SD MixPre, Procaster and HMC-150: Not getting very good results:

S

szimmer

Well-known member
Hello,

Today I got my SD mixPre and Procaster in the mail. I hooked it up with my Panasonic HMC-150 and did a few sound tests.

Unfortunately, I was not very impressed with the results so far. However, this could very be because I am a newbie when it comes to Audio.

Here are two sound samples.

www.aguayuda.org/Uploads/SoundSamples.zip

One sample is from a Samson C01U USB condenser Mic and the other is from the Procaster connected to the SD MixPre and my HMC-150. My HMC-150 has a line input which I set it to.

I have to use relatively high gain on the mixPre to even get audible sound.

SD mixPre
Gain is set at 75%
Pan = Center
High Pass Filter = 80Hz
Limiter Swich = on


If I compare the two sound samples, the Samson does not sound so bad for 75 bucks 3 years ago.

Any guidance should be appreciated. I own Sound Forge Pro 10 so maybe there is a workflow that I should be following to getting better sound.

But as of now, I spent ~$900 for something that does not sound very good. :( I am sure the equipment is good, I bet I am just not using it correctly yet.

Anything obvious that I am doing wrong?

Thanks in advance,

Simon
 
I'm assuming your main use is voice over? What exactly are you not happy with?

The procaster is a far better mic in my opinion, but it's a dynamic, and you need to learn how to use it. Very generally speaking, dynamics require more gain and you have to work them a lot closer.

Watch the video on the rode site with Ken Sparkes, he does a pretty solid job explaining how to use it. http://www.rodemic.com/microphone.php?product=procaster
 
Hello,

I did see the video you mention before I bought it. I liked the sound which is why I bought it.

I was about 6 inches away from the procaster when I did the recording.

I guess what I don't like about the sound is that to me it sounds the same compared to the Samson which cost 75 bucks. 75 versus ~900 is a big difference.

Simon
p.s.
Yes, the main use is for narrations.
 
First off, if you paid $900 for the Procaster, you got completely hosed on the deal. I assume you're including the cost of the MixPre in that number.

Next, 6" is rather far away for a dynamic. The inverse square law shows us that when you double the distance between you and the mic, the SPL is reduced by 6dB. (A change of 3dB is a doubling/halving of the sound level, so 6dB is a rather significant change.) This is why you see singers "eating the mic" when on stage using an SM58 or other random dynamic mics. Get right in there, the closer the better. Talk across the mic rather than straight into it to avoid plosive popping. If you're getting more bass than you want, pull back just a hair.

What I think you might be looking for is for the mic to somehow change the sonic qualities of your voice into that of a Don Lafontaine or Ken Sparkes or similar. That's just not going to happen no matter how much you spend. If you're looking for a particular sort of voice, you hire the guy with that voice. Others here can tell you way more about voice work, hopefully someone else will chime in.
 
Hello,

LOL! Yes, I was including the mixPre with that ~900 dollars.

I shop from B&H so normally they have the best prices. The procaster was $230.

Since my last post, I used my wireless sennheiser lav and liked the quality much better with the SD mixPre. The extra gain really makes a difference.

I see your point about the sound work. I have 15 days to return the mic so I have some time to practice. I "think" I like the mixer so I might keep it but not impressed with the mic just yet.

I do appreciate the tips and will try them out now.

Simon
p.s.
Who is Don Lafontaine?:shocked:
 
You might want to trade the mic for a Heil PR40. It's about the same price and it is also a Dynamic but has a very hot output and that might be a better match to the MixPre. I love the MixPre but it doesn't have enough gain to deal with some mics well.
 
Why are you recording onto the HMC-150? Bypass cameras whenever possible.

You might get better results feeding the Procaster (via the SD?) straight into your NLE in post.
Cheers.
 
szimmer said:
Hello,

LOL! Yes, I was including the mixPre with that ~900 dollars.

I shop from B&H so normally they have the best prices. The procaster was $230.

Since my last post, I used my wireless sennheiser lav and liked the quality much better with the SD mixPre. The extra gain really makes a difference.

