RODE Announces New Wireless Sytem and Two New Shotgun Mics

Very much like the Audio-Technica System 10, at about the same price.

Once people use these some it will be interesting to see how well they work.

If they do OK I bet this category grows a lot since the Fed. keeps shrinking the bands and handing it over to this class of device. And in theory you should not have to deal with all the hoops and hurdles of traveling with a conventional wireless.

The AT seems to have more "professional" options (like balanced output) but the receiver uses a built in battery and that would be a worry. I like that the Rode is AA powered but 44.1/24? The AT doesn't say so maybe they are 44.1 also, and it doesn't matter much I guess since the out is analog anyway.
The price on both are great, IF they hold up in the field and are not trampled on in heavy WiFi areas.
 
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A couple of differences I noticed when checking the specs...

- The RODELink system has a range of 100 meters, where the AT System 10 has a range of 30 meters. ( it would be good to know if this 100 meter range is usable )

- The RODELink transmitter appears to be using a Sennheiser compatible locking 3.5mm socket. ( the AT System 10 is using a 4-pin hirose connector )
 
I read a review/ interview? with someone from AT and they say that what they are posting as specs is extremely conservative and that they have reliably gotten 100 meters. The 30 is based on a maxed out system and a dense WiFi environment. I actually suspect that both are going with the max power they can legally use and that they are close to identical in the Rx/Tx department. The AT may have an advantage having external antenna, but?

My la's all have Lectro fittings so neither is directly compatible. I could see pro's having one of these as a possible solution for UHF nightmare zones and the odd quick trip across the boarder.

That built in battery though would worry me. I have never owned anything with a built in battery that didn't have the battery fail. And it's often expensive to replace if it's possible at all. The external power in both cases is micro USB, not exactly "robust" and Li batteries hate to be constantly topped off so it's a strange choice, unless it's user replaceable (ideally in the field).
 
Noiz2 said:
The external power in both cases is micro USB, not exactly "robust" and Li batteries hate to be constantly topped off so it's a strange choice, unless it's user replaceable (ideally in the field).
Click to expand...

There are some very good low cost external phone batteries that might be perfect for this. I've been using the ROMOSS "Sailing" external batteries over the past 2 years, and they've worked flawlessly. ( the actual battery is made by Samsung )

ROMOSS "Sailing" External USB Power Batteries
 
I got a couple of System-10 belt-pack systems last week. I am planning on doing a video "teardown" and summary discussion soon.
Judging by the ("dumbed-down") feature list published by AT and Rode, (and my own examination of my AT units), these look like the similarities and differences.
As with most things in the Real World, neither of them has all the best features...

