What else is needed with the M2

B

bugsbunny

Active member
Hi Guys,

I am planning on buying an M2 and I want to know what else I have to buy with it. Rails of course, but what else?

I was waiting for the GO35 but that looks like it won't start really selling until maybe this summer. I need a 35mm adapter now that is good and cheap. P+S technik is out of the question because it cost way more than my camera, so that is no good.

Redrock looks like they make good adapters that are cheap. I want to buy this M2 but the website says it is mandatory to buy rails. Is there anything else that I will need?


:dankk2:
 
I was under the impression the rails came with it.

You will need lenses of course.

You will need something other than the built-in LCD for focusing. A field monitor or DVRack or something.
 
the m2 looks good for its' price. I'd go with it. I might get it too... I'm a little lost in the DIY forum. Go35 will cost more than the m2 right?
 
anyone own the M2? what was your feeling about it. I noticed they weren't in the 35mm shootout. Does this speak on their product?
 
I own it. Dig it. Got the indie package with the rails. Recently got a cheap LCD montior that I've mounted upside down for compositing shots. Waiting for their follow focus and matte box now. Can't say how it compares to other solutions, though.

Fox
 
idvfilms said:
Anyone remember what the wait is?
Click to expand...

Looks like the GO-35 won't be available anytime soon. I don't think anyone has even been able to try it out. I think I read that bklyndv isn't sending the first models out to be tested in April. So release might not be for another 6 months or more. The dates just keep changing and changing. Oh, well there was a lot of anticipation around that, but I guess everyone caught on. They will just be waiting, when they can be shooting in 35, even if they have to pay a litte more for M2.

There is also another guy, Mike Dawson, who sales adapters on here. And he only sells them for $200. I think I want one from him for my other camera and then of course I will get an M2.
 
I just found out it's "about" a 2 month wait on a M2...(correct me if I am wrong) Also someone mentioned that the M2 has gone up in price? The g-35 for $200 isn't bad?
I made my own (static) and I am planning on making a moving adapter, after I get my "ghetto flos" created as I just got the ballasts and baby plates in.
 
Jim's Go-35, a static adapter, should be out pretty soon. The M2 is a spinning GG design, different animal. The M2 with rails and achromat is $1K, and is taking 4 to 8 weeks for most folks.
 
I have an M2. I'm happy and unhappy with it. The overall design is good. When adjusted correctly it will do a nice job. But there are lots of little issues with it that are annoying. For example:

1. Aligning your DVX with the M2 is tricky because there isn't a hard connection between the two. Aligning requires you to remove the filter & gasket from the M2, invert the unit so it's vertical, slide your DVX down the rails so it's flush with the M2, then tighten down the mount to the DVX. Then slide the DVX back up, replace the filter & gasket, then slide the DVX back down to fit the lens within gasket. Then, you need to adjust the back focus. That's another set of steps.

2. Adjusting the GG. The GG attaches to the spindle on the motor. It requires fine tuning fore or aft to find the "sweet spot" for your lens. Adjusting this requires dissassembling the unit, moving the GG, reassembling the unit then testing the focus with your lens. If the GG position is off then your lens's focus distances will not be correct. For example, setting the focus ring to 6' will not be in focus at a chart 6' away. If the position is off then you have to go through the whole process of adjusting again. The good thing is that once it's done you normally shouldn't have to do it again. And it's also wise to mark the motor's spindle so that you can position the GG in the correct position the next time you need to remove it.

3. Motor noise and vibration - I purchased the AC adapter along with the M2. This may be used in place of the battery. BUT there's a problem that the adapter provides more power than the battery and spins the motor faster. This causes the motor to generate an unacceptable level of noise. I have been in contact with Redrock regarding this and they have not provided a solution. When asked if I could return the AC adaptor for a refund I was lead off away from the route and asked to try various other tests, send a photo, etc.. To this day I still can not use the AC Adaptor because of the noise problem.

Additionally, moving the unit while it is running will generate a slight increase in vibration. It is most obvious when panning the unit during a non-level shot. I believe this is caused by the gyroscopic effect of the GG. As the pan moves the unit the gyro effect of the GG works against the motor and shaft. There is a slight amount of play in the motor shaft and that combined with the panning movement and the spinning GG causes vibration. It's not too bad when using the battery but it's unacceptable when using the AC adaptor. The noise with the AC adaptor is loud enough to be heard 6 feet away.


Some good points:

1. My M2 came with a scratched from lens. Redrock was very good about dealing with that and sending me a replacement.

2. Once adjusted properly the M2 provides very nice images. Preview comments for the short we just finished commonly ask if it was shot on film. This is what we were looking for and therefore the unit has done what we wanted.
 
Hansk are you saying that the M2 does not attach via filter threads?? If that's the case, I don't understand why that would not be standard. From the product description it sure sounds like it requires 72mm filter threads??

Why don't you just install a variable resistor on one of the positive leads to your adapter? That way you can control the adapter speed. I'd strongly suggest taking a carefull look at the GG whilst spinning, preferably with an overhead light bounced off the reflective side of it. If you see any wobble (and it shows up right away) check your GG to be sure it is true. If it's true and still wobbles, the collet design they use is not perfect. It takes several tries to get the collet spinning square to the shaft. I managed to get disc runnout in my spinner (now sold) down to less then 1mm...but it took many hours in the shop figuring out exactly what the problem was. It's the collett/shaft adapter.

Noise, vibration and harshness are seldom mentioned in adapter reviews, and I'm glad to see you addressed it. I fought with that issue with the Brevis, and spent a lot of time to minimize both noise and vibration.

