CAMCORDERS: What is the last macOS that can handle DVCProHD via firewire (from HVX200)?

toke lahti

Well-known member
I'd like to use my ancient HVX200 day after tomorrow in a small streaming event.

My "early 2009" macbook with osX 10.11 streams even 1080i/p nicely to QT7.
The "new" QTplayer has glitches in that.

MacOS 13.6.9 (mini2018) and 14.6.1. (M1pro) only shows 576i/p (yep, I'm in Europe), both in OBS and in QTplayer.

Would some panasonic's drivers or software help?

Does somebody know working sw + hw + os for DVCProHD firewire streaming?

I guess ancient computers are not powerful enough for OBS and fullHD streaming?
(My only working windows laptop with fw is also over a decade old...)
 
But are you capturing or streaming? Or both?

Short answer: Maybe macOS 11.0.1 (so 2020) - https://support.apple.com/en-us/106396

And it would require testing (Intel/Silicon) as that was the first year for Apple's new chips (gray area).

___

Long answer: There are different answers to this question and it really depends on your exact configuration.

For software-workflows:
If you'd be relying on traditional digitizing - how it worked with software back then (in that state) - then a lot of that same software that's still around today in its current state won't offer the same (or any) support because of different operating systems and general computing architecture changes (and other specific details I don't know).

DVCPRO HD is not even mentioned in the Apple ProRes white papers anymore which may or may not say something.

For hardware-workflows:
If you're using modern connections at the end of the conversion pipeline (you can get a picture/sound into a computer), it shouldn't make a difference for almost any computer in the last 20 years. If a camera can output a certain resolution and your wires and boxes are all carrying it correctly (or it's scaled preferably), almost anything will be able to read it (or something close to it).

___

I've connected a handful of 90s and early 2000 cameras to my Macs over the years (recently a MiniDV camera from the early 2000s into a M1 Silicon from a few years ago).

It's all done with a few toys from Amazon and either goes into a BM Video Assist to record or OBS through a HDMI to USB convertor that's set up in OBS as a "Capture Card Device".

And with modern AI algorithms and scaling and all that fun stuff, you can play around with the information that's flowing.

At the end of the day - we always would like the best quality possible but also have to understand that the starting source is not exactly the prettiest (old cameras), so as long as it looks pretty good and it's not squeezed or stretched (unless you want that) then maybe you'll find a way before your event.
 
But are you capturing or streaming? Or both?

Short answer: Maybe macOS 11.0.1 (so 2020) - https://support.apple.com/en-us/106396

And it would require testing (Intel/Silicon) as that was the first year for Apple's new chips (gray area).

___

Long answer: There are different answers to this question and it really depends on your exact configuration.

For software-workflows:
If you'd be relying on traditional digitizing - how it worked with software back then (in that state) - then a lot of that same software that's still around today in its current state won't offer the same (or any) support because of different operating systems and general computing architecture changes (and other specific details I don't know).

DVCPRO HD is not even mentioned in the Apple ProRes white papers anymore which may or may not say something.

For hardware-workflows:
If you're using modern connections at the end of the conversion pipeline (you can get a picture/sound into a computer), it shouldn't make a difference for almost any computer in the last 20 years. If a camera can output a certain resolution and your wires and boxes are all carrying it correctly (or it's scaled preferably), almost anything will be able to read it (or something close to it).

___

I've connected a handful of 90s and early 2000 cameras to my Macs over the years (recently a MiniDV camera from the early 2000s into a M1 Silicon from a few years ago).

It's all done with a few toys from Amazon and either goes into a BM Video Assist to record or OBS through a HDMI to USB convertor that's set up in OBS as a "Capture Card Device".

And with modern AI algorithms and scaling and all that fun stuff, you can play around with the information that's flowing.

At the end of the day - we always would like the best quality possible but also have to understand that the starting source is not exactly the prettiest (old cameras), so as long as it looks pretty good and it's not squeezed or stretched (unless you want that) then maybe you'll find a way before your event.
Both.
DvcproHD streaming doesn't seem to be working in 10.14 (with QT7, which is a quick way to check.)
OBS is available for older os'ses, but are there ready binaries somewhere?
Hmm, would "pro codecs" packet help... Where to get it...

My old mini2012 has 10.12 and "pro codecs" probably installed. There 1080i/p(1440x1080) works via FW...
 
