What's the most rigid 6'+ extendable support for a gimbal?

ahalpert

ahalpert

Major Contributor
I did a shoot yesterday taking jib-style shots with my Ronin-S mounted to a light stand. I was disappointed with the wobbliness of the light stand sections shifting around inside each other and I'm looking for a more rigid extendable support. Here is the edited video from that shoot:


Manfrotto sells the GimBoom for this specific purpose, but its maximum length is only 3.8'. I want something as long as possible and at least 6' long.

Right now I'm looking at monopods at B&H and assuming that the load capacity is a good indicator of rigidity. This 3 legged thing only goes to 58" but has a rated payload of 132 lbs: https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/prod...g_alan2_0_alan_2_0_carbon_fiber.html/overview Or this Benro goes to 72" and is rated for 88 lbs: https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1604785-REG/benro_msd46c_supadupa_carbon_fiber_monopod.html

I suppose that another alternative would be to screw together threaded poles so that I get away from thin, nested tubes altogether. Or maybe the answer is just a heavier-duty light stand (although it has to be light enough for me to hoist and wave around).

Thoughts?
 
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I’d try a speed rail pipe cut to your desired length. This is also at the other end of the scale for rigidity so if that doesn’t satisfy you then anything less won’t either. In this case the best option might be the cheapest as well.

Do you truly need something that packs so small? 6’ pipe has a pretty small footprint when transported vertically.
 
rob norton said:
I’d try a speed rail pipe cut to your desired length. This is also at the other end of the scale for rigidity so if that doesn’t satisfy you then anything less won’t either. In this case the best option might be the cheapest as well.

Do you truly need something that packs so small? 6’ pipe has a pretty small footprint when transported vertically.
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that's a good suggestion but there are 2 issues. the first is that I don't always need the pole extended so far. Sometimes I use it with a shorter extension, and then I'd be forced to angle the pipe rather than holding it upright with a shorter length, which is preferable. the other issue is logistical - in this specific case, christie's wouldn't want me walking around their premises swinging a 6' pipe. or maybe it'd be ok... 2 sections of 3' in a soft case would be fine, i'm sure. maybe that's the way to go. i also use the light stand situation in churches at weddings, although usually not with jib-style moves and just at full height upright walking down the aisle for some high-angle b-roll. and my light stand was working fine for that but if i could bring in a better solution, i'd be happy, and 6' speed rail wouldn't work there either.

but i'll have to think about 2 3' pieces of speed rail...maybe that's the ticket...

if i got 2 pieces of speed rail, what do you think would be the most secure way of joining them and of mounting the gimbal at the top?
 
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ahalpert said:
that's a good suggestion but there are 2 issues. the first is that I don't always need the pole extended so far. Sometimes I use it with a shorter extension, and then I'd be forced to angle the pipe rather than holding it upright with a shorter length, which is preferable. the other issue is logistical - in this specific case, christie's wouldn't want me walking around their premises swinging a 6' pipe. or maybe it'd be ok... 2 sections of 3' in a soft case would be fine, i'm sure. maybe that's the way to go. i also use the light stand situation in churches at weddings, although usually not with jib-style moves and just at full height upright walking down the aisle for some high-angle b-roll. and my light stand was working fine for that but if i could bring in a better solution, i'd be happy, and 6' speed rail wouldn't work there either.

but i'll have to think about 2 3' pieces of speed rail...maybe that's the ticket...

if i got 2 pieces of speed rail, what do you think would be the most secure way of joining them and of mounting the gimbal at the top?
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If several lengths of pipe for various situations wouldn't work, you might have to give up some reach for the length that is the best all rounder.

What's the difference between a 6' pipe and a 3' pipe that at some point telescopes to 6 feet? I'm sure you can present them with other more serious production options (arri trinity op), then all of a sudden the results with the pipe might be completely acceptable.

You can put tennis balls on either end and lean them in corners pretty easily. If it got powder coated with black paint then you'd have a "pro" version if you're worried about how it looks.

2x 3' pieces is fine, you're just adding an extra piece in the connector:
- https://modernstudio.com/products/pipe-frame-1-1-4-sleeve?_pos=9&_sid=008fca583&_ss=r
- https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/143584-REG/Matthews_319550_Connector_for_1_1_4_Pipe.html
 
rob norton said:
If several lengths of pipe for various situations wouldn't work, you might have to give up some reach for the length that is the best all rounder.

What's the difference between a 6' pipe and a 3' pipe that at some point telescopes to 6 feet? I'm sure you can present them with other more serious production options (arri trinity op), then all of a sudden the results with the pipe might be completely acceptable.

You can put tennis balls on either end and lean them in corners pretty easily. If it got powder coated with black paint then you'd have a "pro" version if you're worried about how it looks.

