Sound design copyright issue

marvinhello

marvinhello

Well-known member
Hi I'm recently working on a scene where two actors are sitting in the living room watching TV, the TV was muted and not shown in the shot. The sound has to be added later. Question is, can I use a short sound clip from other films or TV programmes to get the effect that they are watching it in that scene. Will there be any copyright issue of doing this? The sound clip has nothing to do with the story and is purely for adding ambience.
 
marvinhello said:
Hi I'm recently working on a scene where two actors are sitting in the living room watching TV, the TV was muted and not shown in the shot. The sound has to be added later. Question is, can I use a short sound clip from other films or TV programmes to get the effect that they are watching it in that scene. Will there be any copyright issue of doing this? The sound clip has nothing to do with the story and is purely for adding ambience.
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Soundtracks to a TV show are copyrighted works just like music. You absolutely would have to get permission from the copyright owner to use a clip, whether it be both the audio and video you use or just the audio only. Look at the credits to any major film and you'll see every sound that comes from another source, be it a song supposedly coming from a radio in the shot or a video on a TV in the background, etc, is credited and labelled "used by permission."
 
If nothing is seen on-camera (i.e. only the sound track is heard), then simply stage a brief "radio drama" recording session with an original script of your own. It appears that is a frequent "work-around" to using real (and copyright-protected) broadcast program material. Sometimes the "show within a show" is more complex with multiple camera setups, editing, SFX, etc, especially if the content is part of the storyline. We have seen an increased number of real TV shows (and even movies) seen in TV shows and movies, but note that they are all done with license from the rights owner, and in the case of big-budget films, you can bet that there were several zeros on the check paying the license fee.

Note that we are all speaking form the perspective of our own jurisdiction (country). Licensing laws, procedures, and fees can vary significantly from one place to another. For example in some countries acquiring a sync license is just as easy as getting a mechanical license in the USA.
 
thanks everyone! Sounds tricky! I've tried Freesound.org but can't find anything useful, do you know any source for downloading copyright free materials for "TV sound" in a film?
 
marvinhello said:
thanks everyone! Sounds tricky! I've tried Freesound.org but can't find anything useful, do you know any source for downloading copyright free materials for "TV sound" in a film?
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You're not going to find copyright free recordings of actual TV shows. As soon as a show is broadcast for the first time, if not before, copyright kicks in. The only way to do it without licensing it is to write and perform your own material for a simulated TV show, recording the performance and "worldizing" it by playing back the recording through a TV set and recording THAT playback so it sound like a TV on-set would sound..
 
Steve House said:
You're not going to find copyright free recordings of actual TV shows. As soon as a show is broadcast for the first time, if not before, copyright kicks in. The only way to do it without licensing it is to write and perform your own material for a simulated TV show, recording the performance and "worldizing" it by playing back the recording through a TV set and recording THAT playback so it sound like a TV on-set would sound..
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Thanks, I think I'm just gonna use some old films/TV shows that have fell into public domain.
 
You might have to check on this but I believe everything on the Internet Archive is in the public domain. They have done some checking and everything should be. There are a number of old films and TV shows on there.

I know of a number of films who have used footage from there with out a problem.

On the flip side it's often not hard to do your own "TV show". And then you know you are in the clear.

I have created a "Lucy show", a Jerry Springer one, a Hong Kong action film, Late night TV ads, A National Geographic show. All completely fake free of rights issues, and it's a lot of fun.
 
Many things you could do, as said above. If it's just for ambience, why not create something that adds a little bit more to the theme of the film?

Other possibilities are very old public domain material. I know that It's a Wonderful Life is public domain. That's one of the reasons it became such a holiday hit -- any tv station can broadcast it for free.
 
The copyright status of "Its a Wonderful Life" has been a strange story. Even when the released film fell into public domain (because of a clerical error in 1974) it appears that the story and sound track were (and still are) still protected by copyright, and because it was a derivative work (based on a book, "The Greatest Gift"), the lawyers managed to wrangle the copyright of the motion picture back. Even when it seemed to fall into PD, TV stations were still required to pay exhibition royalties.

An interesting summary of the story can be found at: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Its_a_wonderful_life#Release
 
Noiz2 said:
You might have to check on this but I believe everything on the Internet Archive is in the public domain. They have done some checking and everything should be. There are a number of old films and TV shows on there.

I know of a number of films who have used footage from there with out a problem.

On the flip side it's often not hard to do your own "TV show". And then you know you are in the clear.

I have created a "Lucy show", a Jerry Springer one, a Hong Kong action film, Late night TV ads, A National Geographic show. All completely fake free of rights issues, and it's a lot of fun.
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We did a soap opera among other things. It was a blast actually.
 
Buddy of mine had a similar scene, character lounging on the couch flipping channels waiting for a friend to show up.

He used several of his prior works. Created a DVD to play back over the TV. Had about a dozen, or so clips, with a countdown to next transition on each clip. This was looped. The actor would "click" the remote to the countdowns and actually turn off the TV with the remote when the other actor comes in. Had the audio playing over the TV with it casting light on the actor. Worked really well.
 
Crafters of Light said:
Buddy of mine had a similar scene, character lounging on the couch flipping channels waiting for a friend to show up.

He used several of his prior works. Created a DVD to play back over the TV. Had about a dozen, or so clips, with a countdown to next transition on each clip. This was looped. The actor would "click" the remote to the countdowns and actually turn off the TV with the remote when the other actor comes in. Had the audio playing over the TV with it casting light on the actor. Worked really well.
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I wouldn't go the route of actually having the audio come out of the TV unless you KNOW the scene will be done in a single shot. That's asking for an editing nightmare. Turn the TV on with the volume all the way down so you get the flicker and the change in the flicker when he changes channels then add the audio in post.
 
There are a lot of filmmakers here who have short films languishing in obscurity. Maybe one of them would let you use a clip from one of their films for your background ambience.
 
isn't there a difference between programs on a channel which one has to pay for and on the "free" channels ? Or you don't have those ?

If I sound like "hhhuuuuuu ??? what does he mean ?????? huuuuu ???"... don't worry it means it doesn't exist in your country :-p
 
I'd just record some stuff and then run it through the Speakerphone plug in and have that as a BG layer. I'd have it so the dialogue is unintelligable anyway if it isn't important to the main story.
 
dre83 said:
isn't there a difference between programs on a channel which one has to pay for and on the "free" channels ? Or you don't have those ?

If I sound like "hhhuuuuuu ??? what does he mean ?????? huuuuu ???"... don't worry it means it doesn't exist in your country :-p
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No.
 
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