Shooting b-roll

flimflamfilms

flimflamfilms

Well-known member
Good afternoon.

As I am working on my first documentary, I'd appreciate hearing how other filmmakers go about collecting b-roll. Thus far I have been conducting my interviews first, going over the footage, and making a list of b-roll footage based upon the narrative of the interviewee. This seems to make sense to me, but never having done this before I'm wondering what I might be missing.

Cheers,

John
 
Quick thoughts: try to get as much b-roll as you can on location before/during/after the actual interview. The person's desk, what's on their walls, in their bookshelves, them staring off into space waiting for you to get started, everything. When you're editing, you're going to want to make edits in their interview without necessarily going "somewhere else" visually, out of that room into real world b-roll footage. And I've found that a quick image of the stuff pinned to someone's bulletin board, for example, can show a ton of character information. So get everything you can of them on location, follow them around a bit in their office/studio/home, even if you're not planning on using the audio from that footage. You (or your editor) will be glad you have those options in the edit.

In terms of going out and shooting related b-roll, it really depends on the subject matter. But one caveat, and this is my personal opinion: don't feel like you have to show images of literally everything the person discusses. And try to steer clear of cliches... I just watched a doc in which the interview subject talks about traveling to Paris, and sure enough, the b-roll is the Eiffel Tower. Try to steer clear of b-roll that's too literal, your audience can figure out images and sequences that are a little more abstract.
 
Plexi,

Thanks very much for your valuable input. I think I was very much in danger of going 'too literal', but I agree completely with your caveat. I did get a chuckle about Paris and the Eiffel Tower. Fine illustration!

I just want to say how much I appreciate your experience and your willingness to address my questions.



Cheers,

John
 
You're welcome John. My rule of thumb on documentary b-roll is that it should only be there if it's actually increasing the viewer's understanding of something discussed in the film. It should add something, not just be a visual analog of what the interviewee is saying. It's a sum-of-the-parts thing. I feel the same way about motion graphics... if they're not there to help explain a concept that's hard to verbalize, then they probably shouldn't be in the film. Too many filmmakers feel like they need motion graphics and After Effects work in their docs now, just to make things visually exciting. I don't agree. If you show me a doc that's full of graphics fireworks, 9 times out of 10 they're there as a crutch for weak direction, editing, or photography.

I'll stop ranting now!
 
Plexi,

Rant away, my friend; what you rant about is valuable.

I shot my second interview yesterday and, as per you fine advice, shot a bunch of b-roll before and after. During was not possible as I am a one-man crew and was involved in the conversation which, by the way, was so much better than my first interview due in no small part to your thoughts on 'Providing Questions to Interviewee'.

Again, many thanks for the very fine education.

Cheers,

John
 
quick bit of advice:
any exterior broll...use your sticks!! i'm so sick of seeing beauty shots or whatnot that are shaky. there's no reason why the camera person should not use his tripod, that's what it's there for! trust me, i've been editing a few projects lately, and the lazy asses are going handheld on exteriors and it looks like crap.
okay, that was my rant for the day.
 
Great name flimflamfilms, say that real fast 6 times.

Plexi your so correct in that if it doesn't enhance that story line it shouldn't be there whether its a roll or b roll. Continuity in the story is very important and adding things like graphics can become distracting from the story your trying to convey.


Go and see when (The Cats of Mirikitani) is going to play on you public tv channel. They use graphics sparingly and never get in the way of the story.
Its a great story and a wonderful documentary.
 
plexi said:
...I feel the same way about motion graphics... if they're not there to help explain a concept that's hard to verbalize, then they probably shouldn't be in the film. Too many filmmakers feel like they need motion graphics and After Effects work in their docs now, just to make things visually exciting. I don't agree. If you show me a doc that's full of graphics fireworks, 9 times out of 10 they're there as a crutch for weak direction, editing, or photography.

I'll stop ranting now!
Click to expand...

Ken Burns would disagree!

:)

e
 
Hey Flim,

this is an excerpt from The Shut Up and Shoot Documentary Guide by Anthony Q. Artis

"If you only have a short time with your subject, you're going to have to figure out how to best get some supporting images. Often, I'll try to grab some B-roll, immediately before and after the interview, of the subject doing whatever they would naturally do in the environment. As with cutaway shots, any B-roll you shoot may be needed by your editor to make a problem segment work, to cover up a problem with another shot, or it may be just the right shot to make visual poetry... The best case scenario is to schedule some separate or additional time to follow your subject and shoot action shots. ... Think of ways to have subjects demonstrate the subject matter.