[TABLE="class: grid, width: 1000, align: left"]
[TR]
[TD]Feature[/TD]
[TD]A-T System 10[/TD]
[TD]RodeLink[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Shares 2.4 GHz band with WiFi[/TD]
[TD]Yes. same band, same channels
interoperable without interference[/TD]
[TD]Presumably the same[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Technology[/TD]
[TD]Appears to use commodity 2.4GHz technology, same as
WiFi, reducing cost while maintaining high performance[/TD]
[TD]Very likely identical[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Automatic channel selection[/TD]
[TD]Yes.[/TD]
[TD]Yes[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Temporal redundancy[/TD]
[TD]Yes. each packet sent twice[/TD]
[TD]unknown[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Spatial redndancy[/TD]
[TD]Yes. Both TX and RX have two separate antennas[/TD]
[TD]unknown[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]RX antennas[/TD]
[TD]Two industry-standard SMA connectors.
Allows use of extrnal antennas and/or distro amps.[/TD]
[TD]Built-in to plastic case.
Unknown configuration (diversity??)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Frequency/channel redundancy[/TD]
[TD]Implies that it uses second channel for redundant packet.
Also constantly scans for interference and changes
channels seamlessly during operation.[/TD]
[TD]Possibly same, but unknown[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Automatic TX RX pairing[/TD]
[TD]Yes[/TD]
[TD]presumably[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Arbitrary pair numbering[/TD]
[TD]Yes[/TD]
[TD]presumably[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Audio sampling[/TD]
[TD]24 bit @ 48 KHz[/TD]
[TD]24 bit @ 44.1 KHz[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]"Encrypted"[/TD]
[TD]no claims (beyond being frequency-hop digital)[/TD]
[TD]128-bit claimed, but not defined[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Mute[/TD]
[TD]TX only
NO indication of mute on receiver
NO ability to un-mute from receiver[/TD]
[TD]TX and RX
Indication of both TX and RX mute on receiver
Ability to un-mute TX from RX (BRILLIANT!)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Beltpack TX battery[/TD]
[TD]Two AA cells or micro-USB[/TD]
[TD]Two AA cells or micro-USB[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]RX battery[/TD]
[TD]built-in, Micro-USB rechargable (or power from USB)
Battery replacable by end-user (unscrew cover, plug-in wires)[/TD]
[TD]Two AA cells or micro-USB[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Battery indicator[/TD]
[TD]TX: blinking LED
RX: Bar graph for both TX and RX[/TD]
[TD]TX: ?
RX: Bar graph for both TX and RX[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Working distance[/TD]
[TD]"30m" conservative, likely equivalent[/TD]
[TD]"100m" liberal, likely equivalent[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Beltpack TX input[/TD]
[TD]A-T standard 4-pin locking Lemo[/TD]
[TD]3.5mm TRS phone plug with locking collar[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Beltpack TX input compatibility[/TD]
[TD]Instrument and line-level input options.[/TD]
[TD]presumably the same[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Beltpack TX sensitivity control[/TD]
[TD]Continuous pot (internal) with plastic
screwdriver provided under battery cover[/TD]
[TD]3-position switch
under secondary control cover[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]RX output[/TD]
[TD]3.5mm Switchable between dual mono for DSLR, etc. or for
full-balanced output. (BRILLIANT!)[/TD]
[TD]3.5mm dual mono unbalanced
3-position level switch.[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]RX Separate monitor output[/TD]
[TD]Yes, with independent monitor level control[/TD]
[TD]none visible[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Availbility[/TD]
[TD]NOW (January, 2015)[/TD]
[TD]mid-March, 2015[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Price (B&H)[/TD]
[TD]US$ 450 including lav mic[/TD]
[TD]US$ 400 including lav mic[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
 
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On the Rode website they list both the TX and RX as using "2 x AA battery and micro-USB" to power their units, so you aren't stuck with non-interchangeable batteries.
 
I also just noticed that there is a battery display for both the TX and RX on the RX unit, so you can tell if the transmitter is running out of juice by looking at the receiver display.
 
Thanks Richard, nice breakdown. User replaceable, that was something I didn't see mentioned before and takes a lot of the worry out of the built in battery.
 
TheDingo said:
There are some very good low cost external phone batteries that might be perfect for this. I've been using the ROMOSS "Sailing" external batteries over the past 2 years, and they've worked flawlessly. ( the actual battery is made by Samsung )

ROMOSS "Sailing" External USB Power Batteries
Click to expand...

It's not the USB power that I have a problem with it's the flimsy micro USB connector. For field/ bag work that is a disaster waiting to happen.
 
Noiz2 said:
Thanks Richard, nice breakdown. User replaceable, that was something I didn't see mentioned before and takes a lot of the worry out of the built in battery.
Click to expand...
Well, that assumes you can get a replacement battery. Something with the same specs, including physical size and lead-wire pinout, etc.
I would bet that replacements will be available only from A-T, and only for as long as they choose to support this product.

And I agree that the micro-USB connector is especially fragile and potentially problematic in the field.
USB cables (of any size) are disposable commodity items, IME.
 
True but if you can get at the battery then you could when they stop supporting it wire up a usable power connector. Way too many of the built in batteries are pretty much impossible to get to or replace with out doing real damage to the device.

It still seams like a weird choice to me, but at least they didn't go that rout with the transmitter.
 
Noiz2 said:
The AT seems to have more "professional" options (like balanced output) but the receiver uses a built in battery and that would be a worry. I like that the Rode is AA powered but 44.1/24? The AT doesn't say so maybe they are 44.1 also, and it doesn't matter much I guess since the out is analog anyway.
The price on both are great, IF they hold up in the field and are not trampled on in heavy WiFi areas.
Click to expand...

