Would you use a clapboard just for the sake of using it?

morgan_moore said:
Using a slate you roll for longer
waste time on set while the assistant gets out of shot
risk them hiding somewhere where their reflection or shadow is in shot and not noticed until the edit
tire out camera operators doing handheld with big rigs or steadicams
fry your talent hanging around under hot lights forcing more make up touch ups or breaks to cool the room down and put the aircon back on for a bit
directors who storyboard stuff never* board enough cutaways and dont want to do them because they are not part of the 'schedule' - causing expensive pickups or continuity problems down the road
lose windows between aircraft noise or cloud movent
fill up more cards - seriously sometimes 50% more digital data
heat up your camera chip and create noise
flatten your batteries
create longer transcode times
fill up more hard drives
have one less person on set who could be holding a reflector, downloading cards or making you a coffee
Or if they are employed by you they could be back in the office marketing your company or doing some boring tax s**t for you
because the takes are written in pen a dozy assistant can mess it up by losing count
in the edit sometimes seeing an opening frame is quicker to navigate than a bunch of frames that all have a slate filling the frame
in the edit longer clips take longer to navigate
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All solved by having a good camera assistant AND/OR tail slating. :P



I enjoyed your foray into being the devil's advocate, but honestly a bad _______(anything) will hurt a production. Please don't discount the importance of the slate or 2nd AC only on the sole basis that the 2nd AC is potentially horrible at their job. 2nd Ac's don't make coffee or do your taxes. They don't fall asleep or waste time. You should immediately fire anyone who does. It seems your 2nd AC's aren't proper 2nd AC's but just a crew member wearing the hat of 2nd AC... perhaps the reason they fail at their job and do all the horrible things you have listed above, which are not common place on set.


I don't think the slate is always needed, but I don't think it is ever a negative impact, unless the person who wields it is unprofessional.
 
Ryan Patrick O'Hara said:
You really don't have to do anything. A slate is simply a tool to help your production. If you don't need the clap to sync sound later, than the shot/take information written on the slate could be very helpful in identifying the shot. Remember, some people here shoot weddings, some corporate interviews, and some narrative cinema. The slate definitely is at home with narrative filmmaking and is increasingly important as the size of the film project grows larger. It may be a debate here on DVXuser if it is necessary or not, but on decent sized indie-features and above, there is a slate... and if there isn't, you'd better believe the line producer is bludgeoning the 1st AC behind the studio asking why there isn't... meanwhile the 2nd has been fired and the replacement in on his/her way. :)

In some realms of videography, the slate is a tool that people may not need. If so, it could be a tool used to impress clients who may be impressed with the film set vibe... but in the end, it's very specific on who really needs one. When I shoot small commercials and perhaps more corporate type commercials, the slate is usually out the window. We still use it, but it simply has a segment name or something to help identify it. On bigger features, you'd better bet the slate is filled with incredibly detailed information and is always correct. Take, shot/scene, roll number, filters in camera, resolution, fps timebase, shutter angle, sync/mos, vfx, etc.

I don't really judge other people on their use of slate, considering that I'll forsake it on smaller shoots and not think twice.
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Very true. I was reading this thread and thinking...is that even a question? But then I started thinking about what I usually work on and 99% of the the time it's dual system, and usually it's more towards the narrative side of things. However with corporate videos and music videos...usually the slate is out the window and no one looks twice. Like phudson was saying, it's just another tool and sometimes you need it, sometimes you don't.
 
I must be missing something.

The slate comes from the film world when film and sound were separate things, never both recorded by the same machine.

Video is a different animal.
 
Pookie said:
I must be missing something.

The slate comes from the film world when film and sound were separate things, never both recorded by the same machine.

Video is a different animal.
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Yes, but the sound recorded on some video camera is not very good including the much loved RED ONE. I almost always double system when shooting sound with my RED ONE. The audio recorded to external recorders by professional sound men is far better.
 
phudsontx said:
Yes, but the sound recorded on some video camera is not very good including the much loved RED ONE. I almost always double system when shooting sound with my RED ONE. The audio recorded to external recorders by professional sound men is far better.
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Just cos you are doing double system doesnt mean you need a slate

you can rely on software (dangerous IMO) or just call a number or the like or add a sharp noise from out of frame
 
phudsontx said:
Yes, but the sound recorded on some video camera is not very good including the much loved RED ONE. I almost always double system when shooting sound with my RED ONE. The audio recorded to external recorders by professional sound men is far better.
Click to expand...
Perfectly true, I think I was over simplifying a bit.
There are a few very nice iPad slates available that do a very good job.
 
The films I've been working on have been shot on dSLRs, and recorded on a field recorder, so, yes, we use a slate. Our director often either edits himself, or sits with the editor while HE edits. He insists on a slate, though he's been known to clap his hands together to get the sound to sync. OTOH, when I shoot interviews, I almost never use one. I feel it makes the interviewee nervous or feeling like he has to 'perform'. I record to the camera (hvx200), though, and the sound is fine for oral histories.
 
I wouldn't slate for an interview unless there's dual sound or multiple cameras.
 
Interesting thread. I never slate interviews - save maybe an insert prior to talent with their name and other pertinent data for post. Slates, especially time code belching ones, are essential tools in reality television where operators jam their individual cameras using them as a master clock and after tape changes / top of cards as a reference for post. I've seconded on single-camera film and digital shows and can say that, with blocking and everything else that creates downtime on a set, it is rarely the 2nd AC that production is waiting on.
 
Slates seem sexy until you actually have to use one all the time, and they then become a real pain in the butt unless you have someone to do this job specifically and keep track of lens-changes, take numbers, etc., (if you are putting this info on the slate.) But they are definitely necessary when shooting double-system.
 
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