Shooting a commercial - Do I need release forms?

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elodis

Member
Hi There-

Im shooting a commercial for a bar. We're going to have the usual crowd in bar etc... Is a notice at the bar entrance good enough, or do we need to worry about getting written consent from every person in the bar? I've been to concerts/etc where all I've seen is a notice stating that video cameras are rolling/etc and that you may appear on these recordings/etc. Just hoping that's all we need. If it matters, the bar is in Texas.

Thanks!
 
To be on the safe side you could always have a general release form with a bunch of lines below for people to sign and print their names as they enter the bar. (along with a large sign as well). That way you will avoid the chance of someone suing later and saying "Hey I didn't see the sign and now my wife is leaving me 'cause she saw me in the bar that night with another woman".
 
ozduc's advice is good. Having a "sign in" sheet with a notice posted should do. I would say that it isn't absolutely necessary to get everyone in the crowd to sign a release, but it doesn't hurt to cover yourself.

I've been on a few shoots that have involved large crowds in public places and I generally don't worry about getting releases, unless I plan on interviewing them or something like that. I'm not a legal expert, but I've found that asking the person to say that they're giving me permission on-camera has worked for me.

You may want to get the owner and/or manager of the bar to sign a location release too.
 
thank you both. I guess I'll do the sign at the entrance and have the bouncer get the signatures... i'm guessing name and signature should be enough? I doubt it will be a problem. The owner is also planning to make an announcement to the crowd before any filming takes place.
 
For commercials, there is no such thing as Fair Use. So if someone is recognizable for even one frame, you'd better have a release from them, or they could sue the production companys, the advertiser, and the station (and probably win). Keep in my mind, that for releases to stand up, there'll need to be an exchange of something of value. (a lot of people use $1 in these situations).
 
I agree with pheboglobi - use in commercials is very different from other uses. It gets into implied endorsement. In a feature, if your main character walks down the street and you see others, their expectation of privacy is different from those being used to promote a product.
 
Im confused. If the people are well aware - verbally and visually informed - how can they claim they didn't give permission? This is an indoor shoot. It's not like I'd get random passerbys in the frame or anything. They would be told at the door. I know I've been to concerts of big bands/etc... that have placed such notices and have gone on to sell dvds of their concerts in which I could have very possibly been recognizable in the footage?? is this to say I could have sued pearl jam or whoever for their footage?
 
My comment applies only to those people that say, despite the sign or the bouncer, that they were not properly informed and were, consequently, not aware. "Verbally and visually" gives you no proof of permission. My suggestion is that, because it is for a commercial, it be a much more formal agreement. Yes, if you did not specifically give your permission at the concert and the material was used in a commercial (and that is the key part), it is actionable. Most of the time people decide that it's not worth the time and effort going up against corporate lawyers; you would still have to prove damages.
 
Concert videos are not commercials, and the law treats it differently. And as another note, depending on the station you are advertising on, their lawyers may not clear your commercial for broadcast without the proper clearances - like signed releases for talent, music, etc. Why? Well, if someone should sue, they are held liable too, and they'll want to protect themselves.

It sounds like you should probably consult a lawyer before you go any further.
 
elodis said:
Hi There-
Im shooting a commercial for a bar. We're going to have the usual crowd in bar etc... Is a notice at the bar entrance good enough, or do we need to worry about getting written consent from every person in the bar?
Thanks!
Click to expand...

Don't risk your business, your reputation, your finances or your project on "The Bouncer" at the door!!!

YOU are responsible and should have YOUR person on the door with the releases; two people prefered. One handing out pens and releases in line and the other collecting them at the door with the bouncer as back up.

Do not trust the client or bar owner to collect releases. They want people inside spending money and releases slow the line down. Mr. Bouncer lets his buddy through and you're the one hosed. Make sure you get employees, owners, band, managers and crew too if there's a chance they'll be in it.

Music rights as mentioned above are a deal breaker as well.

It only takes one person to slip through to put you out of business and depending on your business structure for you to risk your other assets like house and car. Just being incorporated is not the protection most people think it is.

