Rode video mic pro- "sounds" promising :)
- Thread starter roei z
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unclebob6958
Well-known member
The Rode "VideoMic" series is aimed at consumers, not filmmakers. The so-called Pro is aimed at the DSLR crowd. (Just because it has "pro" in the name does not make it a piece of pro gear.)
Noiz2
Sound Ninja
THe less connected a mic is to the camera the less you have to be worried about picking up camera noise. BUT any mic mounted ON the camera is going to pick up some camera noise but more importantly is not going to give you anything close to acceptable performance for a narrative film. These mics are designed to be an improvement over what is built into the camera, and they are a vast improvement over the DSLR built in mics. That still puts them WAY below what you can get with a boomed mic and an operator who has a clue as to how to boom.
For scratch track they are great, for run and gun doc work they are a lot better than what comes with your recorder.
I would probably argue that they are "pro" equipment, just not in the way many would imply. If I'm doing a "pro" shot with a DSLR (and there have been a fair number) I'm going to slap one of those video mics on the DSLR so my scratch track is good enough to sync to, and maybe even good enough for dailies? That is a "pro" use. But I'm not going to use that audio for final picture because I'm smart enough that I budgeted for a real sound person to do production tracks and I'm going to have my post sound person (also in the budget) phase those tracks to my guide track.
For scratch track they are great, for run and gun doc work they are a lot better than what comes with your recorder.
I would probably argue that they are "pro" equipment, just not in the way many would imply. If I'm doing a "pro" shot with a DSLR (and there have been a fair number) I'm going to slap one of those video mics on the DSLR so my scratch track is good enough to sync to, and maybe even good enough for dailies? That is a "pro" use. But I'm not going to use that audio for final picture because I'm smart enough that I budgeted for a real sound person to do production tracks and I'm going to have my post sound person (also in the budget) phase those tracks to my guide track.
Chadfish
Veteran
I think this looks like a great mic for the DSLR set. Now I know one can go all Pro and use a mixer and XLR mics and get stellar results. That's not who this mic is geared for. It's for the many people I answer the questions of, who have very limited budget and just need a mic to get in their camera or recorder without a mixer and a lot of fuss. With that 20db boost you can get that signal OVER the noise level many of these cameras make. I put in a question to Rode to see if the resulting level with the 20db boost is at line or mic. I'll report back when I find out. I'm also trying to get one to demo/review for you folks.
A lot of DSLR guys are wanting to get decent audio into their cameras, but with limited budgets something like a mixer to boost the signal, and getting that signal over the camera's hiss, they are without a means to get decent audio. They usually either want to go straight into the camera at mic level (worst solution depending on the mics sensitivity) or they want to go into a recorder like the H4N or DR-100. With the new VideoMic's 20db boost it seems that a mixer/preamp may not be necessary to get that added signal level. Now, as most DSLRs only have a mic level input, I am not sure that the 20db boost will help going straight into the camera IF the resulting level is "Line". That is why I want to know that info. If the boost does make the signal line level, you could go into the line-in of these recorders, which is great for noise reduction. And one would have the choice of running the mic at line or mic level. That's great versatility! So there are benefits to either scenario of whether the mic is line level or not with the boost.
I love new products!
I just watched Guy's video in the snow and it sounded great from a pretty far distance. However a snowy environment like that is basically like being in a treated studio, so any mic's reach would improve shooting in that environment. Still I thought the sound was great for a mic going straight into his DSLR. Nice work Guy!
A lot of DSLR guys are wanting to get decent audio into their cameras, but with limited budgets something like a mixer to boost the signal, and getting that signal over the camera's hiss, they are without a means to get decent audio. They usually either want to go straight into the camera at mic level (worst solution depending on the mics sensitivity) or they want to go into a recorder like the H4N or DR-100. With the new VideoMic's 20db boost it seems that a mixer/preamp may not be necessary to get that added signal level. Now, as most DSLRs only have a mic level input, I am not sure that the 20db boost will help going straight into the camera IF the resulting level is "Line". That is why I want to know that info. If the boost does make the signal line level, you could go into the line-in of these recorders, which is great for noise reduction. And one would have the choice of running the mic at line or mic level. That's great versatility! So there are benefits to either scenario of whether the mic is line level or not with the boost.
I love new products!
I just watched Guy's video in the snow and it sounded great from a pretty far distance. However a snowy environment like that is basically like being in a treated studio, so any mic's reach would improve shooting in that environment. Still I thought the sound was great for a mic going straight into his DSLR. Nice work Guy!
roei z
Veteran
thanks Chadfish.
i would really like to know how well this mic could maneuver the on camera noises, especially when shooting & handling the camera in a quite set.
like Noiz2 said, this could be good for tripod and docu style instant usage, but i'm not sure i could avoid the separate shotgun boom and recorder, even when
dealing with a no budget narrative work. i'll still need some kind of parallel recorded ambiance track won't i?
i would really like to know how well this mic could maneuver the on camera noises, especially when shooting & handling the camera in a quite set.
like Noiz2 said, this could be good for tripod and docu style instant usage, but i'm not sure i could avoid the separate shotgun boom and recorder, even when
dealing with a no budget narrative work. i'll still need some kind of parallel recorded ambiance track won't i?
