Who owns a Manfrotto 504HD Fluid Head?

puredrifting

puredrifting

Major Contributor
I have had a lot of Bogen and Manfrotto heads over the years and generally hate them. Still have several laying around but thinking of buying the 504HD fluid Head as my cheap, travel head. Just weighed my Sachtler head it weighs 12lbs which puts me over on weight limit for carrying it in my camera backpack and I cannot bring myself to check an expensive Sachtler head when multiple airlines have lost multiple bags and items out of bags for me over the years. The specs will work for my rig, just have a couple of questions?

1. Anyone shooting with about a 13lb rig on this head? I see the preset counter balance settings include 11.5lbs and 16.5lbs? I take it the 16.5lb setting might actually work for a 13lb set up?
2. Overall, can you get a decently smooth pan and tilt when shooting with say, the 70-200 2.8 IS II Canon at 200mm? I won't need to shoot anything longer focal length for this assignment but will spend a lot of time with this lens on my C100.

I bought the Manfrotto 500 last year with a lighter rig for some shoots in Africa and it was pretty so so, barely usable, so my hope is by stepping up a few levels, I will be able to at least get a few decent panning shots on long lens, that the head will hold up to two solid weeks of run and gun, being rained on, etc. I would really much rather bring my Sachtler but there is no way I can take the weight and size when my camera backpack will be over packed already. The 504 is half the weight, although not a lot smaller but I have no problem throwing a Manfrotto into my checked luggage so it is looking like it might do the trick for a cheapo travel head. I will be using it on my Miller Solo DV 75mm carbon sticks.
 
I use a Manfrotto 504HD and a Sachtler Ace M. I use the Ace whenever possible...to me it feels much better than the 504HD. I only use the 504HD when the load exceeds 8 lbs...mostly for a teleprompter or with my b cam. Could you swing the Ace L? It's capacity is 13.2 lbs. We also just purchased a Cartoni Focus 8. I've only used it once, but it was very nice as well. I would recommend it (though I still need to spend a little more time with it)
 
I talked myself out of the 504 HD, even for travel. Too many issues with it and it is not smooth. I am hot on the trail of a Miller Air. Everyone has it in stock with the Miller Solo DV carbon legs for $1,200.00 as a package. Problem is, I already own the Miller Solo DV carbon legs, I just want the head. B&H says they can order just the head alone for $643.00, it's rated to 11 pounds, which would work for my setup. But they say "7-14 business days" to get one from Miller. So I wrote them to see if they can check in with their Miller distributor to get an actual delivery days estimate for me. I am leaving for a shoot in South America on the 31st. I am not going to order the head unless they can guarantee I will have it by then. But if I can get it for this trip, Millers are good stuff, almost as good as Sachtler and this head only weighs 3.1 pounds, perfect for travel. I'd rather pay $643.00 for something good than $349.00 for a piece of junk.

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1220912-REG/miller_1042_air_fluid_head.html
 
Second vote for the Cartoni Focus 8. Much nicer than anything I've used from Manfrotto, including the 509. Very nice lightweight kit, though my camera is a bit heavy for it since I added an Inferno. Comes with a nice travel case too - it even has room to chuck a few light stands, and has a pocket that fits a VCT plate, too.
 
Eric Coughlin said:
Adorma has a used Air with alloy legs in excellent condition for $700.

https://www.adorama.com/us 851245.html

I used a Miller DS-10 on a shoot once and was pretty happy with it.
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Thanks for that link Eric. I jumped on that, too good of a deal to pass up. I was going to be paying $650.00 to order just the head, which I may or may not have received in time for my shoot since the head alone is a special order item. For $50.00 more I will now have the Air tripod head and another set of Miller Solo DV legs, now I will have a Sachtler and a Miller head and can sell off all of my junky Manfrotto stuff that is clogging up my garage. It arrives tomorrow. It'll be nice to have to quality setups also for my occasional two and three camera shoots. I usually take my good Sachtler and give my junky Manfrotto to the second camera op to wrestle with. My one guy I have been shooting a lot with refuses to use my Manfrottos, he just drags his ancient Sachtler and uses it instead.
 
