Shutter Speed Vs Shutter Angle

K

Kenneth Lau

Active member
I know this has probably been discussed many many times.

I have been reading it myself as well, and learned about the equivalent conversion of shutter speed and shutter angle.

However, I am still not sure setting it to Shutter angle instead of SHutter speed has any effect on the picture itself. ( Especially in cameras like RED ONE, where you can choose shutter speed or angle )

Are there any pros can cons of setting it to shutter angle instead of shutter speed??
 
They are the same thing, angle only refers to using a film camera, you'd change the size of the shutter by extending the angle of the "shutter".

Shutter speed is just the shutter angle transferred the amount of time light is hitting the film
 
Zacatac said:
They are the same thing, angle only refers to using a film camera, you'd change the size of the shutter by extending the angle of the "shutter".

Shutter speed is just the shutter angle transferred the amount of time light is hitting the film
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Shutter angle is the same thing to shutter speed, however shutter speed, such as 1/60 or 1/200 is always just that... 60th of a second or 200th of a second.

Shutter angle is different depending on FPS. 180* degrees of 24fps is a shutter speed of 1/48. However, if shooting 60fps it's actually 1/120. Something to be aware of if you are not familiar with using both ways.
 
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yay I get to post this again

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In my opinion, the advantage to setting the shutter angle in degrees is that if you change your frame rate to do under or overcraking, you'll get the same motion blur characteristics.
 
AndrewGentle said:
In my opinion, the advantage to setting the shutter angle in degrees is that if you change your frame rate to do under or overcraking, you'll get the same motion blur characteristics.
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But you won't.

If you set your shutter angle in degrees, say 180*, and change your frame rate, your blur characteristics will be very different! 24fps will be 1/48, 48fps will be 1/96. The 48fps footage will have less motion blur. Do you mean setting the shutter angle to relative mode, where the camera adjusts the angle for you?




For instance, I often shoot particular shots that directors say they might want in slight slow motion or regular speed, they will decide in the edit. Thus we shoot slow motion and have the option to remove frames in post. We typically shoot 48fps as it's very easy and clean to pull 24fps from it. Whenever this happens, I shoot 360* shutter at 48fps.. This is because if they decide they want regular speed, and remove frames, it will look and match the other footage we have shot at a 180* shutter at 24fps. Had I kept the shutter at 180* for the 48fps, and then removed frames to get the footage at 24fps, the footage would look like 24fps shot at a 90* shutter aka 1/96... and this would look much different in motion blur qualities.
 
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Great info here Ryan. Is 1/96 like that fast shutter effect you see in all gladiator movies, or do you have to get even faster than that?
 
Faster than that, but you are going in the right direction! :)

The Gladiator battle scenes were shot at various frame-rates at a 45* shutter.

The film used Panavision Platinums, GII's, Arri III's and a Aaton XTR.... The Platinum can only go to 36 or 40fps (not sure) with a minimum shutter angle of 50*. The GII should be the same from memory. The Aaton XTR has surprising fps for being so friggin' small. It can go up to 75fps, but it has hardly any shutter options outside your usual suspects. Now the Arri III was likely the workhorse for the battle scenes. It is the only camera they used that can have a shutter below 50*... in fact it can go past the capable 45* all the way down to 15*! It can also go up to 50fps native and 130fps with the high-speed unit.

I don't know the framerates used, but I do know the shutter speed would have been insane at 45*... that is why you can see the particles of dirt flying through the air! At 60fps a 45* shutter would be 1/480, at 75fps (max natively) it would be 1/600, and at 130fps (the max with HSunit) it would have been 1/1040!

I'm actually curious how the HSU works. I know it is 24v instead of 12v, which is the typical voltage. I'm wondering if it's a coincidence that pumping 24v's into the camera gets you almost exactly 2x the maximum motor speed! Feed it the juice and away it goes! I wonder if there is more to it. Seems harmful to the motor.
 
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Ok I've been shooting 60p and sometimes leaving the setting at 1/48th and sometimes 180 degrees. What you're saying at 180 degrees I'm getting around 1/120th of a second frame speed, but if I leave it set for 1/48th, then I'm getting 1/48th.
 
starcentral said:
Ok I've been shooting 60p and sometimes leaving the setting at 1/48th and sometimes 180 degrees. What you're saying at 180 degrees I'm getting around 1/120th of a second frame speed, but if I leave it set for 1/48th, then I'm getting 1/48th.
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If shooting 60fps, it is impossible to be shooting at 1/48th shutter speed. A wide open shutter would yield 1/60th of a second shutter speed, as you are capturing 60 frames in one second.
 
ok, got it now.... :S

I'll have to check what the shutter has been changing too when I shoot overcranked, I never really noticed.
 
starcentral said:
^ yes I know, I'm saying no matter what the frame rate ie. 24p or 60p if you shutter is set for 1/48.... then its 1/48th.
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Yes you are right, but as I pointed out earlier, the longest exposure shutter speed changes if you change the FPS you are shooting. If shooting 24fps the most OPEN your shutter can be is 1/24, 48fps is 1/48, 120fps is 1/120.

But say the shutter is 1/120, than the motion blur qualities of the footage (per frame) will match from 120fps all the way down to 1fps, so long as all frame rates are shot at 1/120. But anything over 120fps will not be able to have a shutter as open as 1/120. See what I mean?
 
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Thanks so much for these information guys.
At the end, I prefer shooting with Shutter Speed. Makes everything more simple : )
 
Kenneth Lau said:
Thanks so much for these information guys.
At the end, I prefer shooting with Shutter Speed. Makes everything more simple : )
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Fortunately most DSLSR (if not all...) use shutter speed, rather than angle... the problem of course is since still cameras are not 'thinking' traditional film in this regard, the closest you can get in most cases is 1/50 for a frame rate of 24 fps. I've seen people recommend 1/40 rather than 1/50... But that's sort on the order of 'preference'... for 60 fps one has the approximate 180 deg. shutter speed of 1/125...

The only real 'problem' is if one is reading a recommendation for a shutter angle, say for dealing with 'flicker free' shooting for a given type of light... then one may have to calculate out what that is, rounded to the nearest DSLR shutter speed.
 
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