Would you use a clapboard just for the sake of using it?
- Thread starter Fellipe
- Start date
William_Robinette
Shallow Member
No.
But having a slate in at the head of any shot is a great help for editorial later. There are many useful bits of information a slate conveys (scene, shot #, take #, MOS, etc.) that I wouldn't want to be left without.
And set and cast dependent I guess an argument could be made that after hearing the "clap" it sets everyone's mind at the task at hand. Like a starter's gun at a race.
But having a slate in at the head of any shot is a great help for editorial later. There are many useful bits of information a slate conveys (scene, shot #, take #, MOS, etc.) that I wouldn't want to be left without.
And set and cast dependent I guess an argument could be made that after hearing the "clap" it sets everyone's mind at the task at hand. Like a starter's gun at a race.
j1clark@ucsd.edu
Veteran
I think part of the information on the clapboard, at least some versions, includes such information as 'MOS', that is 'without sound'. The may be no reason to actually 'clap', but with such things as electronic clappers, there is a time code frozen on the display that will mark the shot, and be useful in organizing the various takes and shots.
If you're recording no sound or single-system sound (direct to camera), then just leave the sticks open when you slate the shot.
Roberto Hapsad
Active member
Thanks for your tongue-in-cheek thread, Felipe. I think we all concur!
But seriously, in times of advancing technology, now might be a good time to review the reasons why we still use what is still basically a century-old technology and the situations which still require slates. (Not to mention completion-insurance policies).
If we don't learn to slate our takes, we'd better be self-employed. Even then, our editing costs might spiral. We'd spend ages to sync vision from a 2-camera shoot. in post -etc, etc. Our work would be in a mess. But then, if we don't use a clapper we maybe don't follow a lot of tried-and-true practices either. Our work flow would be messy anyway.
And yes, until we have learned the value of a slate we might also suspect others of using clappers because they're sexy. (and they are!)
We all start out underestimating how much there is to know about film-making.
(But yes, come to think of it, a fake film-crew along with clapper would be an elaborate but effective way to pull chicks) ;-)
But seriously, in times of advancing technology, now might be a good time to review the reasons why we still use what is still basically a century-old technology and the situations which still require slates. (Not to mention completion-insurance policies).
If we don't learn to slate our takes, we'd better be self-employed. Even then, our editing costs might spiral. We'd spend ages to sync vision from a 2-camera shoot. in post -etc, etc. Our work would be in a mess. But then, if we don't use a clapper we maybe don't follow a lot of tried-and-true practices either. Our work flow would be messy anyway.
And yes, until we have learned the value of a slate we might also suspect others of using clappers because they're sexy. (and they are!)
We all start out underestimating how much there is to know about film-making.
(But yes, come to think of it, a fake film-crew along with clapper would be an elaborate but effective way to pull chicks) ;-)
Last edited:
Postmaster
Dark Side of the Camera
LOL - I have to do that all the time, no biggie for an pro editor.
On topic:
We record in camera (via filed mixer of course) most of the time, since the cameras recording circuit is the same quality, as any recorder (what can not be said of the pre amps - hence the mixer). We save a ton of time that way, cause we can skip the syncing process. I understand the info on the slate may help sometimes, but actually I never run in that situation in years of shooting/editing.
My script girl keeps anal track of every shoot, and everything is extremely well documented. So if I want to know what take 3 - scene 5A was, I just look at the records. It tells me that it is file 16 on SD Card 7 or vice versa.
So there is no sane reason for me to use a slate.
Having said that, I always use a slate. Mostly for - call it "formal, traditional or even nostalgic - reasons.
Frank
Last edited:
Roberto Hapsad
Active member
Frank, you may have some modern insights into a new kind of sync process for an old guy like me. Could you, maybe, post a workflow tutorial on how to sync 3 cameras for a fairly typical shoot where the 2 actors are walking together, talking, in a busy scene with no sync sound. Camera A is mostly in CU and MCU tracking from a dolly, camera B MS on steadicam and Camera C in MWS, tripod?
