Suggestions & Critiques for my lighting (vids)

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leaftors

Well-known member
http://vimeo.com/21116038
This is a video of what's inspired us and what kind of lighting/feel/mood we're trying to mimic.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TLJ6wtgKdY0
 This is our footage. We had a 1k mickey with blue gel over it bouncing off of the ceiling. The other light source was the sun from the window on the left of the subject. It was cloudy and raining that day around 5pm.

Couple things:

1) I was shooting at f/4.0 iso 400. Why does it look noisy? Is it because of the blacks? Also why do some areas look pixelated? (is it artifacts?) for e.g. at 0:51 top left corner.

2) I know I need a hair light, and some fill on the left of the subject.

3) We are shooting in an abandoned building. There is no power so we have to run ac from a building next door. There are 2 outlets on separate circuits available from that building so I don't have that much power available (not sure how many amps but we placed 1k in each outlet and it was fine.) We also have a 1200w generator if we need it.

4) In terms of matching the overall colour temperature, some suggested to cto the windows so I wouldn't have to gel the tungsten lights. What are the advantages/disadvantages in going this route compared to placing ctb on the tungsten lights?

5) We're limited to tungsten lights.

6) I emailed the dp from the vimeo video and he said he had a 2.5hmi from outside, 120 4 bank kino flo (is that 120wattsx4?) as toplight, and rosco panel light on the side of the subjects

We are planning on doing another test shoot this saturday with additional lights so any feedback, suggestions, advice, etc is appreciated.
 
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Generically speaking, you can have noise at any ISO. Exposure is what gets the noise to pick-up. ie: underexposed more noisy than over exposed. As far as suggestions, I'd up the ISO in a minute, looking toward better overall exposure. I recently Shot video outside of Urban Polo, using street lamps. I shot a 4k ISO. I got Neatvideo's noiseware and am happy with the results.

I am on my POS monitor but I didn't see any noise, just a dark video. Didn't see any pixelation either.
 
leaftors said:
http://vimeo.com/21116038

5) We're limited to tungsten lights.

6) I emailed the dp from the vimeo video and he said he had a 2.5hmi from outside, 120 4 bank kino flo (is that 120wattsx4?) as toplight, and rosco panel light on the side of the subjects

We are planning on doing another test shoot this saturday with additional lights so any feedback, suggestions, advice, etc is appreciated.
Click to expand...


Since I don't know exactly how the reference clip was setup and shot... here's the kino flo 4 bank photometric info page.
http://www.kinoflo.com/Lighting%20fixtures%20with%20Remote%20ballast/4Bank,%20Double,%20Single/4bank%20select/Photometrics.htm

However, with your clip, to me it is way under exposed. If the settings were F/4 @ 1/50 (for 24 fps) and an ISO of 400, I say, go up to 800 or even 1600... which of course entails more digital noise...

In comparing the reference clip to your test, there are several significant differences. I'm presuming your going for the office scene at 00:22, where a man is sitting at a desk in a room.

1) The top light is 'brighter' as seen on the man's head and shoulders.
2) There's a fill light coming from behind the camera that pretty much sets the minimal level of the shot. The darker desk areas go 'very dark', most of the items in the shot are low value, but the top light gives a high value that maintains the outline shape of the man.
3) There is a window, but at this initial shot, that window light, on the right of the frame, does not seem to add to much to the ligthting on the 'set' but does add a reference value and 'balances' the dark values on the frame left.
 
I think your concept might benefit with some rim lighting to help define the subject, i.e. increase the light ratio of highlight to dark. On the reference footage, might there have been some diffusion like a half white frost spreading the light a bit?
 
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leaftors said:
http://vimeo.com/21116038

This is a video of what's inspired us and what kind of lighting/feel/mood we're trying to mimic.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TLJ6wtgKdY0

This is our footage. We had a 1k mickey with blue gel over it bouncing off of the ceiling. The other light source was the sun from the window on the left of the subject. It was cloudy and raining that day around 5pm.
Click to expand...

...I hate to say it, but your footage doesn't really look much like the "Useful" video you are trying to mimic. The main image attribute of the "Useful" video is that it has no true blacks in any part of the scene, it looks like the gamma was adjusted when the film was graded so that all dark tones register much lighter. ( it's not a look that I am fond of, but I can understand why they might have chosen this )

1) What camera were you using? What camera settings did you use? How was your footage handled in post?

4) If you CTO the windows, you end up with more exposure from your tungsten lights and less from the outside world. As long as you can get the ratio you are after, the net effect is that it will make your tungsten exposure 1-1.5 stops brighter.
 
TheDingo said:
...I hate to say it, but your footage doesn't really look much like the "Useful" video you are trying to mimic. The main image attribute of the "Useful" video is that it has no true blacks in any part of the scene, it looks like the gamma was adjusted when the film was graded so that all dark tones register much lighter. ( it's not a look that I am fond of, but I can understand why they might have chosen this )

1) What camera were you using? What camera settings did you use? How was your footage handled in post?

4) If you CTO the windows, you end up with more exposure from your tungsten lights and less from the outside world. As long as you can get the ratio you are after, the net effect is that it will make your tungsten exposure 1-1.5 stops brighter.
Click to expand...

I was using a 7d 1/50 f/4.0 iso400 auto white balance neutral settings. No post was done with the footage it's all straight from the camera.

When I'm lighting it, should it appear like daylight/brighter in the camera and do all the darkening in post? What's a good ratio to follow with the lights?

This is the plan so far tomorrow:

1) Shooting around noon daylight hopefully not cloudy or no rain. CTO the windows to match tungsten.

2) 1k mickey bouncing off ceiling.

3) 1k fresnel as hairlight/toplight

4) 1k mickey or bounce card for fill. I'll stop this down with scrims/gels because I think it'll be too bright. Should I add diffusion?
 
leaftors said:
I was using a 7d 1/50 f/4.0 iso400 auto white balance neutral settings. No post was done with the footage it's all straight from the camera.
Click to expand...

The 7D is usually pretty good for noise, especially at 400 ISO. If noise becomes an issue, you can always clean things up with the NeatVideo plug-in during post.

leaftors said:
When I'm lighting it, should it appear like daylight/brighter in the camera and do all the darkening in post? What's a good ratio to follow with the lights?
Click to expand...

Yes, generally you want the shadow areas to have some detail that can always be darkened in post. ( if you shoot too dark then there won't be any detail to adjust in post )

As far as lighting goes, it's really an experience thing. It takes a lot of practice to be able to light intuitively, but one general rule of thumb to keep in mind is this: The Camera Only Sees What Your Eyes See

So if the lighting looks correct to your eye ( achieves the mood you want, looks believable, etc... ), then it's largely a matter of working within the limited exposure range of your camera. For DSLRs we are talking 8 to 10 F-Stops from pure white to pure black, so the contrast has to be controlled through proper lighting. ( key lights set the mood, fill lights control contrast ) Having a calibrated field monitor, or at least one that can display false-color IRE exposure also helps a lot.
 
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