It's good to hear you got everthing straightened out though. I'm a firm believer that taking some time to know your product, and carefull calibration/test shooting pays big dividends in your final footage. At the shallow DOF's capable with adapters, even .5 mm misalignment of GG, or a wobbling/ out of square spinner will noticeably degrade results. In one sense, an oscillating GG design eliminates that issue.
 
guskersthecat said:
Hansk are you saying that the M2 does not attach via filter threads?? If that's the case, I don't understand why that would not be standard. From the product description it sure sounds like it requires 72mm filter threads??
Click to expand...
The achromat lens mounts to the DVX and requires the 72mm threads. Then the lens is slid forward and into a rubber gasket that is attached to a filter on the back of the M2.

guskersthecat said:
Why don't you just install a variable resistor on one of the positive leads to your adapter?
Click to expand...
Yes that's an option, but there shouldn't be a need to do something like that from a retail product.

guskersthecat said:
I'd strongly suggest taking a carefull look at the GG whilst spinning, preferably with an overhead light bounced off the reflective side of it. If you see any wobble (and it shows up right away) check your GG
Click to expand...
Good idea. I have checked it a few times but only by eye. I will try the light trick.

guskersthecat said:
I fought with that issue with the Brevis, and spent a lot of time to minimize both noise and vibration.
Click to expand...
A good test for noise and vibration is to move the unit while it's running. That will put a load on the moving parts.
 
idvfilms said:
I just found out it's "about" a 2 month wait on a M2...(correct me if I am wrong) Also someone mentioned that the M2 has gone up in price? The g-35 for $200 isn't bad?
I made my own (static) and I am planning on making a moving adapter, after I get my "ghetto flos" created as I just got the ballasts and baby plates in.
Click to expand...

I like the footage from G35. I went to their website http://www.cinemek.com but there was no way to order one. How are people purchasing them.
 
i was looking into buying a 35mm adaptor but i think i'll wait for a bit, with the new models and improvements comming out soon :D
 
bugsbunny said:
Looks like the GO-35 won't be available anytime soon. I don't think anyone has even been able to try it out. I think I read that bklyndv isn't sending the first models out to be tested in April. So release might not be for another 6 months or more. The dates just keep changing and changing. Oh, well there was a lot of anticipation around that, but I guess everyone caught on. They will just be waiting, when they can be shooting in 35, even if they have to pay a litte more for M2.

There is also another guy, Mike Dawson, who sales adapters on here. And he only sells them for $200. I think I want one from him for my other camera and then of course I will get an M2.
Click to expand...

As others have said, the wait on the M2 is at least 4 weeks from the time you place your order. For those of you looking for quality but working on a budget, I'd wait for the Go35. Jim is about done and if the footage I've seen says anything I'd place my money on the Go35. Plus he just found a new, near grainless screen which will be even better for his static adapter. Don't sell yourself short with the M2. The M2 is decent, but if it were me I'd just buy the do-it-yourself guide from them (which comes with a GG) and then make it for a lot less than $1K. That's just me though.

Mike Dawson does make a decent adapter, but for $200 you'll be a LOT better off with Jim's Go35. He's targeting that at $209 and it's WAY better than Mike's (no offense Mike). Mike's adapter exhibits chromatic aberration (because of the stacked macros). You could EASILY buy the parts for Mike's adapter for $150 or less, depending on what your GG is. If you're just talking about the main tube assembly without a GG, I can tell you what to buy to build it for less than $100 (about $60, depending on the cam), AND you don't even need special expertise to do it. Just screw the parts together and you're good. So either make it yourself or wait for the Go35. Much better bang for your buck.
 
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Personally, I think the M2 is an antiquated design. Furthermore, if you order it now, by the time you actually get it, it will even be more antiquated. There are better things on the horizon, so since you have to wait in order to get an M2 anyways, I believe it's best just to wait until some of the newly emerging adapters are compared. Then you can make an informed decision.

Furthermore, I'm very leary of any adapter manufacturer who is afraid to include their adapter in a shootout. Therefore, I wouldn't even consider purchasing an M2. I am considering a Brevis though, but I'll wait a little while for the smoke to clear before making a decision. One thing high on my list of requirements is ease of use. If it is not easy to set up and use, the chances are it will not be used as often (strike the clunky M2 of the list that means). Also, I like the idea of getting something compact so I don't have to carry around a big bulky dinosaur everywhere I go. Preliminary results seem to indicate that the Brevis will smoke the M2 in image quality while it is at it. Plus, better low light ability means you can stop up your lenses for some additional image quality while you're at it.

No offense intended, but "just say no" to the M2. Anybody that will sell you a useless AC adapter and then refuse to take it back when the uslessness of it is discovered is IMO, useless. It is not like unpacking it and trying it out has somehow devalued the adapter. Furthermore, those guys are overpriced soup Nazis. Okay, so I'm down on the M2? Not so much really. I think it was a great first generation product and had a really nice day in the sun. Now it is time to either redesign from the ground up or make way for 2nd generation adapters to flood the market.
 
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whatever you say jon, the demos from the m2 are stunning. and what shoot outs have there been yet anyway? only between the letus and sg35....
as far as the ac adapter thing.... who cares? it's not going to empty your wallet to buy a 12v battery!
the design seems to be among the sturdier of the adapters. i really like the box-like element (like the sg) which looks like it would protect the camera thread in the event of a bang to the adapter.
plus i may be a sucker for product praise on a website, but the dp's of the show '24' did test the p+s technik as well as the m2 and they had nothing but good things to say about the latter.
and the price is not that crazy...for $1k you get the rod system with the m2....most other are about 600-800 alone....comes to the same...so what are you talking about?
me, i'm gonna wait as patiently as i can until the brevis is ready and maybe the guerilla, etc, but for now, i'm between the m2 and the brevis.
 
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