All 3 shots from this take are to be stacked onto a timeline in A, B, C-Roll fashion, then checkerboard-edited so that visual sync of feet walking and visual lip-sync is maintained between cuts.
Last edited:
Or add to that - force of habit.
I slate all my shoots, from the low budget to the large budget ones, primarily because it is necessary when shooting dual cameras or dual audio system for sync and aside from that, for some strange reason when that slate snaps the whole set goes quiet, it means "its go time now"
love it
love it
j
Veteran
> As strange as it sounds, would you use a clapboard while shooting even if there's no sound recording just because it's 'sexy' (lol)?
Yes for the following reasons:
Set morale - People "snap" to attention and focus better at the crack of a slate.
It "Feels" more like a movie set.
It's looks more serious and professional to the clients.
Even if it's MOS or single system sound I do it for the above reasons.
Yes for the following reasons:
Set morale - People "snap" to attention and focus better at the crack of a slate.
It "Feels" more like a movie set.
It's looks more serious and professional to the clients.
Even if it's MOS or single system sound I do it for the above reasons.
Roberto Hapsad
Active member
Thanks for the reassurance, aaleex! I thought I'd been wasting my time slating all these years while a new breed of filmmakers had emerged with some innate sense of colour-matching, remembering all their takes after a shoot, and lots more.
It's true we all slate from force of habit. It's also often the case that we sometimes find ourselves doing post without referring to the slate. But, like a spare tyre, it's got me out of trouble many times.
You're right-on about the traditions on a set, too. When everything gets chaotic, you're tripping over wires and getting forgetful, it's the discipline that everyone recognises - worldwide, irrespective of their language or training.
j
Veteran
I've worked with trained horses on set and the animal trainers ask you not to slap apple boxes together or anything wood as the sound makes the horses come to attention and they think they have to perform.
Subconsciously it's the same with crew. (although they may be harder to train...)
Subconsciously it's the same with crew. (although they may be harder to train...)
Mattykins
Cute Member
Honestly though, not using a slate doesn't make someone unemployable, or an idiot, or a mess for that matter. On the list of things that determine how much of a filmmaker someone is, a clapperboard isn't even close to the top ten. Some people don't use one for whatever reason. I've had my shows forget to slate takes, wether it's because the slate went MIA moments before the take and we decided "hell with it", or we made a misstep and didn't slate. Did our project suffer in the end because of, god-forbid, a missing slate? Did we suddenly fall to amateur status? Please.
Last edited by a moderator:
J.R. Hudson
Spirit Animal
What's a Slate?
I agree with Matty. And really no reason to chastise any level of filmmaker is there ? And really, WTF is a fake film crew ?
Last edited by a moderator:
morgan_moore
Major Contributor
Using a slate you roll for longer
waste time on set while the assistant gets out of shot
risk them hiding somewhere where their reflection or shadow is in shot and not noticed until the edit
tire out camera operators doing handheld with big rigs or steadicams
fry your talent hanging around under hot lights forcing more make up touch ups or breaks to cool the room down and put the aircon back on for a bit
directors who storyboard stuff never* board enough cutaways and dont want to do them because they are not part of the 'schedule' - causing expensive pickups or continuity problems down the road
lose windows between aircraft noise or cloud movent
fill up more cards - seriously sometimes 50% more digital data
heat up your camera chip and create noise
flatten your batteries
create longer transcode times
fill up more hard drives
have one less person on set who could be holding a reflector, downloading cards or making you a coffee
Or if they are employed by you they could be back in the office marketing your company or doing some boring tax s**t for you
because the takes are written in pen a dozy assistant can mess it up by losing count
in the edit sometimes seeing an opening frame is quicker to navigate than a bunch of frames that all have a slate filling the frame
in the edit longer clips take longer to navigate
Personally my key tool is a digital counter http://countersales.co.uk/detail/38/electronic-hand-tally-counter-up-only.html and shouting out the number clearly
Of course on a bigger project (or one where some of the cameras record no sound) I would suggest a slate, but certainly have that counter taped on it too - or a proper TC slate of course
I bet there are far more tech ways of doing it too - say an I pad, with the story board on and a slate app - does one exist where one can mark the quality of the take after the shot?