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diegocervo said:
Have you considered the benro bv6 and bv8 heads?
I find them better than manfrotto's heads.
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You must be one of the few Diego. If you read the reviews all over the web, their video heads seem almost universally reviled, I have seen very few happy Benro users. I have some of their cheap tripods to hold my Rhino Evo slider and they are just okay (one of them came with a bent tube that would hang up from shipping so I exchanged it - the legs I have seem a bit flimsy) but their heads get bad marks for reliability and smoothness, although I agree they are a little better than the Manfrottos. But that's like saying dying of a heart attack is better than cancer, neither is a pleasant choice.
 
I own a Benro S2 and S6 head. The S2 head is decent for being very lightweight and holding the camera in place, but if you want to pan or tilt during a shot, forget about it. The S6 is okay on the tilt axis, but the panning lacks tension and is terrible. My Manfrotto 503 and 502 heads are way smoother than the Benro heads I have, and Manfrotto is mediocre.

I have Benro carbon fiber legs which are pretty decent. A couple pieces (like the bubble level and a rubber washer) have fallen off, but other than that the legs have been pretty good, they're very light, and I like the leveling setup it has over Manfrotto's non-bowl based tripod leveler. A guy I work with has various Benro legs which also seem pretty decent. He also had a Benro S4 head on his Benro monopod, and man, that head was terrible too; Manfrotto's 701 head I have is way better than the Benro S4.

There's a video company I work with that has a Red and maybe $200,000 of equipment, but they're still using Manfrotto heads on their $30,000 camera. I asked the owner and he said the Manfrotto supports the weight of his Red which is typically a pretty light setup, so he didn't see the need to upgrade, thinking more expensive heads were just meant for heavier camera setups.

I suspect people who think Benro tripods heads are good haven't used real quality tripod heads, or just do work that doesn't require panning or tilting during the shot.

There was another guy I've worked with who was in a similar situation of owning a Red and a slew of other expensive gear, and still shooting on Manfrotto tripods, and from what I recall at the time he didn't quite see the need for nicer heads (I think that was the case, or maybe he just hadn't budgeted for it yet). Eventually he converted though, thankfully, and bought two Sachtler 20 S1 heads, along with some other Sachtler heads as well.
 
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Best thing about the O'Connor is it will last you another 30 years, so that's only $330 per year.

You may think, "But I'm too old to be needing a tripod in 30 years from now." Manoel de Oliveira directed Gebo et l'ombre (2012) when he was 103 years old.
 
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That's funny, the more gear I buy, the harder I am working on our pitch packages and sizzles so I don't have to buy and haul more gear. I always say, I don't want to be pack muling gear through airports when I am in my 60s and 70s, more like a writer/showrunner is the goal. Then I can hire great DPs to shoot my shows.
 
puredrifting said:
Thanks for that link Eric. I jumped on that, too good of a deal to pass up. I was going to be paying $650.00 to order just the head, which I may or may not have received in time for my shoot since the head alone is a special order item. For $50.00 more I will now have the Air tripod head and another set of Miller Solo DV legs, now I will have a Sachtler and a Miller head and can sell off all of my junky Manfrotto stuff that is clogging up my garage. It arrives tomorrow. It'll be nice to have to quality setups also for my occasional two and three camera shoots. I usually take my good Sachtler and give my junky Manfrotto to the second camera op to wrestle with. My one guy I have been shooting a lot with refuses to use my Manfrottos, he just drags his ancient Sachtler and uses it instead.
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I just received the very lightly used Miller Air Alloy Tripod that Eric C linked to on the previous page from Adorama. I am very pleased with it. For $699.00, I scored a simple, yet very professional feeling tripod head that is quality, has internal clutches, is well made and intuitive to use. It's rated for loads from 4.4lbs to 11lbs, a nice sweet spot for DSLRs up to a stripped C300 MKII or FS7. I also received the Alloy version of the Miller Solo DV Carbon legs I have used with my Sachtler DV6 SB head for the past decade. No longer will my second camera op when I do the occasional two and three camera shoot be stuck using one of my POS Manfrottos! You can buy this setup new for under $1k or the Carbon Fiber version for under $1,100.00. Or better yet, just sit and wait until you see someone selling a lightly used Air Carbon for $700.00 or $800.00. IMHO, this is just about the perfect tripod for air travel and shooting all around the world. NO SPREADERS! Spreaders are my scourge and enemy, I hate them, they just get in the way and take more time to set up and break down. If the airline loses this Air, I am out $700.00 whereas if they lost my Sachtler, I would be out over $3,000.00. When I am not traveling, I now have a good spare or second tripod and head for my second camera op. Win-win, thanks for the link Eric! Thank goodness I didn't settle for a Manfrotto 504HD.