Sam Mallery
Well-known member
DVeStore really failed on that mic test. Shooting in the woods in powdery snow tells me almost nothing about this mic.
One thing that needs pointing out is this +20dB functionality seems like it will only benefit people who own cameras with manual audio control. That's why the test was done on a 5D mkII. If your camera doesn't have manual audio adjustment, the +20dB switch will likely boost up the mic's signal to distortion.
That said, seeing as I plan on buying a GH2 which has manual audio control, this mic looks interesting.
The negatives: The Rode VideoMic Pro requires a 9volt battery in order to operate. That's bad because 9volts are physically larger than a single AAA (which is what the Sennheiser MKE 400 runs off of). The large battery compartment makes the mic itself a lot larger. Also, 9volt batteries aren't as readily available as other kinds of batteries.
The positives: If the +20dB thing works out, it could be the best sounding 3.5mm mini-plug on-camera mic (providing that your camera has manual audio control - and you know how to set it). I really like that they include a free DeadCat windshield. That's a big plus. The shockmount on the original VideoMic is terrible, and it looks like they've improved it.
I just bought a Sennheiser MKE 400 last week, with the $40 additional windscreen. UPS hasn't even delivered it yet. Yes, I read Philip Bloom's blog too, so I knew a new on-camera mic was coming soon. I just love the size of the MKE 400, and the new VideoMic Pro is obviously significantly larger than the MKE 400. It looks a lot like the MKE 400, but with a big honking 9volt battery compartment built into it.
I'm going to have to think this over before I crack open my new MKE 400. I may return it for a VMP, but I also may not. I want a mic I can carry around with me every single day. That's why the size of the MKE 400 just rocks.
roei z - I think if you had this new VMP and a boompole, you could get decent audio on a shoot. Could you get better audio with the VMP plugged into a portable digital recorder? Yes. If you had a portable digital recorder with a 3.5mm mic input, you could record into it and into your GH2 if you used a Sescom cable.
One thing that needs pointing out is this +20dB functionality seems like it will only benefit people who own cameras with manual audio control. That's why the test was done on a 5D mkII. If your camera doesn't have manual audio adjustment, the +20dB switch will likely boost up the mic's signal to distortion.
That said, seeing as I plan on buying a GH2 which has manual audio control, this mic looks interesting.
The negatives: The Rode VideoMic Pro requires a 9volt battery in order to operate. That's bad because 9volts are physically larger than a single AAA (which is what the Sennheiser MKE 400 runs off of). The large battery compartment makes the mic itself a lot larger. Also, 9volt batteries aren't as readily available as other kinds of batteries.
The positives: If the +20dB thing works out, it could be the best sounding 3.5mm mini-plug on-camera mic (providing that your camera has manual audio control - and you know how to set it). I really like that they include a free DeadCat windshield. That's a big plus. The shockmount on the original VideoMic is terrible, and it looks like they've improved it.
I just bought a Sennheiser MKE 400 last week, with the $40 additional windscreen. UPS hasn't even delivered it yet. Yes, I read Philip Bloom's blog too, so I knew a new on-camera mic was coming soon. I just love the size of the MKE 400, and the new VideoMic Pro is obviously significantly larger than the MKE 400. It looks a lot like the MKE 400, but with a big honking 9volt battery compartment built into it.
I'm going to have to think this over before I crack open my new MKE 400. I may return it for a VMP, but I also may not. I want a mic I can carry around with me every single day. That's why the size of the MKE 400 just rocks.
roei z - I think if you had this new VMP and a boompole, you could get decent audio on a shoot. Could you get better audio with the VMP plugged into a portable digital recorder? Yes. If you had a portable digital recorder with a 3.5mm mic input, you could record into it and into your GH2 if you used a Sescom cable.
roei z
Veteran
Thanks
So a question for you: how do you handle avoiding the camera sounds?
My lens cause OIS noise which rules out camera mic usage.
How would the rode solve this (from your videomic experience)?
Sam Mallery
Well-known member
Thanks
So a question for you: how do you handle avoiding the camera sounds?
My lens cause OIS noise which rules out camera mic usage.
How would the rode solve this (from your videomic experience)?
If you have a 2nd person to run sound, or if you're solo and using a tripod & you don't need to move or adjust the camera, your best bet is to use a boompole. Or you could get a pistol grip and hold the mic away from the camera. Or you could swap out that noisy lens. Audio is more important than OIS.
