why foam windscreens = $$$?
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Dave_Fisk
Well-known member
Re: why foam windscreens = $$$?
Some of the more expensive foam windscreens hold up very well over a long period of time. I have seen some cheaper ones, that over the period of a few years, they will literally distintagrate. Really nice ones, like the ones from Sennheiser and Schoeps don't do that. Thus the higher price.
-Dave
Some of the more expensive foam windscreens hold up very well over a long period of time. I have seen some cheaper ones, that over the period of a few years, they will literally distintagrate. Really nice ones, like the ones from Sennheiser and Schoeps don't do that. Thus the higher price.
-Dave
MattinSTL
Sound Modulator
Re: why foam windscreens = $$$?
There are MANY kinds of foam. Latex, rubber, open-celled and close-celled, etc.
The foam which is sold in craft stores is generally CLOSE-celled.
That means that air does not freely pass through the foam... that's BAD for sound.
If you want to find a cheap solution to your windscreen woes then go to RadioShack and see what they have that fits.
If you really want to get creative and get a really effective solution (although ugly) then see if you can find a foam air-filter, like one for a motorcycle or lawn-mower... where the foam is cylindrical and sewn shut at the end and down one side... then the other end generally has a rubber boot for clamping onto a carb.
If you really want to simply MAKE your own windscreen then get ACOUSTICALLY TRANSPARENT FOAM which is available from almost everybody... Markertek, Trew Audio, etc. It generally runs between $5 and $10 per square foot and you can make a lot of screens out of that... plus you can even engineer a dead air-space which will double the windscreen's effectiveness.
Watch my posts for a home-made Softie project I'm working on... I disected a Softie and I think I can make 'em. It'll just be a matter of determining if it would be profitable at all. I'll need a sewing machine for one!
I'm 99% sure I can do it.
There are MANY kinds of foam. Latex, rubber, open-celled and close-celled, etc.
The foam which is sold in craft stores is generally CLOSE-celled.
That means that air does not freely pass through the foam... that's BAD for sound.
If you want to find a cheap solution to your windscreen woes then go to RadioShack and see what they have that fits.
If you really want to get creative and get a really effective solution (although ugly) then see if you can find a foam air-filter, like one for a motorcycle or lawn-mower... where the foam is cylindrical and sewn shut at the end and down one side... then the other end generally has a rubber boot for clamping onto a carb.
If you really want to simply MAKE your own windscreen then get ACOUSTICALLY TRANSPARENT FOAM which is available from almost everybody... Markertek, Trew Audio, etc. It generally runs between $5 and $10 per square foot and you can make a lot of screens out of that... plus you can even engineer a dead air-space which will double the windscreen's effectiveness.
Watch my posts for a home-made Softie project I'm working on... I disected a Softie and I think I can make 'em. It'll just be a matter of determining if it would be profitable at all. I'll need a sewing machine for one!
I'm 99% sure I can do it.
MattinSTL
Sound Modulator
Re: why foam windscreens = $$$?
Pretty well... yeah.
The reason I suggest an air-filter as a possibility is because AIR flows right through it... which means sound flows right through it.
Windscreens work by breaking up the air... not BLOCKING it.
I have this crazy affliction where I can have a GREAT time in really obscure stores that sell specialty items for niche markets... you'd be surprised how well something intended for ONE use can work for a DIFFERENT use.
The reason mic windscreens cost so damn much is simply because WHAT ELSE ARE YOU GONNA' DO? The manufacturers have us over a barrel! Even though I've bought a bunch of Rycote stuff... do I think a little plastic ball is worth $200... TWO HUNDRED dollars? "F" no! But I get it because it works and there aren't a whole lot of companies trying to make stuff that they'll only sell a few of... supply and demand my friend.
Pretty well... yeah.
The reason I suggest an air-filter as a possibility is because AIR flows right through it... which means sound flows right through it.
Windscreens work by breaking up the air... not BLOCKING it.