Culturaly I agree using a slate feels like a film set and has a positive impact on crew and talent or does it..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R1QVRyN_3SM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zqrp_qd8eME&NR=1
S
*of course the good ones do
waste time on set while the assistant gets out of shot
risk them hiding somewhere where their reflection or shadow is in shot and not noticed until the edit
tire out camera operators doing handheld with big rigs or steadicams
fry your talent hanging around under hot lights forcing more make up touch ups or breaks to cool the room down and put the aircon back on for a bit
directors who storyboard stuff never* board enough cutaways and dont want to do them because they are not part of the 'schedule' - causing expensive pickups or continuity problems down the road
lose windows between aircraft noise or cloud movent
fill up more cards - seriously sometimes 50% more digital data
heat up your camera chip and create noise
flatten your batteries
create longer transcode times
fill up more hard drives
have one less person on set who could be holding a reflector, downloading cards or making you a coffee
Or if they are employed by you they could be back in the office marketing your company or doing some boring tax s**t for you
because the takes are written in pen a dozy assistant can mess it up by losing count
in the edit sometimes seeing an opening frame is quicker to navigate than a bunch of frames that all have a slate filling the frame
in the edit longer clips take longer to navigate
Personally my key tool is a digital counter http://countersales.co.uk/detail/38/electronic-hand-tally-counter-up-only.html and shouting out the number clearly
Of course on a bigger project (or one where some of the cameras record no sound) I would suggest a slate, but certainly have that counter taped on it too - or a proper TC slate of course
I bet there are far more tech ways of doing it too - say an I pad, with the story board on and a slate app - does one exist where one can mark the quality of the take after the shot?
Culturaly I agree using a slate feels like a film set and has a positive impact on crew and talent or does it..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R1QVRyN_3SM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zqrp_qd8eME&NR=1
S
*of course the good ones do
Last edited:
Paul Hudson
Vacuum Tube Member
Never, just one more thing to slow the process down. Now, if I am running double system sound I will use it. You see I have been doing this for 28 years and I no longer find any of the gear "cool". I consider it all "tools" to make a living. That's it. The faster, simpler and better I can do this I will.
Last edited:
Ryan Patrick O'Hara
Veteran
You really don't have to do anything. A slate is simply a tool to help your production. If you don't need the clap to sync sound later, than the shot/take information written on the slate could be very helpful in identifying the shot. Remember, some people here shoot weddings, some corporate interviews, and some narrative cinema. The slate definitely is at home with narrative filmmaking and is increasingly important as the size of the film project grows larger. It may be a debate here on DVXuser if it is necessary or not, but on decent sized indie-features and above, there is a slate... and if there isn't, you'd better believe the line producer is bludgeoning the 1st AC behind the studio asking why there isn't... meanwhile the 2nd has been fired and the replacement in on his/her way.
In some realms of videography, the slate is a tool that people may not need. If so, it could be a tool used to impress clients who may be impressed with the film set vibe... but in the end, it's very specific on who really needs one. When I shoot small commercials and perhaps more corporate type commercials, the slate is usually out the window. We still use it, but it simply has a segment name or something to help identify it. On bigger features, you'd better bet the slate is filled with incredibly detailed information and is always correct. Take, shot/scene, roll number, filters in camera, resolution, fps timebase, shutter angle, sync/mos, vfx, etc.
I don't really judge other people on their use of slate, considering that I'll forsake it on smaller shoots and not think twice.
In some realms of videography, the slate is a tool that people may not need. If so, it could be a tool used to impress clients who may be impressed with the film set vibe... but in the end, it's very specific on who really needs one. When I shoot small commercials and perhaps more corporate type commercials, the slate is usually out the window. We still use it, but it simply has a segment name or something to help identify it. On bigger features, you'd better bet the slate is filled with incredibly detailed information and is always correct. Take, shot/scene, roll number, filters in camera, resolution, fps timebase, shutter angle, sync/mos, vfx, etc.
I don't really judge other people on their use of slate, considering that I'll forsake it on smaller shoots and not think twice.