Requested Input - Minimalist Documentary Film Kit

B

briangboat

New member
First, I'd like to say wast a great community of really knowledgeable
people. Thank you all for sharing your experiences. I've sure read a lot
of them in the early hours.

I'd like to request your input on minimalist documentary film sound
kit. The goal is to have natural sounding, balanced voices and little
to no equipment induced noise. Seventy percent will be filmed out doors
and the balance inside in reasonably quiet, non-reverberant areas.
Although I'd really like to hire a sound person for the field, it's not
possible. I have considered the following recorder options:

SD 702 - at $1,900 it's a bit pricey, but it's only one piece to lug around and
super quality

Sony D50 and Denecke Phantom Power - Under $600 with good sound and
battery life, but two bits to lug around, poor recorder field visibility

Sony D50 and USBPre - $1,100 with good battery life and digital transfers, g
reat sound, but fragile connectivity

Fostex FR2-LE, no mixer - $600 reasonably quite pre's, easier to manage
in the field, separate trims, some quirks, not sturdily built and the
oldest model of the bunch.

I also considered the H4N and DR100. It seemed like they were a lot of
issues including drift, connectivity, SD write noise, preamp noise, no
way to secure XLR connectors, etc.

I opted for the Fostex and will see how it is without a mixer or Oade
enhancements(at that point I'll make a decision about the SD 702). Since
most of my work will be outside and I really want natural sounding
voices I'm opting for a Sanken CS3e and possibly, for budget
constraints, either an Octava MK-012 hyper or a AT4053b(which I'm
leaning toward because IMHO it sounds closer, but not as good as, the
Sanken).

If sound is 70% of what you see, then I'm pretty well matched with my
gear budget allocation(grins).

Thanks for your thoughts.
 
What's your budget? Who will be booming and recording? It sounds like you've done your research, and if you don't have a low budget the gear you said you wanted are quality. But nothing will work properly if you don't have people knowing what they are doing operating the equipment.
 
Thank you for your responses.

grantly - I like simple. The SD 552 is a dream machine which is really helps me get to my point. Granted the pres, and other circuitry are going to be great, but how much better will it make the audio sound over the Fostex - given given good a OP? Will there be a material difference in sound quality in terms of color, richness etc.? I don't want to buy a piece for specs alone. For the foreseeable future, five channels would be more than I need.

I hadn't thought about having a separate unobtrusive handheld recorder just for capturing voice in impromptu situations. I think I will get a D50 for that because it is relatively quiet, small, relatively inexpensive, batteries last forever and has decent on board mics. I wish I would have had it yesterday! Great idea, thanks.

sludge_roach - I absolutely agree about the equipment being useless in the hands of an unskilled OP. In terms of who's going to do the booming, unfortunately, that would be me and a mike stand in some cases. I've taken some classes and practiced quite a bit in the field. I certainly have the respect of guys who do this for a living. Unfortunately, its not possible in this situation. I am finding that a portable chair helps a lot to keep the "talent" stationary. In terms of my budget, it not fixed, but it is about marginal return of quality for the investment. It is about $3,000+/-(who am I kidding, it is always "+") for mics and a recorder. What will I get in sound quality for an additional $1,000 over the Fostex an would a person be able to tell the difference in the final film?


Again, thank you.
 
It sounds like you're only going to be using a single mic. A 552 is total overkill. A Sound Devices preamp and overall circuitry will be cleaner and quieter than the Fostex. However, many people on this forum have reported getting satisfactory results using the preamps on the FR2LE alone. Will the audience notice the difference? Likely not. These are all subtleties. They may notice on a subconscious level, but they won't realize what it is that they're noticing. Audiences are vastly more sensitive to poorly positioned mics, improper gain settings, and noise (wind, clothing and otherwise).
 
552 overkill?....yes probably. The OP asked for quality audio and was considering a 702, so he isn't cheap. The point is, a 552 is a one box solution that has high quality build, high quality audio and can grow. It has about every feature you could want. The only very slight drawback is two channels only.

IMHO, if you buy a mid-level recorder, eventually you will want a mixer as well. Your bag just got bigger. For sure there are cheaper solutions.

Grant
 
My wife's credit card went for the 702(gins). OP technique is critical to making a difference with any rig - man do I get that. For right now I will be using two mics at most, but the 552 really does make a lot of sense for someone who is going to grow. I also liked the 2 pounds for the 702 vs 5 pounds for the 552. It was also quite a bit smaller and less intrusive. Yup, I like simple.

My reasons for the 702 vs and entry level box and ultimatly a mixer:
I don't have to think about it again(at least for a while)
No mixer to recorder connections to worry about
One box!
I only have to master one product
Eliminates potential problems
I only have one manufacturer to solve my problems
Noise never gets quieter down the chain
No potential for differintial ground states
Uses CF cards - much faster transfer than SD and same as my camera
Solid company with track record of great support
It is probably about $800 more than an inexpensive recorder and a Mixpre - not a lot of money for piece of mind
If I sell it, I'd lose less than on the cost of a cheaper combo setup - plus I get to the use of some really great gear
Easier power management - one set of batteries
Better ergonomics
Some benefits I probably don't even know about yet...
And it's only going to hurt once!

Thank you everyone.
 
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