what to charge...

[Zissou]

i have a bit of a dilemma; i have a client that wants to shoot a short film, something i am neither used to nor really into yet as i do not have a full crew that is fully versed and experienced. he has a budget, and it is actually VERY realistic. Mostly im worried because i cannot possibly direct and oversee two completely different 'sets' that need to be shot simultaneously for most of the critical footage.

Cliff notes at the bottom of the post for those with short attention spans :2vrolijk_08: (sorry im rather longwinded)

ive done ad spots for him before, so im not worried about him flaking out on payment or anything, and its a few months off; i would be required to rent or acquire all the equipment myself, so 30% of company pay is up front/non-refundable.

right now i have 5 persons available for that project, 3 are basically 'paid interns' ie college film students that know very little (one is a fairly skilled photographer so im looking to him to be a cam-op). thankfully my sound editor/technician will be with me, as well as my right-hand girl who is my chief editor and a fairly good lighting co-ordinator. i will be directing and managing the set, something i have never done on this scale, and the 3 interns will basically be shadowing us and managing gear, batteries, food, etc and learning, they also get college credit but i prefer to pay them for their time.

Client wants a short about a wannabe drag car racer; permits, actors, sets, tracks, vehicles, medical emergency personnel, transportation, power, extra gear rentals, emergency money, editing, all expenses already figured in as well as our (company base rate charge) pay but i know i will need more than 3 people, even 6 i feel will be strained. Client has no interest and no time to direct it, and approached me, but assumed i would be pretty much doing it with 3-4 people; that is not logistically possible as some shots require both audio and footage from 3-4 cameras.

i have been offered a decent sum to direct it, and my 'made' employees are being well taken care of, but i am unsure of what to suggest for the interns, which i pay myself, but really dont have much skill. ive considered outsourcing for a local cinematographer whom ive worked with as an on-shoot twin, but i dont want to strain the clients budget, pay him out of pocket, or screw the interns or my high-value employees.

talked it over with my client, and he asked for a relative quote for 'misc personnel'; my question is should i go about this appropriating both the interns' pay AND the possibility of the additional cinematographer (who would both run one camera and direct the scenes down-strip as well as manage one or two of my interns) or factor it in separately, as a strong suggestion? it would be a significant price difference, at most an additional 10% to the client, as the majority of the shots he would be required to attend are pretty much full-weekend affairs.


**CLIFF NOTES**
Thanks for any input, and questions welcome too. as i stated i am new to this (and its not really my forte, though i am very excited at the prospect and the challenge), and i have NO IDEA whatsoever what to charge for my directing, for the interns, and for a potential second 'director/cinematographer' as a corolary member or doppleganger. I will also be a first time father soon, so some of my motives for a second director are personal; i do plan to bring this to clients attention as well as it is relevant.

Thank you again.

 

[Patryk_Rebisz]

Use the clifnotes to tell us a story and how many locations - that way we can be more helpful. Also see if you can see some samples from the client what he expects to see.

 

[Brooksy]

Give him a quote on exactly how much it will cost to do it. Itemize it for him. Show him the people you will have to hire out and what their pay is going to be. Show him all the equipment rental and how long post will take and what it is going to cost. Just lay it out for him. He either takes it or he doesn't. Help him to scale back and re-write the script if he doesn't think he can afford it. If you guys can't agree on a price then walk away on good terms.

If you lay it out this way not only can you go into the project confident but you also look more professional as a business. Sometimes you have to say no to show you know what your doing. Good production isn't cheap. Once the project is done and it is awesome, the client never worries about the money aspect.

 

[Zissou]

Use the clifnotes to tell us a story and how many locations - that way we can be more helpful. Also see if you can see some samples from the client what he expects to see.

14 locations, only 2 require more than 2 cameras and 2 camera operators. thus far i have done pretty much all the clients photography and ad work. i JUST realized i never actually wrote the cliffs notes.... :undecided

Give him a quote on exactly how much it will cost to do it. Itemize it for him. Show him the people you will have to hire out and what their pay is going to be. Show him all the equipment rental and how long post will take and what it is going to cost. Just lay it out for him. He either takes it or he doesn't. Help him to scale back and re-write the script if he doesn't think he can afford it. If you guys can't agree on a price then walk away on good terms.

If you lay it out this way not only can you go into the project confident but you also look more professional as a business. Sometimes you have to say no to show you know what your doing. Good production isn't cheap. Once the project is done and it is awesome, the client never worries about the money aspect.

thanks for the advice guys, im writing up an itemized list for him now as well as what points i feel are critical to making it or breaking it, costs, personnel, etc.

since ill be shorthanded for it in terms of skilled operators, im mostly worried about directing it and trying to maintain shot control and set control while directing.

thanks again