Which announcement were you more satisfied with?

Which announcement were you more satisfied with?

  • Canon's EOS C300

    Votes: 22 14.3%

  • Red's Scarlet

    Votes: 132 85.7%
  • Total voters
    154
I like them both.

I liked canon form factor an really liked a opule of shorts I saw.

But Scarlet is exactly what I wanted ( on paper at least) and only 2k more then I had hoped for. So here goes the vote.
 
Although I can afford neither at the moment I found the Scarlet to be an instant lust for item. I've been dreaming about the EPIC and the possibilities but it was always a dream. The Scarlet is a possibility and for that I'm far more excited.

Need to work hard, though :)
 
For me announcement of the day was not a camera. Media Composer 6 is fully open to 3rd party hardware. Supports Native ProRes and will do AVCHD via AMA for no transcode access to footage. Not to mention a fresh new UI.


Its too early to tell on cam announcements. I think Canon's street price will come down. I think RED will ship much later then they think. I gotta hand it to RED they stole Canon's spotlight fast.
 
Canon totally underwhelmed, and Red overdelivered. Canon gave us an F3 with no capability to autofocus or autoiris and with no path to dual-link or 4:4:4, for $4000 more than the F3. Red gave us a Red One MX for 1/3 the price, in an Epic body.
 
sensor crop

sensor crop

scarlet actually, but somehow i dont get the whole "sensor crop" thing. . . i mean, when you go to 4k , you crop. . . right? so no S35, and with 2k we are below m43 sensor size. . . right?

hmm, this kinda makes it . . . "less awesome" to say the least ^^
 
once you add the price of the RED accessories, and if the Canon is sold for $16K instead of $20K, they cost basically the same - I don't need 4K, but the scarlet looks quite mighty: it seems to be an EPIC with a slower ASIC (the equivalent of the digic processor on the canon cameras) and either huge savings due to mass production or much smaller margins - I'd like to have 422 10bit in-camera on the canon, but it may have much better low-light capabilities than the scarlet, and I also fear the RED reliability issues - so for me this looks, right now, like a tie - the big looser today was the EPIC, which became a much less compelling solution for everything except overcranking - not that it matters, anyway, because my budget doesn't allow for anything over $5K... but if I'm (very) lucky I may rent one of these some day
 
Red overdelivered
Click to expand...

Well to be honest Red Over-announced. I think its huge and I think they spanked Canon, but DELIVERY is something RED does not do as well as announcements. We will see what happens.

Canon, like always, was a year late with this cam. The year to put up an F3 competitor was last year.
 
Both but I voted Red.

I think this new Red [if the images are as good as I believe they will be based on samples from the 2/3's Scarlett] will be the camera to beat.
Now to increase my skill set.....
 
I've lost all respect for Canon -- not so much because of the product (although it's obviously at least a year late), but because of their insulting marketing. I mean please:
The sensor has a resolution of 2,160 pixels tall by 3,840 pixels wide, which qualifies as native 4K... color is assembled the same way as a traditional three-chip sensor block… two megapixels of red, two megapixels of blue and four megapixels of green.​

Canon... those are not PIXELS -- they are PHOTOSITES. This may come as a shock to you, Canon, but a pixel needs red, green AND blue.

In other words, either Canon doesn't understand what a pixel is -- in which case they aren't fit to be in this business.

Or they think we don't understand what a pixel is -- which is just plain insulting.

Make no mistake, the C300 shoots at plain old HD resolution, same as my GoPro. By focusing on resolution, and trying to sucker us with their fake "4k" story, they are stupidly drawing attention away from the genuinely cool features of this camera -- 50 Mb/s, log gamma, 422.

That said, at this price, and no ND filters, and just HD... fail.

I had lost all respect for RED, because of their hideous attitude and their abysmal execution. Not to mention serious questions over product reliability. But last night's announcement told me that at least they get what people want, big time. Now, if they can deliver it, in volume, and with reliability, they win by miles.

So, RED -- pending successful product shipment.
 
I would have to say the Red announcement, and I say that as someone who had high hopes of Canon

Still, when all's said and done both cams are so far beyond my budget as to be academic.

Dave
 
Neither ! First I'll never be interested in another camera costing more than 6k. What you buy for 20k today will cost 5k in 3 years. And I think the majority here agree. Cameras are disposable . The canon only shoots 720/60p ? And no autofocus of any kind ? It is a beaut. As I said before, reminds me of a Beaulieu 5000. And the Red ...well, Scarlet looks like a cheap computer with a lens mount . Sure, along way from those CAD drawings we saw 3 or 4 years ago. I would have loved to see a decked out 2/3 fixed lens for 6k. Now , it's still a 15k package minimum. And the whole 4k thing is overkill for 99% of shooters.

