TC generator + audio help

T

tfg

Well-known member
Hi everyone - I like to pick your brain about a specific sound setup I am envisioning. I'm not an expert in this area, so I'm hoping someone can correct me if something if wrong with this setup, and also offer some advice on what I'm missing:


I'd like to get my 5D Mark II time-code synced with an external audio recorder.


On the recorder side, I'm thinking a TASCAM DR680 (yes, I know it doesn't support native timecode, so bear with me…).
On the 5D, I'm thinking a "lockit buddy" (http://www.lockitbuddy.com/website/index.html)


Now here's the missing link: I'm not sure which timecode generator will be able to feed timecode to both my DR680 and the Lockit Buddy at the same time.


Any advice or feedback is greatly appreciated. In case you're wondering, I will editing in Media Composer, which will be able to read the LTC timecode just fine.
 
I just posted a long response to this and for some reason it didn't work. The short of it is that this thing is stupid and that your idea is a more expensive and complex setup that what it is worth. PM me and ill give you some better options.

None of the TC generators have an easy way of sending a signal two places at the same time easily.
 
Use the TIME setting to have the files time synced. Since none of the devices you want to use can actually sync to TC this is the best you can do and it's cheap!
 
I understand what PM is. I was questioning why it couldn't be answered here; was hoping to glean knowledge from answers to his question. :)
 
here.
get a mono split adaptor
get a dual mono to stereo adaptor
wire it like so.


TC.jpg

your feeding the camera a line level signal from the mixer so the mic gains should be all the way down anyway.
splitting the TC will degrade the signal, but shouldn't be enough to matter. It's just a square-wave.
cross talk shouldn't be bad. There might be some, but to use as dailies before you sync it should be un-noticable.

I have never tried this, but there is no reason it shouldn't work.
 
I've said this before and with a minor adoption my opinion hasn't changed. And that is that TC is not worth the trouble in situations like this. The minor adaption is that apparently you can get FCP (7 and earlier) to use audio TC to link clips. That would be a minor time savings but you have added a bug time waste in production so...

There is this perception that this is how the big boys play so I want to also. And yes TC is used on big productions, now. But not until quite recently. So if you want to do what the big boys do then SLATE your shots. It really doesn't take long to sync dual system sound IF you just slate the takes. Even if you use TC you still need to slate the takes so?

Also TC does not keep you in sync. If your camera or recorder drift they will drift just as much with TC. With files TC is only a start stamp bit a continuous sync track.

Where TC makes sense is when you have multiple cameras AND they are capable of tri level sync. Then you can lock them all together and eliminate drift and have all your files stamped the same.

In the OP's case you will be better served by having a Rode VMP mounted on the camera (for reference track) and having the high quality audio not be tied to the camera. You won't have cables to trip on and every body gets to concentrate on what they do best.

I would synchronies the clocks on all the devices and that will get you with in seconds of true sync and let you know which files belong together.

And it saves you money.
 
thesoundguy said:
here.
get a mono split adaptor
get a dual mono to stereo adaptor
wire it like so.


View attachment 45448

your feeding the camera a line level signal from the mixer so the mic gains should be all the way down anyway.
splitting the TC will degrade the signal, but shouldn't be enough to matter. It's just a square-wave.
cross talk shouldn't be bad. There might be some, but to use as dailies before you sync it should be un-noticable.

I have never tried this, but there is no reason it shouldn't work.
Click to expand...

Noiz2 said:
I've said this before and with a minor adoption my opinion hasn't changed. And that is that TC is not worth the trouble in situations like this. The minor adaption is that apparently you can get FCP (7 and earlier) to use audio TC to link clips. That would be a minor time savings but you have added a bug time waste in production so...

There is this perception that this is how the big boys play so I want to also. And yes TC is used on big productions, now. But not until quite recently. So if you want to do what the big boys do then SLATE your shots. It really doesn't take long to sync dual system sound IF you just slate the takes. Even if you use TC you still need to slate the takes so?

Also TC does not keep you in sync. If your camera or recorder drift they will drift just as much with TC. With files TC is only a start stamp bit a continuous sync track.

Where TC makes sense is when you have multiple cameras AND they are capable of tri level sync. Then you can lock them all together and eliminate drift and have all your files stamped the same.

In the OP's case you will be better served by having a Rode VMP mounted on the camera (for reference track) and having the high quality audio not be tied to the camera. You won't have cables to trip on and every body gets to concentrate on what they do best.

I would synchronies the clocks on all the devices and that will get you with in seconds of true sync and let you know which files belong together.

And it saves you money.
Click to expand...

Thanks to both of you. :thumbsup:
 
Thanks to thesoundguy and Noiz2. I'm a professional editor as the day-job and I deal with timecode synced footage all day. I have done plenty of shoots exactly as Noiz2 described, ultimately relying on post to sync. It's definitely the easiest cost-to-benefit solution. I'm simply looking to eliminate this process in post, and I'm aware it requires some extra cost, making it somewhat of a luxury item.

I think it boils down to this: if I really want timecode sync I need to buy an audio recorder that will output LTC timecode into the 5D line-in and simply leave it at that. I edit in Avid, so syncing from an LTC track is easy as pie. The negative is that camera and audio are attached throughout the shoot - but that's a minor item for me.
 
You can always send the timecode wireless (via a comtek system for example) into a beachtek plugged into the 5D. I've done that for a documentary shoot last summer.
 
On a related note: I'm trying to find similarly spec'd field recorders that 1) have 4 channel recording and 2) have timecode support. The most prominent one I am coming across is the Roland R4-Pro, but there are a few negatives about: it's almost 6 years old technology now, has bad battery life, and still uses a spinning hard disk (probably doesn't help the battery life).

Are there are similarly spec'd (perhaps more modern designed) field recorders out there that I should take a look at?
 
I think your next best bet is the 744t. Age of technology should not really be a deciding factor. Look at the specs, if they line up with what you want, then go for it.

most high capacity internal drives are still spinning disks to the best of my knowledge.
 
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