Question about Oktava mk012 outdoor capabilities...

J

Johnny5

Member
Hello! This is my first foray into the audio section of dvxuser and I have to say that in about an hour I have learned a TREMENDOUS amount. As someone who concentrates mainly on cinematography I have either left sound to others or, unfortunately, relegated it to the backburner - more out of lack of sound knowledge than anything else. Anyway, I am in the market for a decent mic and have set my sights on the oktava mk012 for hypercardioid use indoors (a choice based on budget and performance). My question is this: can the cardioid capsule be used outdoors and get a decent sound with the mk012 or would I be best suited purchasing an additional shotgun mic (I realize that the answer to that question is: buy an additional shotgun mic - but I am aiming to keep this within limited budgetary constraints). On that note, is there an acceptable shotgun capsule for the mk012?

As far as use is concerned, I film primarily indoors, which is why I want to go with the mk012, but there are occasional outdoor shoots that pop up. My work is primarily displayed on the web in quicktime format, but I do compile DVD releases that play at SD resolution - so I do want audio quality enough to survive on home stereo speakers. I considered the AKG Blueline system due to interchangable capsules and a rave review here, but it seems that the mk012 is similar at least in terms of its hypercardioid capsule. Finally, I would most likely rent or use a pro sound guy, but at this point shooting can occur quite suddenly and I want to have decent audio gear ready to go at a moments notice so I can cover my bases.

Anyway, yeah...basically does the mk012 perform decently enough in an outdoor setting with its cardioid capsule, keeping in mind that the end result is usually viewed on the web, and at most viewed on a home television.

Thanks!

John
 
You really don't need the cardioid... just the hyper-cardioid. Being able to use it outdoors will be a matter of how good of a shockmount and windscreen you get. If you get a K-SSM with soft bands for shockmount... and then a BBG and Jammer combo for windprotection... then you'll be able to use it really well outdoors. The only limiting factor will be REACH... meaning sensitivity... where a shotgun will work from a little farther away. In reality you should be able to have a mic within 3' of anybody if you expect to get good sound anyway... and if you are willing to accept that fact as FACT and abide by it... then YES, you can use an Oktava hyper indoors or out and get surprisingly good results.*


*This statement is based on the qualifiers given by the initial post of this thread... such as "decently enough".

Normal procedure is for hyper indoors and shotgun outdoors.
 
You'll never use the omni... the cardioid is good... but when you boil it all down the hyper is the only one you actually need. I'd rather see you get the hyper only... and then get a BBG for windscreen with the difference.
 
Is The Sound Room the only legitimate place to purchase a Octava Mk012? I talked to some sound guys on a set recently and they said that there are many places selling counterfeit copies of the Russian manufactured mic from China? Is there any truth to this? Tried some searches and couldn't find anything.
 
CineProducer said:
Is The Sound Room the only legitimate place to purchase a Octava Mk012? I talked to some sound guys on a set recently and they said that there are many places selling counterfeit copies of the Russian manufactured mic from China? Is there any truth to this? Tried some searches and couldn't find anything.
Click to expand...

There are lots of places that sell counterfeit Oktavas (like Guitar Center). Buying from The Sound Room is the way to go to ensure you get a high quality Oktava.
 
To those of you who have purchased the Oktavamk012, do you find yourself using the 3-kit set; OR do you tend to stick to the HyperCardiod. I've heard there is little use for the Cardiod and most people never use the Omni either, they always use the Hyper? Should I get just get the Hyper or the set of all three? I'm getting an AT4073a for exterior work and planning on using the Oktava for Interiors.
 
Just get the hyper, it's all I use. The longer I have it the more I use it for almost everything (and I got a lot of mics)
 
That is an excellent site... I appreciate the information that they have collected together and most likely they are decent to deal with... HOWEVER I would like to share the Sound Room story with you guys and why I encourage people to buy from Paul.

The Sound Room was founded in 1998... by Taylor Johnson. Taylor was and is a FANATIC about microphones and good sound. He actually partnered to create another company which sells it's OWN microphones! You can find themn almost anyplace that sells $1K+ mics. They are called T.H.E. mics. Taylor has also worked with several Russian microphone companies INCLUDING Oktava... and because of this he not only developed a good relationship with the factories... but he was personally helpful in bringing Oktava's MK012 from a mic of poor quality control and mic-to-mic variation... to what it is today. Back in the end of the late 90's and early 2000's the Oktavas had a reputation for hit-or-miss quality. Taylor arranged to HAND SELECT the winners, or "golden samples" from the Oktava assembly line! Those are the Oktavas that Sound Room sold! Because of Taylor's interest in microphones and the help and encouragement he provided to the Russian mic companies they were agreeable with this arrangement! Simply put; he made friends there.

