This craft of screenwriting is hard !

Randall_Oelerich

Randall_Oelerich

Veteran
If I have learned anything this past year it is that writing a high concept emotionally compelling technically well-executed screenplay with a great story is very very hard. I can't do it, yet. I think I have learned what the elements needed for such a screenplay are, but to weave them all into a screenplay that is another story. At least I am not blind to the craft elements I must master, but wow, this is one tough craft. I get it now, why 99% or more of screenplays just get the "Pass." from agents, executives, readers; I suppose that is good news in a way--at least I know the standard that my yet-to-be-written winning screenplay must meet so as to be in that 1% (or .1%?). , This is a truly a craft, I see a long road and lots of hard work ahead to write a salable screenplay. Feeling a little discouraged at the journey ahead, but also feeling good in that I know what I need to do and that I will not be wasting my time sending in sub-par screenplays to readers/agents just to get rejected. Okay I will stop rambling now and get off my soap box! Anybody else want to step onto it?
~randall
 
Randall, you're absolutely right. It can be very discouraging, very humbling. I quit writing for almost 4 years early on.

It's persistence, though, that'll get you to your goal. I said it before... on average, it takes writing 9 features before you sell one. Gotta pay your dues, I guess. Another thing someone once told me (which I found even more discouraging) is that "Overnight success takes 15 years." The people you hear about now selling those scripts for big $$$ have been lurking in the screenwriting wings for a long time. It's all part of the process.

Just out of curiosity--because I know you've been reading a lot of screenwriting books lately--which one was it that finally did it? Which screenwriting book beat you down to size, so to speak?
 
kylekmd said:
Just out of curiosity--because I know you've been reading a lot of screenwriting books lately--which book was it that finally did it? Which one beat you down to size, so to speak?
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Reality check maybe? Just keep at it, and maybe find somebody close to you, that knows you well enough to think like you, and start working ideas together.
 
Here's a suggestion to make you feel better. And I'm not picking on Bryan Bertino, the writer/director, just making an observation.

Crtically look at the script for THE STRANGERS (not the movie itself). To date, the movie has made >$81M at the box office. Budget $9M.

Look at the style in which the script was written. Tell me you can't write like that, or BETTER. I know you can.

I was shocked when I read the script. Spelling errors... long, repetitive description (sometimes confusing)--things the Gurus tell us that SCREAM AMATEUR. But, I guess the ELEMENTS OF TERROR carry the script and, ultimately, the movie. The screenplay and the movie are very different in several ways.

Anyway, the point is: KEEP WRITING. You'll get there someday. Just look at what's being purchased today, and know that you can do equally well or (probably) BETTER.
 
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kylekmd said:
Randall, you're absolutely right. It can be very discouraging, very humbling. I quit writing for almost 4 years early on.... Just out of curiosity--because I know you've been reading a lot of screenwriting books lately--which one was it that finally did it? Which screenwriting book beat you down to size, so to speak?
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These three book gave me a serious blanket party (beating) this week (still reading Karle Iglesias' book):

  • The Moral Premise -- Harnessing Virtue and Vice for Box Office Success by Stanley Williams
  • How to Write High Structure, High Concept Movies - A step by step guide to writing high concept structurally foolproof screenplays by Rob Tornin
  • Writing for Emotional Impact by Karl Iglesias
Mind you this has been a two edged sword. A bit demoralizing, a kick in the groin reality check of what it will take to write a feature screenplay that gets read and that some studio decides to gamble tens of millions of dollars on to produce (can you blame studios for passing on 99%+ of all scripts, if that were my money on the line I would want only platinum plated gold screenplays to move forward on!). But as i said, on the plus side, knowing what is needed will (I hope) keep me from wasting my time moving forward on low concept ideas, keep me from writing scenes and scripts that lack high emotional value for the reader, and force me to really sequence and outline a compelling story (after first creating a high concept logline that intrigues a reader to want to read my screenplay).

The epiphany I have had this past week (which could be false, caused by cabin fever living up here in northern MN and anxious for this fricken snow to melt!), other than the above or rather related to it, is to slow down a bit and not charge forward on just any story, any screenplay idea. Better to really frame a compelling high concept logline that speaks of compelling story that all but guarantees a reader will beg to read the screenplay. Then carefully outline/sequence the story for the outer journey, inner journey, theme, moral premise, characters, world, etc.; and weave that all together. A tall task that speaks to me what a true craft screenwriting is and what is required. Ugh!
~randall
 
Randall writes: ...slow down a bit and not charge forward on just any story, any screenplay idea. Better to really frame a compelling high concept logline that speaks of compelling story that all but guarantees a reader will beg to read the screenplay.