Who is insuring the shoot? You or the club owner? If the club, then make them provide you with a Certificate of Insurance naming you as the Additionally Insured for General Liability. One drunk or crew or band or employee, trips, falls, light in eyes, film crew, smart lawyer sues everyone involved. Just defending yourself can cost $50,000 easy.

I don't mean to make things overly complicated but there are reasons behind all the established business practices in our profession. With that comes risk and higher prices for doing the work.

Just protect yourself because clients, crew and employees will not always act in your best interests.

Robert Starling
 
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elodis said:
Hi There-

Im shooting a commercial for a bar.
Click to expand...

Yeah, sorry. I must have overlooked the commercial part when I responded, which presents you with a different situation than what I was suggesting. Most of what I've shot involving large crowds has either been concerts or events, and pheboglobi is more on it than I am by saying that concert videos are not commercials, and it gets into that whole endorsement thing.

I suppose that theoretically, you could say that by appearing in a concert video, you endorsed the band and you didn't give them permission and weren't compensated. I'm not an attorney and I'm guessing that nobody else here is (correct me if I'm wrong), so I would consider pheboglobi's advice of consulting with one if you can.
 
elodis said:
Im confused. If the people are well aware - verbally and visually informed - how can they claim they didn't give permission?
Click to expand...

Because people LIE for a variety of reasons that is why releases must be in WRITING and signed. For children you must have a LEGAL guardian sign for them, not the neighbor or aunt or sister.

People get mad at bars, mad at girlfriends, cheat on their spouses, lie about where they are. They do stupid things when they drink or don't drink and you've just ruined their life or their character. Or, they just see you as an easy mark for being too lax to get a proper release.

I've had paid talent with releases where they were the only one in a set up commercial shoot that five years later suddenly develop amnesia when they see their piece run again. That's the day you get the Certified Mail nasty-gram from some maggot attorney for their scummy little greedy wannabe actress client who is trying to suck your wallet out... that's the day you're damn glad you can walk back to the files and fax them the SIGNED MODEL RELEASE they "must have forgotten about". This exact scenario is one of about ten instances in 28 years that has happened to me. It's more common than you think.

Go find my post on running a succesful business; your job is to run a business and to protect it. If you do your job, then you'll be able to do the fun stuff and survive.

I don't mean to be so harsh about it but if you want to be a Producer or whatever you need to study more than how to make the camera do pony tricks; you've got to understand all the aspects and responsibilities of your profession / craft! Protect yourself; no one else will !

Also, always write a brief description on the release; something like "long brown hair, red shirt, pearl earrings" or get a copy of their driver's license. Not just so you know they are really Jane Smith but so when you use their shot as the main clip you can go back to that wrinkled nasty little stack of releases where you can't read the name or signature and make sure you've got her release...just to be safe.

Robert Starling
Starling Productions, Inc.
Las Vegas, Nevada
 
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What about using your cam....
A wide angle shot of all in the bar. You say...
"raise your hand if you object bo being on video"

Kick that guy outta the bar and start the shoot
 
Rather than a wideangle shot, I´d put up a cam at the entrance and let everybody say their name and city (John Smith, LA) into the camera before entering the bar. Along with posters or small handouts explaining the shoot in detail and a free beer or coke as a thank you, that should do the job.
With only name and signature, people could still use a fake name...
 
One of the fun things about life is you get to take chances. Lawyers exist by making sure you pay for it. It's your shoot, but were it mine I'd say robstar1 nailed it.

Lots of ways to approach this - one I've seen used before

Bars and bartenders have favorite patrons. Get the owners to schedule a private "pre opening - invitation only" party. Nobody gets a ticket without a signed release - and they can't be "under the influence" when they sign. Impress on the Bar Owner they're in the front line on this - believe me, anyone in the alcohol business understands liability! With any panazz and a few catered munchies they can turn it into a hot marketing buzz thing in it's own right and you get a selected, motivated and enthusiastic crowd. They'll be far more attentive and you might be able to sneak all the lights you're gonna need back out before some drunk brands himself on a fresnel.

Get a cheap digital camera - have a pa grab a head shot of each person holding up their release form & ID as you collect them - otherwise you'll play hell figuring out who's who.
 
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