I see your point about the sound work. I have 15 days to return the mic so I have some time to practice. I "think" I like the mixer so I might keep it but not impressed with the mic just yet.

I do appreciate the tips and will try them out now.

Simon
p.s.
Who is Don Lafontaine?:shocked:
Click to expand...

The late Don Lafontaine was the baritone voice of tens of thousands of movie trailers. "In a world of ...."

Dynamics like the Procaster do have a fairly low output and require more gain in the preamp than a typical condensor mic. That shouldn't present any problems with a quality preamp like those found in the SD products.

I will concur with Raster's question regarding recording to the camera - why????? Send your preamp output directly into the line input on your soundcard. Use the Mixpre's "Tape Out" TRS jack to the computer's "Line In" since those are both at the -10dBv "consumer" line level.

Also, another consideration is that your chain is only as strong as your weakest link. When you evaluate the results, what are you listening to the playback on? I don't recall you saying you had a proper audio interface and monitor speakers for playback and it's hard to evaluate your sound quality if you don't have a high quality reproduction system.

If you are going to record to the camera (actually, this applies to the computer as well), have you properly aligned the MixPre to your camera for the test recordings you've made so far? Turn on the MixPre's 1kHz tone and adjust your camera's audio linput levels to show -20dBFS on the camera meters, then leave 'em in that position. Do all of your gain adjustments from then on at the MixPre. When the 0VU LED is lit and the +4VU LED flickering you should see recording levels on the camera's meters of about -12dBFS on normal speech. For VO work where there are no sudden shouts etc to worry about, you could record a it a bit hotter, use a calibration level of -18dBFS or even -12DBFS but +4dBU = -20dBFS is the SMPTE specification level so use that for starters.
 
Last edited:
Stephen 2012! :)

Stephen 2012! :)

Hi Stephen,

Once again you have given me good advice.

I did not set up the camera and mixPre correctly. You are correct.

I forgot that I have to adjust the camera meter's down. They are actually at the default setting which is quite high.

I want to use my camera to record because I thought that was the whole reason I am getting a portable mixer so I can use it with my camera to get better quality sound.

My desktop has a very generic sound card in it. At the time I bought the desktop, I did not think of needing a better one for recording sound. So I prefer not to use the computer for narration though I understand the advantage.

Therefore, I would like to stick to using my camera, mixer and procaster setup.
Again, I was quite pleased with the mixer results and my two lavs (countryman and sennheiser).

Let me try to configure my camera and mixer correctly using the steps Stephen explained.

I hope that will do the trick. I will let you know how it goes in about 10 days. I am off on vacation now and hopefully avoiding Hurricane Earl.:undecided

Thanks for everyone's input. It is always appreciated.

Simon
 
"Why are you recording onto the HMC-150? Bypass cameras whenever possible."

I would have to disagree with Raster. Or rather qualify what he suggested. For dialogue, a PannaCam will do just fine. Are there better options, yes. But recording to cam is a viable option for dialogue.

Grant
 
szimmer said:
...
My desktop has a very generic sound card in it. At the time I bought the desktop, I did not think of needing a better one for recording sound. So I prefer not to use the computer for narration though I understand the advantage.

Therefore, I would like to stick to using my camera, mixer and procaster setup.
Again, I was quite pleased with the mixer results and my two lavs (countryman and sennheiser).

...
Simon
Click to expand...

You can always add a higher quality external audio interface that connects to your computer via USB or Firewire. What is your playback arrangement you use to listen to your recordings / productions?

EDIT Sept 11

Sound Devices just annouced a USBPre2 2-channel USB audio interface. It looks like it could also be used as a standalone replacement for the MixPre if you work up a power supply for it. It may be the solution to your issues, killing two birds with one stone.
 
Last edited:
Finally good results!

Finally good results!

Hello,

I am back from vacation and was able to try out the Procaster with the SD Mixpre today.

After configuring the Mixpre properly with the HMC-150 the sound improved a lot.

Also, I took various peoples advice about how important the positioning of the microphone is when doing narration.

I am happy with the purchases now. Thanks again for everyone's help.

Now it is time to practice, practice and practice. :cheesy:

Simon
 
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