Good luck Flim.:-HeadPhones(D
 
Beyond grabbing interview subject b-roll, don't feel the need to shoot a ton until you're pretty far into the edit. Entire sections 'might not work' or need to be trimmed for time. A lot of time & effort can go into a b-roll shoot for material that may not end up in the final cut.

Conversely, you can get very creative when you know exactly what you need for a section. i.e. We had no way to travel back in time (or to Paris) and get video of a slain Iraqi nuclear scientist for the Military Channel. We did have time to grab a sheet, a hotel room, some fake blood and French crime scene tape. Knocked it out in about 15 minutes, threw on some effects and voila!

Raid on the Reactor
 
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Many thanks to all who have contributed to this discussion; it's a real education for me.

I've read (somewhere) that it is not uncommon for documentary filmmakers to shoot 2-3 hours of b-roll for ever hour of interview. As a neophyte (the Greek word for 'noob'), this sounds like a lot. So far I've been able to manage about 30-40 minutes of b-roll for each of the one hour interviews.

Ultimately, I guess, if the b-roll is pertinent and of quality then perhaps the quantity isn't as big an issue.

Cheers,

John
 
Any such guidelines should be tossed and forgotten immediately. I won't even ask where you read this. Forget it. That's one of the craziest things I've ever heard. Anyone suggesting {or subscribing to} any such rules obviously has some bizarre agenda.

Say someone appears only for a quick sound-up (or not at all). Well, you just wasted plenty of time and tape. If you find a compelling subject who becomes a pivotal storyteller or interesting character, you'll be happy to arrange more shoot time with them if you don't get it on the day. Great problem to have.

Most important thing to do is just LISTEN. Don't read what someone says you should shoot. Listen to what your subject is saying. That will drive your decision. As in, 'This guy is terrible' or, better yet, 'This is amazing. I wish I'd brought more tape'. Again - great problem to have.
 
fever,

I appreciate the insights on this. I guess the fact that I can't remember where I read this should say something about the source.

At any rate, I couldn't agree more about the listening.

Cheers,
John
 
plexi said:
Quick thoughts: try to get as much b-roll as you can on location before/during/after the actual interview. The person's desk, what's on their walls, in their bookshelves, them staring off into space waiting for you to get started, everything. When you're editing, you're going to want to make edits in their interview without necessarily going "somewhere else" visually, out of that room into real world b-roll footage. And I've found that a quick image of the stuff pinned to someone's bulletin board, for example, can show a ton of character information. So get everything you can of them on location, follow them around a bit in their office/studio/home, even if you're not planning on using the audio from that footage. You (or your editor) will be glad you have those options in the edit.

In terms of going out and shooting related b-roll, it really depends on the subject matter. But one caveat, and this is my personal opinion: don't feel like you have to show images of literally everything the person discusses. And try to steer clear of cliches... I just watched a doc in which the interview subject talks about traveling to Paris, and sure enough, the b-roll is the Eiffel Tower. Try to steer clear of b-roll that's too literal, your audience can figure out images and sequences that are a little more abstract.
Click to expand...

I think that's really good advice. I was trying to explain this, in reverse, to the marketing department of the company I'm working with on these virtual tour videos. We need voiceover text written up and I told them don't make voiceover text that's just going to say what the viewer is seeing, viewers aren't stupid, you don't have to say, "Here you see a dining room, there are lots of tables, and here you have a room with a bed," I mean get real. It should be related but ENHANCE what you're seeing, in this case, like, "We serve three gourmet meals per day and take special consideration of our residents' dietary needs," etc. Or in this case like you said, you have the audio and the interviews, you don't want to make the stuff inserted into it so literal that it's just laughable.

I'm working on a documentary or "making of" project and in my case I'm basically shooting b-roll first, because to me it's not really b-roll. The interviews I'm doing after that, because they aren't the visual basis of the film, the b-roll is, even though the interviews will provide at least 50% of the audio (the rest will be voiceover, but the b-roll will be all m.o.s. I think because it's BTS footage that's not good sound quality anyway). It's kind of backwards in a way, I suppose, but it doesn't much matter how it's collected as long as you have a clear idea for how it will be edited. It's going to be a crazy amount of editing, I haven't done any docu work yet.
 
B-roll is hard for me too. My first doc, I had no b-roll because I simply didn't know of its importance. My current two docs, I did get b-roll but still feel like I need more. I was also lucky enough to get a bunch of home video for my film about identical twin sisters. But B-roll I would say is my weak area for making docs. I'm getting better though. :) It also helped that I kept the camera on at all times so I was able to get shots of interviewees waiting for me or interacting while they are waiting for me, etc. I also filmed the photoshoots I setup for both films that were to get images for promotional material. I was able to use this footage for b-roll too.
 
I just shoot what is needed while out that day. I've never had to reschedule a shoot for b-roll.
 
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