2x 3' pieces is fine, you're just adding an extra piece in the connector:
- https://modernstudio.com/products/pipe-frame-1-1-4-sleeve?_pos=9&_sid=008fca583&_ss=r
- https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/143584-REG/Matthews_319550_Connector_for_1_1_4_Pipe.html
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How high can the trinity go anyway? I dont think its comparable?

But no matter because they have a set budget for shoots such as this. I dont think they were expecting me to do get that much height and do faux-jib type stuff, but I'm trying to surpass their expectations so I can gobble up more shoots. The artist requested a drone for this, which is not allowed. They were gonna do a jib but didnt have time to get the permit. So they got me with the Ronin-S. So, maybe I can convince them they just need me and my gimbal instead of a jib, at least some of the time...

Wont the tie-downs on the pipe connector loosen as I swing it around? Makes me nervous... and what would be your preferred way to rig the Ronin-S to the end of the rail? Thanks
 
I'm not sure, I was only making up an example for people all of a sudden being OK with doing things in a less refined way after hearing how much alternative options cost.

I think these two pieces could get you there:

- https://modernstudio.com/products/pipe-jr-adapter-for-1-1-4-candlestick-maker?_pos=7&_sid=8a4d2fb9f&_ss=r
- https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1244788-REG/kupo_kg014212_baby_ball_head_adapter.html

The weak link of the system looks like the single thread connected to the base of the ronin. It may be tight enough but there's still a risk of twisting. If the set up works, it'd be cool to get someone to weld a ronin quick release to the kupo part.

I don't think the sleeve will loosen but don't quote me on that, you'll have to do some tests away from any fabergé eggs. You'll also need to safety the gimbal to the pipe.

I can't see your first link to the video. Is the goal to add height for the gimbal or is it for jib type moves? Not holding the pipe vertically will get tiring quickly.
 
rob norton said:
I can't see your first link to the video. Is the goal to add height for the gimbal or is it for jib type moves? Not holding the pipe vertically will get tiring quickly.
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Here it is:


The goal is both height and jib-type moves. Originally, the artist wanted drone coverage, but that's not generally allowed in Manhattan. Then they were going to get a jib, but they didn't have time to get the permit for that because it was a last-minute request. They would be have been satisfied with ground-level gimbal coverage, but I was trying to up the ante.

The client said the video got excellent engagement on social media and they were very pleased (especially since they booked me the night prior and only gave me an hour to shoot and 2 to edit).

But I would have been happier to get a little more height. The sculpture is 23' tall.

And I would have been much happier if my stand wasn't rattling around at each of the joints. It forced me to move conservatively and not do much pivoting.

I think that for now I'm going to buy the 80" 3 legged thing monopod and see how that handles. I could use a new monopod anyway. It has advantages over the speed rail, and if it's rigid enough then it's rigid enough. If that doesn't satisfy me, then speed rail it is. I do appreciate the input.
 
rob norton said:
The shots from that first video look pretty good to me.

As yet another option, there are stand risers - probably somewhere in between the monopod and full metal pipe for rigidity:

- https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1069643-REG/kupo_ks705112_40_c_stand_double.html
- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SlFChLeUZXU
- https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/buy/Lightstand-Risers-Columns/ci/2448/N/4062040363
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The problem wasn't the footage I got but the footage I didnt get. I wanted to get a medium shot booming down the length of the sculpture and circling around it slowly. But pivoting and shifting the weight of my rig caused rattling and shifting at the joints of the light stand which shook the shot. So I had to settle for shots that kept the momentum of the unit basically going in the same direction.

And my shots on a telephoto walking in on the sculpture were hopelessly shaky, so I had to settle for lateral moves where I basically let the unit lean by its own weight. Which might have been the better shot choice anyway, and maybe no rig will let me walk in with a telephoto smoothly enough at such a long extension, but it would be nice to have the option.

Lastly, it would have been great to get more height.

Those stand risers are probably exactly what I want, but too heavy for me to safely handle with that much extension/leverage. Which probably underscores the precariousness of the whole approach. But I feel like I can muscle through controlling a lighter rig.

I have the 80" monopod now but haven't tested it yet. 3 legged things also sells a 58" monipod with an incredible rating (130 lbs) that they advertise dan be used as a camera boom. But I wanted the extra length and hopefully the 80" will be good enough (rated at 66 lbs)
 
Run&Gun said:
https://shop.redrockmicro.com/digiboom/

Forgot all about this, until yesterday...

One of my friends is actually in some of the promo material and has shot with it for network sports stuff.
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not sure how i missed that one. looks pretty much like exactly what I want, although it's expensive and has an achilles heel of payload: it's only rated for 6.5lbs? I'm pretty sure that my ronin-s + a7siii + 12-24 f/4 tips the scales at more than 6.78lbs. though maybe that's close enough... i'll have to see how my basic little monopod performs. I have wireless monitoring and control already, so I may not be so concerned about the fancy aspects of this tool
 
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