This forum, boy. I'm not saying everybody has to be a Red shooter / Red fan, but if you personally hate them so much that you can't see that a cleanroom being used to do something ON THE NAB FLOOR that their competitors don't do ANYWHERE is really damn cool you've completely lost perspective.
RED is Building 6K Dragon Cameras Live at NAB in a Custom-Built Clean Room
- Thread starter joe1946
- Start date
remsyatassi
Well-known member
Also it's not like Alexa and RED are in the same price bracket. Not by a long shot.
FrameFarmMedia
Veteran
I think people just want to see footage not publicity stunts. The colour science isn't even done yet and Jannard stated it wouldn't be released till it was absolutely perfect. Don't know what that means for people who have a new sensor now without any function at the moment.
Is lining up for a $10K sensor upgrade without seeing any finished footage and only a 90 day warranty loyalty or fanboyism? Up to each to decide. I know what I think.
I like Red cameras but don't like the attitude they exude. Its a good time to be a new buyer into red. The price on an Epic Dragon new with a 2 yr warranty is fantastic.
Zacatac
Well-known member
I agree, as soon as somebody told me that RED had built a Clean Room on the show floor, I rolled my eyes (in a good way) and said that it was fantastic marketing. Seriously everybody at NAB either was talking about, or knew about it. Even if it was all for show, and those cameras they were working on weren't for actual production. It's pretty good marketing, and every other competitor who was looking for something "new" at NAB for exposition, is kicking themselves.
dustylense
Veteran
I agree with RatLab. While RED had completely brainwashed their customers with marketing it's quite interesting that people let them plop a sensor in a camera without a single moving example of the upgrade. We just have a lizard shot to look at. "Here ya go, a new sensor". Great, can't wait to shoot with it next week. "Ummm, the firmware isn't ready and won't be ready until we say it is". Sure, it's great that RED does in fact upgrade their cameras and I'm sure many people buy into that notion.
I really don't think anyone hates the "camera". I think some people dislike the attitude behind the camera, both from RED themselves on down to fanboyism. "I shoot a RED, what do you shoot"? Well, I'll shoot with whatever gets the job done and sometimes that might just be a RED or maybe a C300. Maybe it's a Gh2 and maybe an HDSLR. Apples and oranges arguments. But with RED its more of an occult. BMD camera fanboys are becoming quite the same.
It's the second that a camera company has to sell their product by bashing other products that I stop and think twice (or how about when they go as far as suing the other camera???). Build a nice camera and let the camera speak for itself. "Here it is. Here's what it can do. And here are some pretty pictures so you can judge for yourself".
I like what RED has done. Don't get me wrong. Great camera and features. I like what BMD had done. Great image for a great price. But I also like what Sony has done, Canon has done, and even Panny even though they have gone silent in the large chip ballpark. I'm a fanboy of all these cameras. Sort of like liking the NFL and not just the Dallas Cowboys. I don't focus just on a team, but instead look at lots of players that play the sport well.
It was different though, the cleanroom. RED is really good at marketing. But no matter how unique it was, I'd rather see moving images of what the sensor does....
I really don't think anyone hates the "camera". I think some people dislike the attitude behind the camera, both from RED themselves on down to fanboyism. "I shoot a RED, what do you shoot"? Well, I'll shoot with whatever gets the job done and sometimes that might just be a RED or maybe a C300. Maybe it's a Gh2 and maybe an HDSLR. Apples and oranges arguments. But with RED its more of an occult. BMD camera fanboys are becoming quite the same.
It's the second that a camera company has to sell their product by bashing other products that I stop and think twice (or how about when they go as far as suing the other camera???). Build a nice camera and let the camera speak for itself. "Here it is. Here's what it can do. And here are some pretty pictures so you can judge for yourself".
