Capt Quirk
Veteran
Even plants will eat meat, so how bad can it be?
Of course, I'm talking about flys, the other, other, other white meat...
Of course, I'm talking about flys, the other, other, other white meat...
Who's a vegetarian?
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Spartacus
Veteran
Jason,
these posts IMPLIED that our teeth are that of carnivores, didn´t they?
But they are not, herbivores need the front teeth to eg cut of/break open the plants they want to eat, they then use the grinders to chew them before swallowing.
Try to move your jaw from left to right, now try to do that with a dogs jaw (use a friendly dog and never a cat for this test:2vrolijk_08
That´s why I said try to eat some unskinned, our teeth just aren´t made for this
(but we are smart and developed tools to open prey AND coconuts:cheesy
Of course we could settle on the "omnivore" teeth again, but this would imply a huge group of defined omnivores.
But there are rather few animals that are omivores, bears and pigs being the most known ones.
But even bears take around 70% of their diet in the form of plants (but I guess it´s more popular to show them "hunting" for salmon...)
And pigs, well you saw Snatch...
Spartacus
Veteran
Hehe,
Sad Max I totally agree with this (except for the part of the nutritional value of the cooked meat, do you mean proteins with that?)
That´s why I was pointing out The China Study, the biggest survey on nutrition ever taken, showing that in societys living mostly on a plant based diet, cancer and hard diseases are hardly an issue...
I really could be content with this omnivoric view, but that wasn´t the tone of this whole thread, I can take a good joke, but when it comes to making points on what´s biologicaly, nutritionaly and ethically right or wrong, I´ll take a stand :evil:
All the best,
Spart
GenJerDan
Veteran
That´s why I said try to eat some unskinned, our teeth just aren´t made for this
(but we are smart and developed tools to open prey AND coconuts:cheesy
That's why I mentioned it. I can't bite into an unskinned deer.
Neither can my cat.
Doesn't mean she's not a carnivore.
Both of us could bite the head off a mouse. (Of course, only one of us would.)
rsbush
Well-known member
Doesn't your cat like mice?
Capt Quirk
Veteran
That's probably because they inject meat with dyes and preservatives that are carcinogenic. Which is sort of ironic, because meat is much safer than the toys and other products that come out of China.
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GenJerDan
Veteran
Both of my cats are...well...
The one and only time I had a mouse in the apartment, they both just sat there staring at it.
Now, a bat, they might go for. They love to catch and eat flying things; mosths, those gigantor mosquito-looking things, the occasional bee.
Anhar_Miah
Veteran
I think those pushing the alleged extra "advantages" from a "scientific" view of vegeatrian diet ought to watch/read the following material:
http://www.beyondveg.com/billings-t/comp-anat/comp-anat-1a.shtml
Most of the claims raised in this thread has been covered over at that site
and
The must see debate:
http://www.irf.net/irf/videogallery/index.htm (scroll down to Debate: "Is Non-Vegetarian Food Prohibited or Permitted") you can also locate the transcipts also from the same site.
I've said it before and I'll say it again, if your a vegetarian, then by all means I respect you for that since it is your free choice to live that lifestyle. However pushing "Information" which is clearly in my view FUD (Fear, Uncertainty, Disinformation) is another context altogther.
http://www.beyondveg.com/billings-t/comp-anat/comp-anat-1a.shtml
Most of the claims raised in this thread has been covered over at that site
and
The must see debate:
http://www.irf.net/irf/videogallery/index.htm (scroll down to Debate: "Is Non-Vegetarian Food Prohibited or Permitted") you can also locate the transcipts also from the same site.
I've said it before and I'll say it again, if your a vegetarian, then by all means I respect you for that since it is your free choice to live that lifestyle. However pushing "Information" which is clearly in my view FUD (Fear, Uncertainty, Disinformation) is another context altogther.
Spartacus
Veteran
The book draws the conclusion, that animal protein and fat promote the growth of cancer cells...
That meat is full of antibiotics, hormons, preservatives, colorants etc. is another story...
I think some people are missing the bigger picture when it comes to eating meat. It's one thing if you hunt down the animal yourself and eat it, or even purchase the meat from a local farmer who has let the animal graze freely and have some assemblance of dignity before being killed.
