Re-editing a DVD: jerky motion?

F

firehawk

Veteran
I have to take a finished DVD and replace some scenes, change a menu and edit down some of the footage. Someone else made the DVD and I don't have access to the original footage, just the authored DVD.
It's NTSC 4:3.
I tried to bring the video VOB files into premiere pro 2.0 but they wouldn't work unless I changed the file extension to .mpeg.
Then I tried DVD decrypter which exported/ripped the VOB files off the DVD and onto my drive but still with the .VOB extension. CS5 however could import and edit the resulting files.

The problem is when I export the timeline to .avi the resulting video looks weird. Any motion such as a pan or someone waving their arm has a jerky look to it when previewing the output on my connected CRT Tv. On my computer screen it looks fine. But if I export the video to a DVD and watch it on an old fashioned CRT tv the problem is there.

I don't understand what is happening to the video when it goes from the DVD to my NLE. I'm exporting the videos 29.97 lower field first just like standard dv.
Any ideas? I'm really confused and this project is turning into a real time wasting pain
 
It might be best if you posted a short video (if possible) of what this looks like. However, I would guess that the problem is field related if it shows up on a CRT, but not computer as LCD screens are progressive, while CRTs are interlaced.

If I was in your shoes, I would try a couple of things. Firstly, I would choose a clip which when exported, exhibits the problem you describe. Then in the editing sequence timeline, right click the clip, choose "field options", then click the box "reverse field dominance". Try exporting that section of the timeline as an avi and see if it looks any better. I have seen strange things with mpeg 2 footage where the field order was not as anticipated.

Another thing you might try...although this may be best for future projects....in CS5, when you import footage into your library, you can select the clip and "New sequence from clip". It creates an editing sequence which matches the clip's properties. That way, the frame size, frame rate, field order, pixel ratio etc are automatically matched. When you come to export your video, in Export Settings you have the option to click a box with "Match Sequence Settings". Once again, that can help take the guesswork out of choosing frame sizes, field orders etc. I hope this helps.
 
And, of course, the standard warning -- It's illegal to copy and/or re-edit someone else's copyrighted material, without their permission -- except in a few very limited circumstances. (Not accusing you of doing that. Just making the blanket statement.)
 
Thanks for the reminder. The client isn't happy with their resulting project and wants us to fix a number of things on the disc and not deal with the original disc maker again who was originally hired to make the project. The client owns the video/disc.
Thank you, again. I hope this works.
 
I selected "reverse field dominance" and playing from the timeline, the video now looks smooth on my CRT tv monitor. I exported it as an .avi selecting "upper field first" rendering instead of lower, and took the resulting .avi into adobe encore. I made a test DVD and it plays jerky. Not as bad as the original problem, but still doesn't look right. Some motion is jerky and on some images it's like I can almost count the fields.

I'll back up and restate my steps:
1. Used DVD decryptor to pull .vob files from DVD.
2. Imported .vob files into premiere cs5.
3. Exported the timeline as is to .avi
4. Imported the .avi into premiere 2.0
5. Selected "reverse field" dominance and rendered timeline. Looks good.
6. Exported .avi from PPro2.0 using "upper field first"
7. Imported .avi into encore 2.0 and burned DVD
8. Got confused again

And before anyone asks, The reason I am using the old premiere 2 is because the cs5 machine I'd not on a desk and editing from it on long projects is a pain. But if that is contributing to the problem, I'll change.
 
I wonder if on step 6 I should have exported the .avi with "lower field first" selected instead under rendering. In my mind that would seem to undo/cancel the "reverse field dominance" step by switching the dominance back to lower, but maybe I'm not looking at this right.

If I exported several .avis or .m2v files, each with different field settings, could I bring them all into encore and burn a DVD that played all of them back to back to see which version worked? Or does encore do something to them to make them all the same? I'm trying to figure out how to not waste a DVD for every different test..
 
I'm worried about step 3. It's possible that not the whole mpeg/VOB file has the wrong order, just certain clips in the original timeline . Does the original DVD look good on your CRT, or are there jerky bits there? If yes, it's possible this happened:

Original editor had a timeline which mixed clips with both upper and lower field dominance. Of course some clips will loo fine, but others won't.

i fear you may have to go through the timeline cut by cut (or shot by shot), watching it on a CRT, and reverse only those moments which are jerky. Then output with "regular" settings. Using PPro2 shouldn't be a problem. I have used it to edit VOB files (after renaming them).
 
Thank you, everyone.
I will check out the mediainfo link. That sounds really useful both now and in the future. There's been many times I wished for something like that.

I watched the original DVD on my set top player connected to a CRT tv and compared it to my test disc created above. They actually do seem to exhibit the same problems in the same areas just as you suspected. I think you are correct once again. It must have varying field dominance. Possibly shot with two different cameras. The footage does seem to vary some in appearance.
You guys are great.

When you said you will never export upper field first, premiere will always make it lower, did you mean you never should do that, or that premiere will render it lower field regardless of what you select?
 
You were right. The original DVD actually had field inconsistencies and multiple problems.
The client made many changes over a long period of time and I just now finished it all . I had to go back through the whole disc and fix different sections according to which field was dominant. Anway I finally got it all straigtened out and a new and improved Disc authored with a wealth of modifications and fixes. What a mess!!
I want to thank everyone again for all the help. I went back through the thread and gave everyone thumbs up "helpful" post clicks.
 
You do realize that you have created a small nightmare for yourself by trying to edit an already authored DVD right? It's essential to work with the original footage or just leave the DVD as it is. Changing the DVD at this point won't accomplish much, it will just take up a ton of time and diminish the quality of the final master.
 
CapVideo said:
You do realize that you have created a small nightmare for yourself by trying to edit an already authored DVD right? It's essential to work with the original footage or just leave the DVD as it is. Changing the DVD at this point won't accomplish much, it will just take up a ton of time and diminish the quality of the final master.
Click to expand...

i think it was stated that he did not have access to the original footage. he was brought on board to fix the problem after the fact. this is very common.
 
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