STORY IS KING.
 
Thank you for the words of encouragement Kyle, much appreciated. I saw The Strangers (there you go, they got some of my money too!) and honestly I was disgusted at the ending, I felt the whole movie was a simple terror and violence romp, amazes me that there is a market for that type of story. But then I have never seen a Friday the 13th. I like tasteful horror (I guess you could say horror where the antagonist gets it in the end), writing and watching supernatural horror is one of my two favorite genres, the other being romcom. But then everybody is different, different genres for different folks. It is not that I dislike horror with violence and killings-- I love the Halloween series for example.

Yeah I read screenplays and some of them I figure (like all of us) I can write that good or better! I did some emails recently with a screenwriter who sold his screenplay for several million and he got there by simply (yeah, simple, uh huh, sure, LOL) knowing that all he had to do was write as good as what is sold. That is my goal too. I think as I said that part of that is taking imagination time to come up with the high concepts, or take time to tweak lower concept ideas into high concept ideas; then crystallize the high concept loglines, crystalize the story sequence with all the key elements, learn to write great scenes and great dialog. No problemo right?!

I have a lot of respect for screenwriters that get sold (go Kyle!), they have paid their dues to be sure! It is frustrating to a degree to think of writing 9 screenplays before a sale, but I have a couple under my belt so I am down to 7 more, maybe that 7th will be the sale, so that means 6 more unsold if going by the odds. And I do have a parallel plan of writing my own KISS feature to produce myself in 3+ years (whatever it takes, I will not produce my own indie unless I can come up with a high concept KISS script and get that written first).; that helps a bit, knowing one script I write of those 6 will likely be one I produce myself.
~randall
 
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Personally, I hate crises like this, but respect the hell out of them. Who knows? Maybe this is your dramatic midpoint?

Also, I've been reading William Goldman's Adventures in the Screentrade (circa the 80s). The book doesn't focus heavily on the craft itself, so much as Goldman's experience in the industry. One point he made was that beginning writers really should move out to Hollywood. Why? Because even though you'll be a waiter or a cashier or busboy, there'll be a multitude of aspiring writers / actors / directors all around you who'll share and understand your journey. That loose social support network carried a lot of significance to Goldman.

Of course, I'm not saying to move out to Hollywood. But doesn't this board (and others like it), serve a similar role? Between non-linear editing, digital cameras, and message boards, sometimes it's nice to lean back and appreciate how much better our starting point is today.

Not sure if that even remotely speaks to what you're experiencing now, but I figured I'd give it a shot. Good luck in continuing the climb to the mountaintop, knowing full well how treacherous the terrain may be.
 
Personally I want to someday live along the coast of an ocean or the sea, yeah, do it all digitally. It is pretty isolating here in northern Minnesota-- most of the ground is still snow right now. Not exactly Hollywood up here. This board really does help, at least a virtual way to interact with writers from all over the map. I couldn't move out to lala land, I would be eaten up by the vampires along ventura blvd in an instant (I think Tom Petty sang something along those lines?), LOL.
 
Warren Zevon evidently had a similar problem with London. He saw a werewolf drinking a Piña Colada at Trader Vic's.

His hair was perfect...

: )
 
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Randall_Oelerich said:
Kyle, curious--what got you back into the gladiatorial ring after those 4 years off?
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I was caught in the mental maelstrom of screenwriting.

And couldn't escape. I suspect none of us can.

That's why we frequent this board and others like it.

We try to conquer this beast, by writing script after script, knowing that the odds of success are slim to none.

How depressing is that?

Then, finally, after so many scripts, you hit the jackpot. A few more, another jackpot. It's called "Variable Ratio" reinforcement in Psychology 101 (if I remember correctly) and it's important in Gambling Addicton.
 
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kylekmd said:
I was caught in the mental maelstrom of screenwriting.

And couldn't escape. I suspect none of us can.

That's why we frequent this board and others like it.

We try to conquer this beast, by writing script after script, knowing that the odds of success are slim to none.

How depressing is that?

Then, finally, after so many scripts, you hit the jackpot. A few more, another jackpot. It's called "Variable Ratio" reinforcement in Psychology 101 (if I remember correctly) and it's important in Gambling Addicton.
Click to expand...


Sounds like a premise for a story, write that!
 
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