01Air.jpg02Air.jpg03Air.jpg04Air.jpg05Air.jpg06Air.jpg
 
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I never weighted in but I own the 504HD and Use it for my FS7. I can imagine it's not he best head and doesn't have the smoothest motion but it gets the job done for what I need. Locked down shots and the occasional slow pan but I don't shoot much with a lot of tripod movements so perhaps i'm not the best critic. I use it over the summer with my 150-600, it's pretty rock solid even at longer focal lengths. I use it with Carbon fiber induro legs, big fan of those.
 
egproductions said:
I never weighted in but I own the 504HD and Use it for my FS7. I can imagine it's not he best head and doesn't have the smoothest motion but it gets the job done for what I need. Locked down shots and the occasional slow pan but I don't shoot much with a lot of tripod movements so perhaps i'm not the best critic. I use it over the summer with my 150-600, it's pretty rock solid even at longer focal lengths. I use it with Carbon fiber induro legs, big fan of those.
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I have not shot with the 504HD but I own the old 501, the new 501, 701 as well as the MVH500AH. I universally hate all of them, they have all made my life more difficult just trying to get a decent pan and or tilt with lenses as small as my 70-200 2.8 IS II. I also use a Sachtler at home when not on the road, which I love. The Miller AIR, so far, is a good compromise. Small, relatively cheap and very lightweight with decent movement and counterbalance. The pan handle is better than my Sachtler. Friends don't let friends buy Manfrotto tripod heads. A lot of their other products I like but their video heads, yikes.
 
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puredrifting said:
IMHO, this is just about the perfect tripod for air travel and shooting all around the world. NO SPREADERS! Spreaders are my scourge and enemy, I hate them, they just get in the way and take more time to set up and break down.
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PureD, I've been considering a tripod with telescopic legs but so many people have warned me that I will hate them because they are a pain in the rear compared to lever-lock legs. But my 22 lb Sachtler 20 beast of a tripod is killing me on shoots where I have to carry it around. ( I own a Manfro 502 that I purchased for slider work but it's near useless with any camera over a few pounds. The tilt friction is either no friction or tilt-locked. )

A while back I nearly pulled the trigger on a Miller Compass 23 with the Solo 100 legs to have as my run-around tripod. You actually prefer the telescoping legs to the lever-locks? To my knowledge no one makes a 100mm telescoping tripod with the flip-lock legs like those of the Sachtler TT.

I researched to see what the Still Photogs had to say and there was no clear consensus as to whether twist lock or flip-lock were better. The twist advocates complained that the levers get caught on things ( branches ) and can pinch your hand...the flip advocates said the twisting was a pain and could suffer from a lack of tightening which causes the camera to fall. The Still-borns raved about the legs from "Really Right Stuff" but to me they just don't seem sufficiently robust for a fully decked Fs7 with x-back and v-mounts.

Lately I've been eyeing a setup using Gitzo legs. Thinking about pairing them with a Sach Video 15 or DV12.
 
