline.
Rerender. Export as SD QT file. Done.

iDVD is a good start. No necessity to author a DVD in DVDSP with compressor
which mostly is a pain in the ..... If you really want to go that way, then use
main concept's encoder. Mo' betta!!!

Best peter
 
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Owen,

Thats a very cool way to deliver content (via a downloadable DVD image that you can easily burn -- is that easy to do?).

I burned your DVD and it looks a million times better than the DVD I made. Your image is clean (not noisy and not steppy). The movement is also a lot smoother than mine (I also shot in DVCPRO HD 720 24pn).

DVD's are interlaced, right? Does your process include pull down and progressive to interlaced steps? I must be doing something wrong to get such poor results.

From your DVD, I see that you did the following steps:

EXPORT QT as DNxHD

ENCODE MPEG 2 IN CANOPUS PRO CODER 2

AUTHOR IN ENCORE 2.0

Can you please give me more information about your specific settings? Can I use the programs you listed above on a mac?

Thanks for your help and your footage looks great!!!

I love the quality of HD, but it does make things a little more difficult in a SD world. I used to say DEATH TO VHS, I now say DEATH TO STANDARD DEF!!!
 
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