Both are rental cameras for large projects. No run and guns here.

Truly Panasonic has a great opportunity to win the race by a mile.....for me at least ! The convertible design we saw a few months ago for a future gh series combined with the new lenses , new evf, and better codec , for 2k ....would sell a million, while Canon and Red are only selling to rental houses. Or Sony can repackage the fs200 and kick some tail as well . They have a new 720p evf. Why wouldn't they use it on a future fs200, maybe with a prores recording module. And the rumored alpha a900 is coming as well.

Both Canon and Scarlet shot themselves in the foot . When the world's economies are at virtual standstill or worse, collapse, and they come out with expensive cameras , esp. Canon ? I'm just puzzled.
 
What I want is full HD done right at a price I can afford.

RED wins.

Quad HD at ~s35 sensor size, RAW readout, 440 megabit data rate would give me "perfect" deBayer 4:4:4 1080p at 25 fps with maximum flexibility to crop a little if I need to and grade from red RAW files, which is exactly my "dream spec". And 60/120 fps available even if in a limited way is cool.

Quad HD downscaled in camera for perfect deBayer but then beaten to death with 8 bit 4:2:2 50 megabits, at a higher price, does not come close.

Now we'll just have to see whether RED actually delivers on the stated timescale, with a robust (non-Beta) camera. I will try a Scarlet when the London rental houses get them, with a view to that being my upgrade path in due course I think.

The Canon? Not even the beginnings of the faintest stirrings of interest at that price or that feature set.

In fact my main take away from last night is renewed respect for the capabilities of the AF100 at its price point. I'm glad I bought one, mine is a pleasure to shoot with and I'm getting much better at lighting to work around its limitations, the main one of which is 8 bit for me which is why the Canon just doesn't interest me.

Cheers, Hywel

P.S. AF100 successor with AF100 front end and HPX250 back end, 10 bit AVCIntra, with "Panasonic Log" optiona at AF100 price point = win win win for me, if you are listening, Jan :)
 
I think the most profound announcement was that AVID laid off another 200 people.
Sometimes I'm really amazed how clueless people are about the economy and it's impact on the audio/video/film industry.

With that being said... Hey, go out and spend $20K on a new camera. :Drogar-BigGrin(DBG)
 
Short term, RED. But it seems like they clamored to slap it together. Also the previous slew of expectations hurt them. Long term, Canon. More so because of the lenses and the dedicated division. I have never heard canon bad mouth the competition, it doesn't work their way into the campaigns. Ok it's pricey, but still, it runs out of the box. I like that it's a log space. I wonder if it's 8 or 10 bit. The big disappointment for me with the RED announcement is that for some reason it seems a bit lame that the person who so vehemently abhorred low rez would window down all the way to 1K. Scarlet is a 2k 60p RAW cam. Windowed. I dunno. I'd still take a REDMX over it. It's still a damn good machine, better than most out there and I can jack it up to 120fps at 2K. I dunno. In the thick of it last night I was jumping all over the place. But today, just looking and thinking of what it is I shoot, how I like to shoot, and what both made me wait for, RED didn't impress me much. I would have still preferred the 2/3rd fixed lens scarlet, with frame rates across the board without having to crop. I like 2/3rds. And yes, for filmmaking. I don't care about spatial res. I really don't. Even if I say I do, once I'm on the spot looking at a storyboard at work getting things ready there's so much more I care about. I think the canon would be much faster to work with too.

I like 16mm. It's elegant. I won't spend 15-20k (strongly believe that's still how much I'll need if I'm a first time buyer) to get the thing running if I gotta window down. RAW is RAW, but if this thing really is in log space (the canon) I dunno.

I voted canon. Big move, very long term, admittedly a business and they're not ashamed of that, no facades, no testosterone. RED are fun to watch in the ring. But when it comes to work I don't know how much more good it will do than using several other options there. Now they have a division for cine. The first product is more a symbol really. It's what's coming that's gonna rip things apart.

I foresee the Vitaliy scenario. Canon vs. Sony, RED ain't around, and Arri is a boutique niche company. In 5 years. his words.

I always say this, if the a-cam dii wen tup to 60 or 80 fps, I'd still take it over anything out there. So simple. So subtle. Really gets out of the way.

My 2 piasters.
 
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