JPNola said:
PureD, I've been considering a tripod with telescopic legs but so many people have warned me that I will hate them because they are a pain in the rear compared to lever-lock legs. But my 22 lb Sachtler 20 beast of a tripod is killing me on shoots where I have to carry it around. ( I own a Manfro 502 that I purchased for slider work but it's near useless with any camera over a few pounds. The tilt friction is either no friction or tilt-locked. )

A while back I nearly pulled the trigger on a Miller Compass 23 with the Solo 100 legs to have as my run-around tripod. You actually prefer the telescoping legs to the lever-locks? To my knowledge no one makes a 100mm telescoping tripod with the flip-lock legs like those of the Sachtler TT.

I researched to see what the Still Photogs had to say and there was no clear consensus as to whether twist lock or flip-lock were better. The twist advocates complained that the levers get caught on things ( branches ) and can pinch your hand...the flip advocates said the twisting was a pain and could suffer from a lack of tightening which causes the camera to fall. The Still-borns raved about the legs from "Really Right Stuff" but to me they just don't seem sufficiently robust for a fully decked Fs7 with x-back and v-mounts.

Lately I've been eyeing a setup using Gitzo legs. Thinking about pairing them with a Sach Video 15 or DV12.
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Hi JP:

I just got back from Brazil a couple of day ago and used my Miller Solo DV Carbon legs paired with the Miller AIR tripod head all over the country with my loaded up C100, which comes in at about 8 or 9lbs with everything hanging off of it. The Solo DV legs worked, as they always do, perfectly, I am extremely happy with their performance. I now own an aluminum set and a carbon Fiber set, there is just a pound difference. They also make a 100mm beefier version https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/327753-REG/Miller_1505_SOLO_VJ_Carbon_Fiber.html although I am content with my 75mm versions. If I had a bigger, heavier camera rig, I would go for the 100mm version but I try to keep things relatively small and light. The Gitzo legs seem good but are not cheap and are not really any better than the Millers for video IMHO.

As far as twist locks versus lever locks. I don't find either to be better or worse, you only have to loosen the Miller twist locks about a 1/4 turn to release them. I've been using my Carbon Fiber version of these legs for more than a decade and have never had a problem, issue or repair so to me, they are just as reliable and in many cases more reliable than lever locks. I have lever locks on all of my cheap Manfrotto junk and they have had more problems over the years with becoming loose and requiring an Allan wrench to tighten back up than my Miller twist locks. I suppose it all comes down to what you are most comfortable with but for me, it's a none issue, I use and am fine with either. As I said, spreaders are my pet peeve, they universally suck. I suppose you might need them for maximum torsional rigidity when shooting with long lenses. I will someday buy the new Canon 100-400 IS II F4.5-5.6 and then I might see that my Millers are not rigid enough, especially in high wind, but the longest lens I use now is my 70-200 2.8 IS II and it's a dream on the Miller.
 
I'm planning on purchasing a Sachtler ACE XL as a replacement for my 504HD. I'll let you know if I like it better. Does anyone have any experience with these two heads?
 
egproductions said:
I'm planning on purchasing a Sachtler ACE XL as a replacement for my 504HD. I'll let you know if I like it better. Does anyone have any experience with these two heads?
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Hmm...any Sachtler that has the word ACE on it, IN MY EXPERIENCE, is not as good as the "real" Sachtlers. ACE is a Vitec product made to a low price point with the word Sachtler silk screened on it. Not terrible but not very good either. I've owned five Sachtler heads and the ACE product doesn't look like, behave or seem as well constructed as any of my Sachtler heads. Don't you shoot with an FS7? Buy a real tripod for a camera that nice and heavy. With most tripods, you get what you pay for. For an inexpensive head, get your hands on a Miller AIR and at least try it before buying an ACE or step up your budget and get a "real" Sachtler. Most the ACE heads are on par with Manfrotto and Benro, which is not a very good neighborhood IMHO. You're in NY, go to B&H and really compare and you'll probably get something better.
 
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