questioning a long time decision

[Oli.S]

I thought I was sure about buying the HVX when it comes out in Germany.
Then the rumor went around that in Europe it won't be available without P2 cards.
Although it probably is just a rumor, it made me think "what if"
And so I started to think about that.
DVX100AE has proven to be a real nice cam.
DVX100B will be even a little better.
Even a Canon XL2 might be an option.

Here's why I'm not so sure anymore:
- the HVX will be released not before March in Germany, I'd bet on that.
- the HVX (sold seperatly) will cost 5500 Euros at least, I'd bet on this as well.

Buying a DVX100AE for example would get me here:
- I could buy it tomorrow. Monday at the latest. :laugh:
- It would cost me 2800 Euros. I'd have some 1000 to 2000 Euros easily to spend on tripod, book(s), micro, lighting-gear, etc. etc. and I'd still have some money left.

Buying the HVX next year will pretty much take everything that I have available to spend on this hobby. Will I be able to get a fair tripod for 150 Euros? An external mic for 100 Euros?

What do you think?

I know, the HVX will probably a killer cam. But then - does it makes sense to shoot in HD in 2006? How many "HD-ready" TV screens are actually out there? Okay, I know, if I'd plan on blowing it up then the more resolution, the better, but then: how realistic is that? Isn't it much more realistic that I will be producing DVDs? Will there be such a significant difference between rescaling the HVX footage down to DVD format and using the DVX in the first place?

Isn't the HVX something that will be more in-time around 2007? Maybe the first improvements are made already. (think of SSE and the lense of JVC, both seems to be getting better) Maybe the first price drop might already have happened. Maybe HD is just more common then.

I saw a DVX100AE for 2800,- today and I really felt some sort of urge... :laugh:
Just a few months ago, I would have bought it right on the spot. Back then, you couldn't get on for less than 3200,-. (So much for the "no, the DVX price won't drop because of the HVX and the 100B")

Okay, go for it. :beer:

 

[HorseFilms]

I bought my DVX100A more than a year ago and I don't regret it for a second. Would I like an HVX? Sure. Do I need one for what I do? Not in the least. That's why I'll be waiting for quite awhile, and maybe I'll never get an HVX, who knows? I plan on shooting a feature next spring, but I think the best I could hope for is a direct-to-video release, so the HVX wouldn't really help me all that much.

It all depends on what you plan to do with it and if you really "need" it. Good luck with your decision.

 

[Barry_Green]

- the HVX will be released not before March in Germany, I'd bet on that.
- the HVX (sold seperatly) will cost 5500 Euros at least, I'd bet on this as well.

I'm sure you're right on both counts.

I know, the HVX will probably a killer cam. But then - does it makes sense to shoot in HD in 2006?

Ah, the $5995 question. And one that only you can answer. And the reason why I keep saying that SD cams are by no means obsolete as of yet.

How many "HD-ready" TV screens are actually out there?

In America? Around 10% of the households. In Germany? Probably closer to around 1/2 of 1%. In Japan? Don't know, but a lot more than in America.

The pace of adoption is accelerating, however. And depending on the type of content you're shooting, having an HD master may indeed be valuable. But, if you're putting the camera to work, it won't take long at all to pay off a DVX -- so you could then be earning money today, and saving towards the day you decide to go HD (whenever that day is, that makes sense for your business).

One thing's for sure: once you go HD, it's kind of hard to go back to SD!

Okay, I know, if I'd plan on blowing it up then the more resolution, the better, but then: how realistic is that?

Probably about 4,000 to 1 against.

Isn't it much more realistic that I will be producing DVDs?

Absolutely.

Will there be such a significant difference between rescaling the HVX footage down to DVD format and using the DVX in the first place?

Not really. The HVX will likely produce better-looking DVD footage because of its 4:2:2 DVCPRO50 mode, and less compression, but I don't know yet how much better. Especially since you're in Germany, which already uses 4:2:0 in DV and DVD.

The HVX would have an advantage in that it's native 16:9.

Isn't the HVX something that will be more in-time around 2007? Maybe the first improvements are made already. (think of SSE and the lense of JVC, both seems to be getting better) Maybe the first price drop might already have happened. Maybe HD is just more common then.