I have this crazy affliction where I can have a GREAT time in really obscure stores that sell specialty items for niche markets... you'd be surprised how well something intended for ONE use can work for a DIFFERENT use.
The reason mic windscreens cost so damn much is simply because WHAT ELSE ARE YOU GONNA' DO? The manufacturers have us over a barrel! Even though I've bought a bunch of Rycote stuff... do I think a little plastic ball is worth $200... TWO HUNDRED dollars? "F" no! But I get it because it works and there aren't a whole lot of companies trying to make stuff that they'll only sell a few of... supply and demand my friend.
Dave_Fisk
Well-known member
Re: why foam windscreens = $$$?
Oleg,
I thing you could use the pelican foam if you wanted. I don't know if it's too dense or not, though.
About other prices, like the Rycote stuff....There is a lot of R&D that goes into stuff like that. When I first got into the location stuff, I thought a zeppelin might sell for $25-$50 new. Boy was I wrong, but then I saw what goes into making sure they are the right size, and the development of the materials, and extensive field testing involved. Another reason production audio stuff is so expenxsive is that it's such a niche market. In order for manufacturers to not go bankrupt they have to charge a high price for their stuff.
-Dave
Oleg,
I thing you could use the pelican foam if you wanted. I don't know if it's too dense or not, though.
About other prices, like the Rycote stuff....There is a lot of R&D that goes into stuff like that. When I first got into the location stuff, I thought a zeppelin might sell for $25-$50 new. Boy was I wrong, but then I saw what goes into making sure they are the right size, and the development of the materials, and extensive field testing involved. Another reason production audio stuff is so expenxsive is that it's such a niche market. In order for manufacturers to not go bankrupt they have to charge a high price for their stuff.
-Dave
Re: why foam windscreens = $$$?
Foam used to protect a fragile device in shipping is not going to make a good windscreen.
For the best, cheap wind screen, better than foam; buy a pair of panty-hose and streatch them across a wire coat hanger or a knitting hoop and place that between the mic element and your sound source. This is very similar to windscreens you see in recording studios, which cost $40+.
You can make ten of these for less than $40.
You can also make a "tube" of the coat hangers and stretch the panty hose over them for a tubular windscreen for a shotgun. They won't work as well for windy conditions where you would need a zepplin; but they'll work better (more transparent sound) than foam.
Foam used to protect a fragile device in shipping is not going to make a good windscreen.
For the best, cheap wind screen, better than foam; buy a pair of panty-hose and streatch them across a wire coat hanger or a knitting hoop and place that between the mic element and your sound source. This is very similar to windscreens you see in recording studios, which cost $40+.
You can make ten of these for less than $40.
You can also make a "tube" of the coat hangers and stretch the panty hose over them for a tubular windscreen for a shotgun. They won't work as well for windy conditions where you would need a zepplin; but they'll work better (more transparent sound) than foam.
MattinSTL
Sound Modulator
Re: why foam windscreens = $$$?
The Windtechs are DRAMATICALLY better then standard foam screens. As I stated earlier the thing that makes screens effective is a dead airspace. Many Windtechs include 2 different densities of foam with a dead airspace inbetween. At least the ones I got for the Oktavas do.
Also I want to clarify what I already said... I don't have a problem with the price of this stuff because the companies sell relatively few items... so they HAVE to be more then you'd expect for the place to stay in business.
I've got/had 3 Softies, 3 blimps, 3 windjammers, and 2 Windtechs... not to mention all the standard foam and mounts, etc. I'm really familiar with what works and what doesn't and why some windprotection costs more then others.
You'll get what ever you pay for. A Windtech is AT LEAST twice as effective as a standard foam... and a Rycote Softie is AT LEAST 3 times as effective as the Windtech... and the Rycote blimp/jammer system is twice as effective as the Softie... in practical use I think it's EASY to put a price on good audio... and that price is the maximum you can afford.
The Windtechs are DRAMATICALLY better then standard foam screens. As I stated earlier the thing that makes screens effective is a dead airspace. Many Windtechs include 2 different densities of foam with a dead airspace inbetween. At least the ones I got for the Oktavas do.