T.H.E. Inc. has become so successful that Taylor doesn't spend much time at Sound Room anymore... but he has an equally enthusiastic guy doing the stuff he used to do there. That guy's name is Paul. Now I'm not sure about this part, but I think Paul may have bought the place off Taylor or maybe he's just a partner... I really don't know.

Back in the early 2000's you actually stood a chance of getting a decent Oktava from GC... the chinese counterfeits are relatively NEW to the market! So around 2001, if you wanted to go to GC and sweet-talk some employee into getting out 8 or so Oktavas... you could hand-pick the best of the bunch. As of now those days are over! The Oktavas in GC now are the chinese counterfeits... (recently we debated ethics of selling similar products to other products and I'd like to see that same enthusiastic negativity towards GC rather then some dope making cheap tools in his 1-man shop... but I digress). So anyway... while it was a good idea to get an Oktava from Taylor or Paul back then... it's nearly the only choice now! There are one or two other places from which to buy a GENUINE Oktava in North America now.

So why (if the above reasons are not enough for you) do I say you should strongly consider your Oktava purchase from Paul? Because Paul LISTENS to us as a video community!

After pushing DVXusers to the Oktava and Sound Room for a couple years Paul realized that we are a substantial market for him... most sound stores are not thinking about VIDEO buyers. They are catering to musicians! I pleaded with Paul to set up some arrangement with Oktava so that the ONE-cap kits could come with a HYPER instead of the Cardioid (as you see at ALL other stores) because that is the cap that WE video people need FIRST. Sure he already sold the one-cap kit with a cardioid (just like EVERY Oktava seller does) but I asked him to pull some strings at Oktava so that other people wouldn't be forced into a choice of EITHER buying the cardioid one-cap kit AND then adding the hyper to that... OR having to buy the 3-cap kit in order to get the hyper.

What did Paul say? He could have said, "Just buy the cardioid only and buy the hyper seperately like you have to do EVERYWHERE else!" But he DIDN'T say that! He said, "I'll see what I can do."

A couple months later... BAM! There on his site are the options for not only 1-cap HYPER kits... but even in BLACK or silver (another request I had). So I send an email to Paul to say thanks for getting that done... I told him that only makes it easier to send people to his store. He replies, "we appreciate the help you've been giving us in representing the Oktava line... we would like to offer you a 5% discount by entering coupon code DV at checkout... and please feel free to share this offer with your friends on the forum."

So there you go... on top of all those reasons to support www.sound-room.com Paul even gives us the lowest possible price anyway... $165 (with coupon code DV)

For the record... I get NOTHING more then the exact deal everybody else gets! I just want to see that place succeed because they have proved that they care about our needs and they LISTEN.
 
marlenedegrood said:
Here's where I bought mine. They also have an article on counterfits.
Click to expand...

Marlene,
although I also purchased from there, and would NOT buy a Chinese version, this might be also interesting reading for you, IF you are interested:

Background:
http://debris.com/journal/1280
http://debris.com/journal/1336

Test:
Interestingly enough, the Guitar Center claims that there IS a difference in sound quality between the Chinese and Russian MK-012, HOWEVER, there was a COMPARISON TEST made that had a different conclusion:
http://www.sound-patterns.com/mk012/
 
Matt, couple 'o things:

1) The GC does NOT sell the Oktava's anymore. Here's a link to a letter from them: http://debris.com/journal/1336

2) The Sound Room DOES rock: they also are one of the only ones (THE only one??) that will sell you the Oktava MK-012 BODY only: something I was in the market for. A very good purchasing experience indeed.
 
For those of you who have purchased the Oktava Mk012 from sound-room, did you get the windscreen accessory or is it better to purchase a 3rd party one?
 
In my opinion, the windscreen there doesnt really do much.

You *need* the BBG and the shockmount. You can consider it pretty
much part of the cost of the mic.