The truth is that most people nowadays don't know where their food is coming from, and what is being done to it to make the most money possible. The vast majority of meat we eat are from factory farms that play frankenstein with the animals before mass slaughter. Its a popular practice to save money on feed by forcing the animals to become cannibals, since they can save money by keeping unused body parts to say, fatten cattle with unused cattle parts. (see Mad Cow Disease)
My wife has exposed me to alot of literature, people, and other media over the last few years when she was getting her masters in Nutrition at Bastyr University. This stuff is just the tip of the iceberg. The earth is affected, human disease, even global warming is a side-effect. The top contributer of methane gas(which is far worse for the environement than CO2) is factory farming. The list, unfortunately, goes on and on.
Sure, we can sit around saying "mmmmm", meat tastes good...which it does. But at some point, I think we should start thinking beyond our caveman behaviour and ask where is our food coming from? What are they doing to it? And at whose expense?
I promise that if you don't much about the subject and you do some reading you will be in for a fascinating and quite disturbing read.
The truth is that most people nowadays don't know where their food is coming from, and what is being done to it to make the most money possible. The vast majority of meat we eat are from factory farms that play frankenstein with the animals before mass slaughter. Its a popular practice to save money on feed by forcing the animals to become cannibals, since they can save money by keeping unused body parts to say, fatten cattle with unused cattle parts. (see Mad Cow Disease)
My wife has exposed me to alot of literature, people, and other media over the last few years when she was getting her masters in Nutrition at Bastyr University. This stuff is just the tip of the iceberg. The earth is affected, human disease, even global warming is a side-effect. The top contributer of methane gas(which is far worse for the environement than CO2) is factory farming. The list, unfortunately, goes on and on.
Sure, we can sit around saying "mmmmm", meat tastes good...which it does. But at some point, I think we should start thinking beyond our caveman behaviour and ask where is our food coming from? What are they doing to it? And at whose expense?
I promise that if you don't much about the subject and you do some reading you will be in for a fascinating and quite disturbing read.
Here's a link to FactoryFarming.com for those interested. There is literature and photo galleries and video galleries: http://www.factoryfarming.com/gallery.htm
CallaghanFilms
Veteran
That's why we grow most of our vegetables in th garden, or buy from local, trusted farms.
Growing your own food is less expensive, sustainable, and very satisfying...not to mention that you avoid the chemicals and processing that can do harm to our bodies.
Plus I know that I am not depleting the earth of essential resources. It's a win-win situation.
Growing your own food is less expensive, sustainable, and very satisfying...not to mention that you avoid the chemicals and processing that can do harm to our bodies.
Plus I know that I am not depleting the earth of essential resources. It's a win-win situation.
I buy free-range meat and poultry. I'm fortunate to live in a major urban center where those products are easily found.
That's why I made the effort to visit some slaughterhouses. And believe me...it's not easy to get in unless you have business, there. The management (with good reason) does not seem to want the general public to have a close look at how they operate.
That's why my steak had those steel bolts stuck in it...
I think the FDA (or is it the Dept. of Ag?) banned the practice, some time ago.
If we were behaving more like cavemen, we wouldn't be having these problems.
Callaghan, I was providing an example that in yesteryear people would have a direct connection with the meat they ate, because they A)either killed it themselves or B)bought it from a local butcher who dealt directly with the hunter. It is to provide contrast to our contemporary disconnect from this incredibly complicated chain of industrial delivery.
Without food, we don't exist, so I think it is important that we have an understanding of how we are continuously polluting our life source for the sake of convenience and ubiquity.
Without food, we don't exist, so I think it is important that we have an understanding of how we are continuously polluting our life source for the sake of convenience and ubiquity.
Capt Quirk
Veteran
Speaking of genetically altered foods, a lot the veggies and fruits have been altered. They made tomatoes where the seeds are sterile, just so that you'll have to buy from them. And what about the corn that was altered, and winds cross pollinated corn for miles around. Now the corp is trying to sue the local farmers because of it? Being vegetarian isn't any simpler these days.
rsbush
Well-known member
That's commendable, but for many it's more than impractical, it's practically impossible.
Capt Quirk, you speak of Monsanto. What a friendly neighbor they are!
Sometimes at the grocery store, they will have the organic and the regular veggies. IT's always interesting to compare the genetically modified ones to the organic. It'll be like a regular sized green pepper, versus a genetically shiny, glowing green that is twice the size of the aforementioned.
Sometimes at the grocery store, they will have the organic and the regular veggies. IT's always interesting to compare the genetically modified ones to the organic. It'll be like a regular sized green pepper, versus a genetically shiny, glowing green that is twice the size of the aforementioned.
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