Also I want to clarify what I already said... I don't have a problem with the price of this stuff because the companies sell relatively few items... so they HAVE to be more then you'd expect for the place to stay in business.
I've got/had 3 Softies, 3 blimps, 3 windjammers, and 2 Windtechs... not to mention all the standard foam and mounts, etc. I'm really familiar with what works and what doesn't and why some windprotection costs more then others.
You'll get what ever you pay for. A Windtech is AT LEAST twice as effective as a standard foam... and a Rycote Softie is AT LEAST 3 times as effective as the Windtech... and the Rycote blimp/jammer system is twice as effective as the Softie... in practical use I think it's EASY to put a price on good audio... and that price is the maximum you can afford.
Fred_Plowman
Well-known member
Re: why foam windscreens = $$$?
A poor man cant afford to buy cheap junk!
i paid 165$ for a lightwave it works great.. i look at it and wonder.. how the hell can they charge sooo much for this item.. Man theyre making a mint.
A poor man cant afford to buy cheap junk!
i paid 165$ for a lightwave it works great.. i look at it and wonder.. how the hell can they charge sooo much for this item.. Man theyre making a mint.
GenJerDan
Veteran
Re: why foam windscreens = $$$?
[quote author=gossamer link=board=audio;num=1092922518;start=0#11 date=08/19/04 at 21:23:44]They won't work as well for windy conditions where you would need a zepplin; but they'll work better (more transparent sound) than foam.[/quote]
What are zeppelins made of? Commonly available material?
Dan
[quote author=gossamer link=board=audio;num=1092922518;start=0#11 date=08/19/04 at 21:23:44]They won't work as well for windy conditions where you would need a zepplin; but they'll work better (more transparent sound) than foam.[/quote]
What are zeppelins made of? Commonly available material?
Dan
MattinSTL
Sound Modulator
Re: why foam windscreens = $$$?
The zepplins are plastic baskets... or cages. They open at one end and have a slot down the bottom which accomodates the shockmount... which slides inside. It's the size and design that brings the price. The plastic cage simply has a fabric attached to it... on the Rycotes it's from the inside... and it's fused to the cage.
If I was going to make one... I'd find some plastic grid... You can find it in some home-improvement stores... with 1/4" or smaller openings... make it into a cylinder and cap off the ends... if you make "lids" for each end you may be able to wrap this grid around a shockmount like the PSC. Take a peek at the PSC and you'll see what I mean.
Then you need to pull a stocking over that... panty-hose type material should be best.
Are you getting a picture of what a zeppelin is and does?
If I buy a freakin' sewing machine I'm going to offer zeppelins to everybody for $50 each. Of course with the work required that wouldn't even be all that good of money... and they'd HAVE to look professional. Home-made **** doesn't look good to clients when you're getting paid well for a shoot. If it doesn't LOOK home-made then no problem... if it does and something causes a problem... your cobby creation will get the blame.
The zepplins are plastic baskets... or cages. They open at one end and have a slot down the bottom which accomodates the shockmount... which slides inside. It's the size and design that brings the price. The plastic cage simply has a fabric attached to it... on the Rycotes it's from the inside... and it's fused to the cage.
If I was going to make one... I'd find some plastic grid... You can find it in some home-improvement stores... with 1/4" or smaller openings... make it into a cylinder and cap off the ends... if you make "lids" for each end you may be able to wrap this grid around a shockmount like the PSC. Take a peek at the PSC and you'll see what I mean.
Then you need to pull a stocking over that... panty-hose type material should be best.
Are you getting a picture of what a zeppelin is and does?
If I buy a freakin' sewing machine I'm going to offer zeppelins to everybody for $50 each. Of course with the work required that wouldn't even be all that good of money... and they'd HAVE to look professional. Home-made **** doesn't look good to clients when you're getting paid well for a shoot. If it doesn't LOOK home-made then no problem... if it does and something causes a problem... your cobby creation will get the blame.