Well, that's a personal decision. Do you believe HD will take over? And if so, when do you jump on the HD train?

The way I look at it, the camera is a business tool. You buy the tool to do the job you need done. If you don't foresee any need for HD in your business for the reasonably-foreseeable future, why spend extra to buy into HD at this time? One thing I can assure you is that the DVX (in the right hands) makes absolutely fantastic-looking DVDs, so if your proposed distribution model is to make standard-def DVDs, then yes, you're probably right to question the wisdom of overextending yourself to get something that's beyond your reach and that won't necessarily have that much impact on the particular type of work you're planning on doing.

I saw a DVX100AE for 2800,- today and I really felt some sort of urge... :laugh:
Just a few months ago, I would have bought it right on the spot. Back then, you couldn't get on for less than 3200,-. (So much for the "no, the DVX price won't drop because of the HVX and the 100B")

It comes down to this: get what you think you need. Don't get what someone tells you you should have, instead get what you actually would need. They may or may not be the same thing! It's your money, and your choice. There's a reason the DVX100B will continue to be a current model in Panasonic's lineup, and a reason the XL2 stays as a current model in Canon's lineup. I have no doubt the XLH1 and the HVX are going to be wonderful tools, but they're also 1.5 to 2x as expensive as their stablemates. Pick which one does the job you need done; the XL2 and the DVX100B are both superb tools for making standard-def DVDs.

 

[khmuse]

Buying a DVX100AE for example would get me here:
- I could buy it tomorrow. Monday at the latest. :laugh:
- It would cost me 2800 Euros. I'd have some 1000 to 2000 Euros easily to spend on tripod, book(s), micro, lighting-gear, etc. etc. and I'd still have some money left.

I would much rather have a DVX and some of the necessary accessories to make it a useful camera than an HVX and no money left to buy everything else needed.

A camera alone does not make either a film or a filmmaker.

 

[Sean Michael]

Confucius say, "SD 24p camera in hand . . . worth two HD camera in bush." :grin:

 

[Luis Caffesse]

I plan on shooting a feature next spring, but I think the best I could hope for is a direct-to-video release, so the HVX wouldn't really help me all that much.

First off you're right in that it doesn't sound like you "need" the HVX.
But I just thought I'd point out that I'm looking to the HVX specifically for direct to video release projects. The DVCPro50 option should give you some incredible looking footage for DVD with 4:2:2, double the datarate, and less compression than DV.

Plus, if you want to use variable frame rates you can do that in 720P and just downconvert the shots in post.

So just because you don't need HD doesn't mean you should count out the HVX.
The camera should be pretty incredible for SD work as well.

 

[Steve Strickland]

Man, no one can decide this for you, but I say get the DVX100A or B. I wanted the HVX, but, like you, it would've taken most of my budget. Now, I've got a killer cam in the 100A, and plenty of room to get some needed extras. Go for it, indeed! :beer:

 

[J.R. Hudson]

I bought my DVX100A more than a year ago and I don't regret it for a second. Would I like an HVX? Sure. Do I need one for what I do? Not in the least. That's why I'll be waiting for quite awhile, and maybe I'll never get an HVX, who knows? I plan on shooting a feature next spring, but I think the best I could hope for is a direct-to-video release, so the HVX wouldn't really help me all that much.

It all depends on what you plan to do with it and if you really "need" it. Good luck with your decision.

Here here :beer:

 

[hvpz]

First off you're right in that it doesn't sound like you "need" the HVX.
But I just thought I'd point out that I'm looking to the HVX specifically for direct to video release projects. The DVCPro50 option should give you some incredible looking footage for DVD with 4:2:2, double the datarate, and less compression than DV.

Plus, if you want to use variable frame rates you can do that in 720P and just downconvert the shots in post.

So just because you don't need HD doesn't mean you should count out the HVX.
The camera should be pretty incredible for SD work as well.

And the native 16:9 CCDs

 

[Oli.S]

Thanks for your replies.
Especially a big thanks to Barry.

I decided to wait for the DVX100B to come out in Germany.
Then I'll simply compare the prices of the
100AE, 100B and XL2 and then I'll try to decide.

For now, I'm on the track to better get a real good SD cam
and lots of high-quality equipment rather than a HD cam that
will eat all my budget up.