I find it easiest to use an external HDMI capture card. I have a Magewell but Elgato is more affordable. Even if a camera has internal streaming it's easier to use a computer.
 
Both.
DvcproHD streaming doesn't seem to be working in 10.14 (with QT7, which is a quick way to check.)
OBS is available for older os'ses, but are there ready binaries somewhere?
Hmm, would "pro codecs" packet help... Where to get it...

My old mini2012 has 10.12 and "pro codecs" probably installed. There 1080i/p(1440x1080) works via FW...
I'm not really sure, probably just have to test a bunch of stuff (tough to troubleshoot without being able to see what you're seeing/doing).
 
Funny thing is that sd-dv still works flawlessly with all macs and os'ses.
Or sad.
Pretty much like "You still watch dvd-movie, but keep away those UHD-movies. They look and sound too good..."
 
Well, installed FCP to 10.14 with Retroactive 2.1.
It installed "Pro Applications Update 2010-02" and I had Pro Video Formats 2.2.1 in my archive.

Can't find 2.2.5 anywhere. Thanks to Apple to pull old sw components away.

Both QTplayer and QT7 shows FW stream of DVCProHD.
OBS (27.2.4) does not.
Time waisted.
But fun.
 
If you get a converter to use with any older cameras in the future, I like the one with a 4:3 and 16:9 button (the other ones stretch the 4:3).
 

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In your photo is a device, which takes sd-composite and turns it to hdmi. Sd-composite here in Europe has a resolution of about 400x576...

For the next event, if HVX200 is still alive, I'll buy one cheap converter, but input will be analog-component-hd.
 
Amazing how much talk I got here, thank you everyone!

Would you suggest a cheap component-hd->hdmi converter from amazon?
 
Oh, yeah, I hear you - just in general, people using old cameras sometimes like to experiment. :)

BTW, I wanted to test what you were talking about, so I pulled out a Canon HV40 and hooked it up to my M1 via FW and tried recording in QuickTime (10.5).

Sure enough, the resolution was low, 837 × 472. The exact numbers don't surprise me because they can always be off a few pixels with processes like this, but the resolution did. (I looked up a list of NTSC television standards and 852 x 480 was one of them so close enough.)

But then I clicked the little drop-down arrow by the record button in QT and saw that the default setting for quality was "High" and not "Maximum". I changed it to "Maximum" and the resolution changed to 1888 × 1062 (1920 x 1080).

You probably already checked that, but at least here is an example of a FireWire camera being able to record HD on a new(er) computer and QT.
 
Oh, yeah, I hear you - just in general, people using old cameras sometimes like to experiment. :)

BTW, I wanted to test what you were talking about, so I pulled out a Canon HV40 and hooked it up to my M1 via FW and tried recording in QuickTime (10.5).

Sure enough, the resolution was low, 837 × 472. The exact numbers don't surprise me because they can always be off a few pixels with processes like this, but the resolution did. (I looked up a list of NTSC television standards and 852 x 480 was one of them so close enough.)

But then I clicked the little drop-down arrow by the record button in QT and saw that the default setting for quality was "High" and not "Maximum". I changed it to "Maximum" and the resolution changed to 1888 × 1062 (1920 x 1080).

You probably already checked that, but at least here is an example of a FireWire camera being able to record HD on a new(er) computer and QT.
Does HV40 use HDV codec?I guess it's free and for DvcProHD Apple has to pay 1 cent per "licence" to Panasonic...

HDV is 25Mbit/s, DvcProHD is 100Mbit/s.

And when HD via FW does not work, the picture just goes black.
 
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I'm not sure but just makes no sense to me they would completely drop it just like that when it supposedly was supported a few years ago and it could go with all of the other legacy formats/codecs.

I'm so tempted to buy an HVX200 just to figure it out, I love this kind of stuff, ha.
 
I'm not sure but just makes no sense to me they would completely drop it just like that when it supposedly was supported a few years ago and it could go with all of the other legacy formats/codecs.

I'm so tempted to buy an HVX200 just to figure it out, I love this kind of stuff, ha.
Can be a mistake nobody noticed. Or less work with code rewrite to drop a codec via legacy port, that nobody uses.
Or it could be that one cent.
Panasonic do own the rights to dvcprohd codec.
 
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