I'm a HUGE fan of the octava btw... best sounding mic Ive ever used.
 
Geoff... the extreme conditions screen they sell is okay... but if you bite the bullet and get a BBG then all the concerns about possible buzzing or other wind distortion are totally eliminated. I agree that it really should be considered part of the cost of using that mic.

Indoors... on a boom... with NOBODY moving... not the talent and not the boom pole (meaning boomed via a STAND) then you can get away with simple or NO wind protection... like in the interview situations I told you about. But if the person so much as waves their arms while talking that wind will be enough to create some distortion if it hits the mic! Yeah... I know it seems nutty to accept this level of sensitivity to wind... but MOST good mics are sensitive to wind anyway... so even if you went with another mic you'd still need SOMETHING decent. It just happens that the Oktava pretty much demands that you get a top of the line screen from day one.

The mic is SO cheap for the sound quality that you get that the combined cost of a BBG and the Oktava is still cheaper then any other "normally decent" mic and cheap windscreen.

Shockmounts and windscreens are both bitter pills to swallow after finding such a great deal on a mic... but it's just the way it is. The difference between elation and disappointment with the Oktava is always defined by how well the user is supporting the mic.
 
What a great mic! I just picked up the M012 from the sound room, got some cable from Matt, and purchased the BBG and KSSM as well. All the indoor tests I've done have been very pleasing. I'm so glad I didn't spend $500+ on another mic, would have been a waste of money IMO. One question: Will the BBG do the trick indoors AND outdoors? Or should I get another windscreen for any reason or situation?
 
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For normal (very light to no wind) conditions the BBG will handle things outdoors... but if there's anything from a moderate breeze all the way to a pretty strong wind then you can get a Wind Jammer (Rycote also) and that will handle it.

That's a fur jacket that attaches via velcro or drawstrings. Significant wind requires fur... but the BBG alone still outperforms the Extreme Conditions Screen... so for many outdoor situations the bare screen will handle it, but eventually you'll want to have that fur jacket in your camera bag. It only takes about 5 seconds to put it on if you find yourself in a situation that's causing rumble. Once you get one of those (along with the other excellent mount and screen) the Oktava practically becomes a "do anything" mic.
 
when i bought my mk012, i got the wind screen, just cuz it didnt cost much, and i sometimes use those things for various reasons.

reason 1: interviews. i often do interviews using a mic stand with seated interview subjects, and its not practical to have the bigger BBG on sometimes, so i swap it out for just the small foam windscreen - no issues yet.

reason 2: voice overs. ive actually found the oktava to be pretty decent when it comes to VO - sure, not the best, but i quite like its sound for some voices. and again, the bbg isnt practical, so i slip on the foam cover.

reason 3: extremely tight spots. very very occasionally, ive used the mk012 as a plant mic, or in rooms with ridiculously low ceilings, or in cars. in these cases, the smaller foam (crap-o-matic) shield actually does its job just fine.


when it boils down to it, though, these reasons are all the same thing: the mic doesnt move, the mic isnt in a windy environment.

so thats my cheap ass 2cents. :)
 
Thanks to Matt and others here I joined the club today and ordered the Oktava hyper from Paul at Sound Room. Matt gave all the raves about Paul as well as the mike but I was a little skeptical since everybody has had such great experiences at EVS, which I'm sorry to say I have not had.

So I was thinking here may be another place where some peoples view of great service is different than mine. Well I was blown away by Paul. What a really really nice person. He was so friendly and took time to actually talk with me and explain things and answer questions. Clearly the best service I have had at any retailer. I actually felt guilty for getting the 5% discount. In fact, I wasn't going to ask for it because I figured his profit margin was so low. He gave it to me without asking.

When I told him I hope to give him a bigger sale in the future he said, "this is a big sale to us." He actually thanked me for calling and giving him business! That is rare these days. I only wish he was carrying the Rycote BBG and Windjammer because I would have bought it from him. He did say that he was going to look into getting that line in.

Help keep this guy in business. Do yourself and all of us a favor and buy whatever you can from him. And if it costs a couple of dollars more get it from there anyway, the service will be well worth it.

Thanks Matt and others for telling us about the Sound Room and Paul. Next week I'll have an Oktava and then it will be time to get those "Electrical impulse transmission devices" or whatever that fancy new name Matt is calling his cables.
 
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