I like what RED has done. Don't get me wrong. Great camera and features. I like what BMD had done. Great image for a great price. But I also like what Sony has done, Canon has done, and even Panny even though they have gone silent in the large chip ballpark. I'm a fanboy of all these cameras. Sort of like liking the NFL and not just the Dallas Cowboys. I don't focus just on a team, but instead look at lots of players that play the sport well.
It was different though, the cleanroom. RED is really good at marketing. But no matter how unique it was, I'd rather see moving images of what the sensor does....
Emanuel
Cross-Examiner
Indeed. Another truth is part of the hate comes from the fact Jim is a rich man and Jarred has succeeded as President of this company. Personally, I am proud of seeing this to happen and they're still answering me whenever I need to speak with any one of them. But RED brand is slashed over here in the same boards where they launched RED, years after. Funny to say the least. I guess this tells a bit about the nonsense of this attitude.
FrameFarmMedia
Veteran
Based on what have you drawn that conclusion? I'd say most peoples dislike for Jim (including mine) is the way he conducts himself and his business. Lot of examples out there of Jim throwing a tantrum and rubbing a lot of people the wrong way.
I like what RED has done and I do like their cameras but I don't buy into the cult of personality Jim has set up for himself and his fanboys. Between that and the teenage faux military language I can't help but roll my eyes.
dregenthal
Veteran
My only disappointment with Red is that I can't currently afford one but I'm all in for what they're doing and what they have done.
You might remember there where a lot if skeptics in the early days . . . Who have since been silenced, <g>.
Attitude? Yeah, we'll if I don't actually think about it I might take some of that the wrong way but so long as they set themselves apart with product (which in my view they surely have) then I think a certain amount of attitude is warranted.
The behavior and our responses to it remind me of the old coke vs. Pepsi generation commercials.
They are different, the conduct their business differently . . . It's IMHO the "cool factor" . . . I've got no objection to that, and frankly think some of the other manufacturers could take a lesson from from Red on that and other fronts. I can think of more than one manufacturer that could benefit from a little cool . . .
You might remember there where a lot if skeptics in the early days . . . Who have since been silenced, <g>.
Attitude? Yeah, we'll if I don't actually think about it I might take some of that the wrong way but so long as they set themselves apart with product (which in my view they surely have) then I think a certain amount of attitude is warranted.
The behavior and our responses to it remind me of the old coke vs. Pepsi generation commercials.
They are different, the conduct their business differently . . . It's IMHO the "cool factor" . . . I've got no objection to that, and frankly think some of the other manufacturers could take a lesson from from Red on that and other fronts. I can think of more than one manufacturer that could benefit from a little cool . . .
Rolf Silber
Veteran
As a devout protestant I never ever will put my hands onto a catholic camera.
Emanuel
Cross-Examiner
I won't comment part of the content of your post other than the fact I know these two guys -- one for 8 years, the other one for 6 years and it is very unfair this deficit of evaluation when I know the way they've always behaved with me. Period.
Moreover, I have no idea where you and others were when they both were attacked by haters, either 'cause of their position in the film business (in danger with this project) or envy 'cause some webmaster was extending his career beyond and a rich guy -- rather than to buy all the chicks he wanted
they were with ideas to enter in this business instead, crossing the door of the democratization of the celluloid regime. And helping others on the way. Listen, I know a lot of people with their lives changed along this process, got it? ;-)But I know where I was ; ) Putting my reservations in the right hands when nonsayers tried to delay the "revolutionaries" for some reason. And publicly bashing them, playing the dirty game to call RED a scam, discrediting them as much as possible in the vain attempt to conduct the rebels to failure. As well, the early adopters and first customers, such as this guy writing these lines here.
There is a backstory behind important to tell. This didn't come up from nowhere. Facts will not cease to exist because we are not aware of its occurrence in the time : )
Last part not least, I wrote "another truth is part of the hate", so I guess these words say enough.
E.
bgundu
Veteran
Sorry to burst your bubble on this, but it was certainly the real deal. Of course the motivation behind this was marketing, but rest assured they took great lengths building that booth to be 100 percent operational.