Super Loud F-16s

Frizzle Fry

Frizzle Fry

Well-known member
Hey all, I'm going to be videotaping the Thunderbirds at an airshow this coming weekend. I want to make sure the very loud F16 engines don't clip, but remain very thunderous in the audio. Any suggestions for settings on the POTs?
 
You'll puke out the camera. Use a seperate audio recorder with a mic that can handle high SPL's.

Nice AV, by the way. I'm a huge Primus fan.

-Dave
 
Set levels on channel one very low to peak out when the engines are loudest. Then set channel two high for normal audio levels that will blowout during the close jet passes. Then you have both tracks that you can work with in the mix. Of course you'll lose the stereo effect of the on camera mic when the jets flyby.
 
The DVX has a built in limiter, so it's fairly hard to get audio to clip. (But I think F16's can do it). Personally, I would just set the pots to normal because the F16's are only close to you for a very short moment. If you set the pots too low, you may not be able to get the approach or the crowd noises.
 
overlandfilms said:
Primus sucks.
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:) What a bunch of complete bastards!



Thanks for the tips, guys. Sure would be cool to have the stereo effect on fly-bys, but I'll sacrifice it for good clean audio that doesn't clip. Unless I can hook up with another recording device, which I might be able to...hmmm.

On a non-audio-related note: is it a no-brainer to shoot 60i, or could I get away with 30p? Shutter speed (should be sunny)? Best way to keep them in focus as they're screaming from one end of the tarmack to the other? Will one of you come along and operate my camera for me? ;-)
 
Frizzle Fry said:
Best way to keep them in focus as they're screaming from one end of the tarmack to the other?
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Teeny aperature for a deep focus.

But if you're real close to the runway, yor pans are gonna be quick...

Me, I'm thinking about getting permission from the Public Affairs office to sit at the end of the run way get shots of 'em coming right at me. :grin:

Ooooh....and hoping to get some C-5s or -17s...

Dan
 
Dan - oh, man those would be some awesome shots!

Dave - have you seen Primus' Cheesy Home Video? They go out fishing, and I believe parts of the John the Fisherman video are on El Bastardo. Those guys have it made, eh?
 
The first time I saw Primus live (a LONG time ago) the entire crowd broke into the "PRIMUS SUCKS, PRIMUS SUCKS, PRIMUS SUCKS, PRIMUS SUCKS..." thing and I was like whoa. Then I realized that Les was leading the charge and waving his arms "PRIMUS SUCKS, PRIMUS SUCKS, PRIMUS SUCKS, PRIMUS SUCKS...". Then I realized oh, it's a cool thing.

I was slow back then :beer:
 
I was at a Packers-Bears reg. season game when a fighter did a low-level flyover before the kickoff. Yikes. 72,000 people got their hair blown back. The amount of power behind a jet fighter is unbelievable.

You need a mic with a -20db pad, and probably a high pass filter in as well--low end is a huge component of a jet engine sonic signature. If you NEED true stereo, you should have a completely separate recording rig. Set the camera audio for normal ambience and the audio recorder for stupid loud peaks.

The cheaper and easier way to go would be with the earlier suggestion to use one channel of your camera's audio for regular levels and the other for peak audio level capture. In post, you can duplicate the peak audio track, pan the copy and the original hard left/right, and screw with a variable delay to give the impression of a stereo experience. A very slight delay when the plane is far away, and a more pronounced delay during a close flyover. Or just use one track and pan it across the field of view corresponding to the visual direction of the flyover. Or some sort of combination of the two.

If worst comes to worst and your audio ends up sounding like absolute distorted crap, get the BBC sound FX library on CD and put a fake flyover in place. You can bet that just about every movie you've ever seen fighters in did NOT record that actual audio from the flyover take. Sound guys went out and got samples another day, or they used a library of similar sounds.

My take, anyway.
 
Bart, great suggestions! I tend to agree with your assessments of how it's generally done. I'm going to be going the 'cheaper and easier' route, as this video is going to be for personal use only. I think I'll get good results mixing the two channels. But, it's good to know what is the right way to do it.

I appreciate everyone's input. I'm going to jot down some notes here so I don't forget what to do when it's "button time," lol. I'll be sure to report back and maybe post clips if it turns out ok. thanks again, guys.
 
Frizzle,

One other thing to remember at an airshow...get earplugs (or wear your headphones with the volume way down.) I saw the Thunderbirds last summer (the Air Force version of the Blue Angels) and boy did my ears get trashed. Worse than a really loud concert.

You might want to look at their site to see if they have a show plan posted. One of the first passes from the Thunderbirds is very unexpected from behind the crowd. Scared the poop out of me (and if I'd been shooting, would have resulted in some messy video ;-).

One other recommendation....if the air show is two days, plan on going to both days. Shoot the first day and just enjoy and watch the show the second. Nothing worse that missing the real experience because you're watching it all through a view finder. Another reason to plan on going both days...depending on the weather, sometimes they don't fly. Which is also why I don't recommend watching the first day and shooting the second, even though it would be easier to know what their movements are. They may not fly on the second day and then you have nothing.

Anyway, either way, enjoy the show.

Phil
 
Phil is dead-on.

My additions would be this: any event you can shoot twice can really save you in post. Perhaps you take wider shots during the first day (enjoying the show a bit more), and more close-ups from another angle on the second day--provided the weather is about the same. Then it will look like a multi-cam shoot when you slap it together in post. Shooting close-ups the second day is nice, because you know what to anticipate for.

Even if this is just for "personal use," your family audience will never know, and you'll likely forget, that the event was shot over two days when you watch it a decade from now. It will look like a live multicamera shoot.
 
Hey guys, a quick report. Didn't get to read the last couple of posts before I left on thurs.

I dunno if it's worth trying to shoot these guys. First of all, it was tough to try to get closeups while zoomed in, handheld, trying to keep them in the frame. and to keep it all steady, even with OIS, was very tough. i've tried it with a tripod in the past, but there is such a range of movement that you lose a lot of shots.

so i'm going to capture when i have time, and stitch together the fluid shots i have, perhaps in time to a heavy metal song. i shot in 60i at 1/500, so maybe i'll get some nice slo-mo...

In my opinion, the Blue Angels are far more impressive, and louder, than the Thunderbirds. F-18s are better aircraft and the paint job is nicer looking. But that's just my preference. I don't mean to take anything away from the T-birds--they were awesome! Pretty loud, which doesn't bother me--guess my hearing is shot from the band years, and seeing the Blue Angels a few times. (yikes, i'm gonna be deaf when i'm 50. silent films for me!).

i'll keep y'all posted. oh, on the original topic, i used Sirius' suggestion and I believe it's going to work beautifully. Thanks, everyone!
 
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