Sam Mallery
Well-known member
Here's a better example of this mic in action:
http://vimeo.com/17245744
I'm not sure if Philip used the +20dB feature in this video or not. As you can hear, it sounds decent, but at the end of the day it still sounds like an on-camera mini-plug mic. This is not a "dedicated location audio person" killer. Nothing will ever do that.
http://vimeo.com/17245744
I'm not sure if Philip used the +20dB feature in this video or not. As you can hear, it sounds decent, but at the end of the day it still sounds like an on-camera mini-plug mic. This is not a "dedicated location audio person" killer. Nothing will ever do that.
Sam Mallery
Well-known member
I've heard that the NTG2 and the Zoom H4n don't get along very well. Personally if I could have one mic to use with the H4n, I would consider the VideoMic Pro. Why? I personally need a small mic that I can keep in a small camera bag with a small GH2 and the flat 20mm pancake lens. The Rode VMP can plug into the 3.5mm mic input on the H4n, and the headphone output of the H4n can be plugged into the mic input of the Gh2 with a Sescom cable. Or you could plug the VMP into an XLR input on the H4n with the Rode VXLR adapter, and have a 2nd XLR mic plugged into the other XLR in on the H4n.
But, if you just want to travel light, you could leave the H4n and other stuff at home and just bring the VMP and the Deadcat.
Noiz2
Sound Ninja
******* this refers back a few posts, didn't realize how many were in between or I would have quoted...**************
The positive, on your negative. The 9V adds weight that is important for the shock mount to work and 9V will give probably you a cleaner signal. I know on a few mics (PZM's) that I modified to use a 9V VS the original AA 1.5V the signal to noise got noticeably better. (v are not hard to find, but that is a point since it's a format that is used a lot less these days.
RE: booming. This is not going to be your ideal boom mic and it's certainly no replacement for a professional setup. But you can mount it on a boom, you would be using long runs of unbalanced cable with mini plugs on the end so you will have more problems with dodgy connections and buzzes and hums. If you don't go crazy with length and are careful with your connections and make sure you route your cables away from noise sources there is no particular reason you can't get decent sound.
The point that gets lost in equipment discussions is that a lot of the perceived "quality" depends on the user. A LOT of the water sounds for Black Stallion were recorded with a portable cassette recorder and a stereo Sony mic. The sound won a special achievement Oscar. It's not so much what you use as how you use it.
This mic boomed really well is going to sound way better than top of the line stuff used badly. Even if you have no money you can insist on quality.
Thats why every once in a while you find these fantastic films done on a shoestring and you can find multi million dollar Hollywood epics that just suck.
One was insisting on quality and making the best film they could.
The positive, on your negative. The 9V adds weight that is important for the shock mount to work and 9V will give probably you a cleaner signal. I know on a few mics (PZM's) that I modified to use a 9V VS the original AA 1.5V the signal to noise got noticeably better. (v are not hard to find, but that is a point since it's a format that is used a lot less these days.
RE: booming. This is not going to be your ideal boom mic and it's certainly no replacement for a professional setup. But you can mount it on a boom, you would be using long runs of unbalanced cable with mini plugs on the end so you will have more problems with dodgy connections and buzzes and hums. If you don't go crazy with length and are careful with your connections and make sure you route your cables away from noise sources there is no particular reason you can't get decent sound.
The point that gets lost in equipment discussions is that a lot of the perceived "quality" depends on the user. A LOT of the water sounds for Black Stallion were recorded with a portable cassette recorder and a stereo Sony mic. The sound won a special achievement Oscar. It's not so much what you use as how you use it.
This mic boomed really well is going to sound way better than top of the line stuff used badly. Even if you have no money you can insist on quality.
Thats why every once in a while you find these fantastic films done on a shoestring and you can find multi million dollar Hollywood epics that just suck.
One was insisting on quality and making the best film they could.
Sam Mallery
Well-known member
Yes, there are quality downsides. 9.5 times out of 10, XLR mics sound better than mini-plug mics. I'm just saying that I personally like the versatility of having a really good sounding mini-plug mic. The option to travel light with a good shotgun is sweet, and for some may be more beneficial than having a slightly better sound using an XLR shotgun and an external portable digital recorder.
The traveling light thing is more for ENG/documentary/whatever goes shooting. I'm not talking about serious film making. For that you should hire a sound person.
Chadfish
Veteran
roei z, I don't think any mic, no matter how good the suspension, is going to completely eliminate handling noise when mounted on a camera. Even when using a boom pole and professional shock mount, I can still hear when my hand thumps the pole. You have to use your own technique to make sure YOU don't cause handling noise. All any shock mount can do is REDUCE the noise. As for camera noise - I don't know how noisy your camera is, but any noise you put right next to a mic (as is the case when mounting a mic on a camera) will be picked up by the mic. That's why pros don't, as a general rule, plan on mounting the mic on the camera for a shoot. There are exceptions of course. Camera mounting a mic is more for picking up ambiance, or for the rare occasion when the subject is within 2" of the camera. It can be done, but it's not recommended. So if you want to use that method, it's not the mic's fault if the results aren't optimal. It's just physics. Whatever is close to the mic will be picked up. The further the talent is from the mic, the worse it sounds. You must decide how bad of sound you will accept.