The 44.1K struck me as odd as well... For the 2.4 GHz band, perhaps they are using a narrower channel bandwidth than 'standard' WIFI, say 5 MHz, and so, one could get more 'audio' devices operating in the same local area. This would allow them to perhaps operate in the presence of 802.11 devices which are operating with a 20 or 40 Mhz bandwidth. While those devices would 'up' the noise floor, they would not cause 'backoffs' of transmissions because of the way the 802.11 protocol works, thus lessening the likelihood of spectrum starvation on that account.

There is also some rudimentary Time Division Multiplexing in the 802.11 spec, but I don't know of too many actual applicaitons of that feature.

802.11 or some varient could also allow for multiple mics working on the same channel, unlike the current FM+UHF type devices.
 
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The sample rate bothered me until I remembered than it's internal, the out is analog, so it doesn't really matter. The film world was divided between 44.1 and 48 based largely on what DAT recorders they had access too. Most DAT's imported to the US wouldn't record at 48 so everyone who came up in the $$$ film world as opposed to the $$$$$ film world was at 44.1. This also made a lot of sense since commercial sound libraries were on audio CD's so they were at 44.1. And conversion took forever, I did a sample rate conversion of a DAT tapes worth of sounds from 48 to 44.1 (that is what Saul Zaentz worked at) and it took over 24 hours. Usually we just did an analog transfer but they had this software that was supposed to do a great job... Skywalker had a converter box from someone. It did an analog conversion but all in the box so very little loss, but still real time.

DV is what pushed folks to 48, that and it's not hard to find a recorder that does 48. I have yet to find anyone I believed who can hear the difference between 44.1 and 48, and it was a HOTTLY debated topic back when.
 
I'm actually kinda interested in the NTG4 / 4+ shotgun mics. They are supposed to fit in between the ntg 1/2's and the NTG3.
The last couple of days I've been tossing up between an NTG-3, or something lower budget like a sennheiser MKE600 to get me started.

I'm still undecided on the "digital" buttons on the mics for the low cut, pad and presence boost. I guess the presence boost might come in handy sometimes though.

I will be keeping an eye on the radio mic's as well. I'd love it if they are decent quality, and make a great low cost entry into radio mics, if they work even OK, they will be pretty decent value, as it has already been mentioned they appear to come with the standard Rode Lav, which retails for more than half the cost of the kit...
 
Stiffman said:
IThe last couple of days I've been tossing up between an NTG-3, or something lower budget like a sennheiser MKE600 to get me started.
Click to expand...

I am very curious to see how the NTG-4 and the MKE600 compare. I sold my NTG-2 mic after buying the MKE600, so maybe I'll do it again if the NTG-4 performs better.
 
Questions re: Using D11 and new Rode wireless

Questions re: Using D11 and new Rode wireless

Thanks to all for the excellent info in this thread.

I have one Sony UWP-D D11 body-pack transmitter and a tuner. They are in the 30-36 566.125 - 607.875 MHZ 38-41 614.125 - 637.875 MHZ Blocks and frequencies. I know nothing of what this means, but a B&H salesman told me this freq. range was most likely to remain usable.

I have intended to get two more D11s, but I am now interested in the new Rode wireless, both for performance and cost reasons. I presume the price reductions I am seeing for the Sony is due to the forthcoming lower-priced Rode mics.

Will someone instruct me on the consequences of using the one Sony and the two Rodes at the same time?

Also, where can I find comprehensive learning material about wireless mics generally? ...other than here, of course. I have heard that the feds are occasionally changing the allowed frequencies. It is extremely unlikely I will be filming outside the US.

Jim
 
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James Holmes said:
I have heard that the feds are occasionally changing the allowed frequencies. It is extremely unlikely I will be filming outside the US.

Jim
Click to expand...

The next round of auctions that could affect such things as wireless mics in the 600 MHz band is 2016.

I think this why some providers of such equipment are thinking about ways to move out of the spectrum, or 'do better' with the spectrum in the future, especially digital means.
 
" They are in the 30-36 566.125 - 607.875 MHZ 38-41 614.125 - 637.875 MHZ Blocks and frequencies. I know nothing of what this means "
> "30- 36" are the television channels, for instance TV channel '30' spans 566-572MHz; TV channel '36' spans 602-608 MHz.

"a B&H salesman told me this freq. range was most likely to remain usable"
> For the foreseeable future anyway. TV channels 30-36 (below 608MHz) are not up for auction 2016 and should be legal for 'a while' In any case the Sony and Rodes's frequencies are far apart and should not interfere.
 
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