scripts

In case anyone is interested, the present issue of Creative Screenwriting magazine (Vol. 12 #5 - the one with Steve Martin on the cover) has an article on Final Draft vs. Screenwriter. I think the article is illuminating, because (at least to me) it came off as vapid and unhelpful.

I think that illuminates the fact that both programs are great and it falls to the user's tastes to prefer one over the other.

Fun though to watch the debate between groups of users (FD vs. MM). Kinda like the Mac vs. PC debate, only with proponents in both camps that know how to speak in sentences ...
 
Dahopafilms said:
Fun though to watch the debate between groups of users (FD vs. MM). Kinda like the Mac vs. PC debate, only with proponents in both camps that know how to speak in sentences ...
Click to expand...

LOL!!! :grin:
 
Dahopafilms said:
Fun though to watch the debate between groups of users (FD vs. MM). Kinda like the Mac vs. PC debate, only with proponents in both camps that know how to speak in sentences ...
Click to expand...
Ouch! :laugh:



INT. CALLAGHANFILM'S OFFICE - DAY - CLOSE ON CHAD

who is laughing his ass off.
 
I remember hearing screenwriting guru Robert McKee say, "If you story is good enough no one will care if it is written in crayon on toilet paper."

It is all about the quality of the story - not the software it is written with. :)

Chris
 
CMessineo said:
I remember hearing screenwriting guru Robert McKee say, "If you story is good enough no one will care if it is written in crayon on toilet paper."

It is all about the quality of the story - not the software it is written with. :)

Chris
Click to expand...
Chris,

I understand what you are saying about the importance (and lack there of) of great stories. But...

I wouldn't advise someone just starting out to allow format to take a back seat to style. The vast majority of professional "readers" would never make it to the third page on a script that wasn't written in the traditional/proper format. Our little discussion on various software was intended as such. Though we can all agree that a good story idea is important...what is done with that story idea is as important, if not more.

This disagreement is not so much with you, but with the gentleman that you quoted (which I assume is this fellow... http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0571210/)

Cheers, :beer:

Chad
 
I don't think McKee was telling people not to stick to the professional, industry format... just over dramatizing that a good story is a good story and what matters most.

Yeah, a crayon writter script will more than likely not get a second glance before it is tossed into the garbage pile.

McKee tends to be a little dramatic in his dialogues and I think if you take his quote literally the man appears to be mad... but his whole seminar/book is called STORY. His sole purpose to bang into your head the importance of a good story told well.

If you have that, then yea it doesn't matter what software you use to professionally lay it out. Just don't write it in Crayola. :thumbsup:

-Robert
 
Robert,

I wasn't taking him literally...and the idea still seems mad to me. Like I said before, a balance between style and form is crucial, and even the loosest interpretation of his words tells me that form isn't nearly as important.

One other point...

I've heard over and over again that some are great doers and some are great teachers, but why is it that all of these seminars are taught by "great teachers" who never quite made it to the deep end of the creative pool. Don't get me wrong, my two year old daughter absolutely adores Barbie as the Princess and the Pauper...but would I pay its story consultant money to tell me cliches about the importance of great stories? That would have to be a NO.

You and I agree & disagree with the same frequency, Robert. But, again, this is not directed at the quotee, but at the quoter.

:beer:

-Chad
 
Chad,

I agree. I have worked as a reader and a screenwriting instructor and I love the craft of screenplay writing and format.

My point was simply that I have seen beginning writers spend countless hours worried about whether to "Cut To" or not "Cut To", when their stories really needed the attention.

I didn't mean to dismiss the importance of good format.

Chris
 
True, but for all his rantings and ravings McKee does make a lot of excellent points and sense in his teachings about the art of telling a story--not the form in which its told.

Taking just one quote from someone out of context doesn't really accurately reflect someone's intent. McKee is someone to teach you all about story and how to tell one, not the form itself. I think anyone who would take the quote literally (I didn't think you did) should have their heads examined.

In the end, you NEED good form and a good story to get anywhere.

I take McKee and all the other gurus, teachers, advisors, etc. with a huge grain of salt. For all their b.s. there may be one great pearl of wisdom.

My niece loves Barbie as the Prince and the Pauper as well. I think I can act the whole thing out by now from memory while standing on my head.

:thumbsup:

-Robert
 
Chris & Robert,

In that case, we are all in total agreement.

For what it's worth...
I feel that proper format itself is the only aspect of writing that can be taught. Aspiring writers can take this structure and use it as a language with which to tell the story they have to tell. As far as the creative side goes...it's either there with you or it ain't. No amount of seminar bullshite is ever gonna change that. Form and structure should IMO be stressed and restressed again.

Of course I feel (not to get off topic) the same way about the "big three" film schools. My advise would be to take that $120k and make one hell of a film (or even eight crap ones.) Hell, you can learn basically everything you need to know from the web (especially from DVXUser) and from experimenting.
:thumbsup:
 
CallaghanFilms said:
Chris & Robert,

In that case, we are all in total agreement.

For what it's worth...
I feel that proper format itself is the only aspect of writing that can be taught. Aspiring writers can take this structure and use it as a language with which to tell the story they have to tell. As far as the creative side goes...it's either there with you or it ain't. No amount of seminar bullshite is ever gonna change that. Form and structure should IMO be stressed and restressed again.

Of course I feel (not to get off topic) the same way about the "big three" film schools. My advise would be to take that $120k and make one hell of a film (or even eight crap ones.) Hell, you can learn basically everything you need to know from the web (especially from DVXUser) and from experimenting.
:thumbsup:
Click to expand...

Definitely! I think what schools/seminars/etc can do is inspire you. That's about it. I have always thought the best way to learn something was to do it. Theory, lectures, etc. don't mean a whole lot in real world uses. I found a lot use in books, articles, etc. just to be able to say...yup, I knew that.

Converely, though I do feel there is some merit to schooling or education of some kind in the field. Not all great actors just get up and well act. There is a process to it all, and I think there are somethings and some people that can be benefit from certain types of schooling (not just talking standard school)--like user groups, meetings, watching 900 hours of "making of" programs, reading, etc. I think a healthy combination of both is necessary for most people, that being real world experience and learning experience.

See Chad-we do tend to agree just disagree on the language used, I think. :thumbsup: I was thinking about that last night. Ultimately at the core we are usually saying the same thing, just different ways.

-Robert
 
CallaghanFilms said:
For what it's worth...
I feel that proper format itself is the only aspect of writing that can be taught.
Click to expand...
I hate to start a new disagreement, but I totally disagree with this statement. :)

I have seen dozens of students learn how to write better though instruction. It think it is mostly a process of self-discovery, but a good instructor can really help.

Chris
 
Well, I own both MM2000 and FD7 and keep them both up-to-date. I've written with both but my personal preference is Final Draft. They are both excellent programs and both will do the job. For me it is all about "feel", and FD7 feels good to me. It really doesn't matter which you use, they're just tools...albeit better than most others... Having both, I can collaborate easily with just about anyone, if I choose to.

Prior to FD7 adding Tagger, I would write the screenplay in FD6, then import it into MM2000 and break it down for exporting to Gorilla software. Now I don't have the extra step.

My recommendation would be to download the trial version of both and see which you feel more comfortable with.
 
Writing can be honed. You can learn how to write a good story, whether or
not you have natural ability, I don't know, so you could learn how to technically
tell a good story, you can develop into a good writer.
 
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