Z
Zoomforce
Guest
Re: Puppetry with live action
Neil.. dude you gotta send me a clip of that.
Neil.. dude you gotta send me a clip of that.
Re: Puppetry with live action
lol ..i havent composited it all together yet, but i can send you a little clip of some of the funny greenscreen work if you like.. LOL you can laugh at my scotch taped together little paper green screen that i put together for 2.00 from the craft store.
..its nowhere near professional, but PPro 1.5's "greenscreen" filter keys it fine.
lol ..i havent composited it all together yet, but i can send you a little clip of some of the funny greenscreen work if you like.. LOL you can laugh at my scotch taped together little paper green screen that i put together for 2.00 from the craft store.
..its nowhere near professional, but PPro 1.5's "greenscreen" filter keys it fine.
HansK
Veteran
Re: Puppetry with live action
Heh heh... I can relate from my attempts. Here's my shameful puppetry in action
http://www.hanskellner.com/archives/2004/02/21/tough_guy_marionette_music_video.html
I did this earlier this year to practice compositing.
Heh heh... I can relate from my attempts. Here's my shameful puppetry in action
http://www.hanskellner.com/archives/2004/02/21/tough_guy_marionette_music_video.html
I did this earlier this year to practice compositing.
moe_snodgrass
Well-known member
Re: Puppetry with live action
[quote author=Dave link=board=fx;num=1097435885;start=0#3 date=10/10/04 at 18:20:08] and then go through the pain stakingly long and slow process of removing the visible strings from each frame in post.[/quote]
If you decide to go this route experiment with painting the strings black-white-black-white, etc (or grey-white) with a magic marker or whatever every quarter or half-inch or so (again, experiment). You can get away with a lot because white strings will show over a dark background and black strings will show over a white background but the patterned strings kinda just work against most backgrounds. You'd probably still do some work on the strings in post but a lot will be acceptable right out of the camera.
This method has been used in stage and hollywood for genertations and in the days before computers this is what they went with, zits and all.
[quote author=Dave link=board=fx;num=1097435885;start=0#3 date=10/10/04 at 18:20:08] and then go through the pain stakingly long and slow process of removing the visible strings from each frame in post.[/quote]
If you decide to go this route experiment with painting the strings black-white-black-white, etc (or grey-white) with a magic marker or whatever every quarter or half-inch or so (again, experiment). You can get away with a lot because white strings will show over a dark background and black strings will show over a white background but the patterned strings kinda just work against most backgrounds. You'd probably still do some work on the strings in post but a lot will be acceptable right out of the camera.
This method has been used in stage and hollywood for genertations and in the days before computers this is what they went with, zits and all.
G
Guest
Guest
Re: Puppetry with live action
That's a sound idea but my character is wearing red. So, should I color the strings red where they meet his clothing?
That's a sound idea but my character is wearing red. So, should I color the strings red where they meet his clothing?
moe_snodgrass
Well-known member
Re: Puppetry with live action
Ideally you could change color of strings with every location/background but that's a lot of work too, although not as much as editing frame by frame. You'd have to weigh the cost/benefit to see if it might be worthwhile. Either way, you'll have to be careful to keep light mostly off the strings. You'll have to experiment. Also, remember, we're not fooling anyone here. If the viewers see strings here and there, they won't be suprised but the less they see them the less they might be distracted. The black-white or grey-white is meant to be a happy medium that will work against more backgrounds universally, at least better than if your strings were universally a solid color throughout. On a slightly different note, depending on the genre, you might also considering experimenting by converting a test sequence or two to black & white in post just to see how the black-white strings look and what mood the B&W conveys overall. Worth a try experimenting with anything.
Ideally you could change color of strings with every location/background but that's a lot of work too, although not as much as editing frame by frame. You'd have to weigh the cost/benefit to see if it might be worthwhile. Either way, you'll have to be careful to keep light mostly off the strings. You'll have to experiment. Also, remember, we're not fooling anyone here. If the viewers see strings here and there, they won't be suprised but the less they see them the less they might be distracted. The black-white or grey-white is meant to be a happy medium that will work against more backgrounds universally, at least better than if your strings were universally a solid color throughout. On a slightly different note, depending on the genre, you might also considering experimenting by converting a test sequence or two to black & white in post just to see how the black-white strings look and what mood the B&W conveys overall. Worth a try experimenting with anything.
Re: Puppetry with live action
..in my tests i find that very thin clear fishing line works fine as long as you dont light it so it refracts back into the lense.. the colors of whatever is behind it come through, so if your using a greenscreen like me, they key out with the rest of the green, and most of the time, you can barley see them at all over the charachter. ..if you can see them a little, you can just blend them in a little, but that way you wont have to remove any lines aside from possibly a little work right over the charachter. but its hard to see fine fishing line to begin with..
..in my tests i find that very thin clear fishing line works fine as long as you dont light it so it refracts back into the lense.. the colors of whatever is behind it come through, so if your using a greenscreen like me, they key out with the rest of the green, and most of the time, you can barley see them at all over the charachter. ..if you can see them a little, you can just blend them in a little, but that way you wont have to remove any lines aside from possibly a little work right over the charachter. but its hard to see fine fishing line to begin with..
HansK
Veteran
Re: Puppetry with live action
In my little test I used a puppet that had black lines... since it's the only puppet I own
Most of the problems from the lines were when they appeared in front of the puppet. Otherwise, since they are thin, they were easily filtered/blurred out when in front of the green screen. I believe I played with feathering to help with this.
So, using fishing line or a similar clear line should work rather well.
In my little test I used a puppet that had black lines... since it's the only puppet I own
Most of the problems from the lines were when they appeared in front of the puppet. Otherwise, since they are thin, they were easily filtered/blurred out when in front of the green screen. I believe I played with feathering to help with this.
So, using fishing line or a similar clear line should work rather well.
Thistlebop
Well-known member
Re: Puppetry with live action
You might consider leaving the Strings "IN". After all, if it worked in Team America, it could work anywhere.
--Bop
You might consider leaving the Strings "IN". After all, if it worked in Team America, it could work anywhere.
--Bop
Re: Puppetry with live action
bwahaha! these grabs are safe enough to show now.. heres some screenshots of my almost finished little funny project. you can see the fishing line over his head a in the one shot, i didnt remove them aside from what the green screen removed.. that is actually the only shot you can breifly see a string for actually cause the light caught it. lol. but i dont care to remove it.
this one is of the guy that is working with the stuffed monkey .
bwahaha! these grabs are safe enough to show now.. heres some screenshots of my almost finished little funny project. you can see the fishing line over his head a in the one shot, i didnt remove them aside from what the green screen removed.. that is actually the only shot you can breifly see a string for actually cause the light caught it. lol. but i dont care to remove it.
this one is of the guy that is working with the stuffed monkey .
Beat Takeshi
Two-Hip Shakur
Re: Puppetry with live action
[quote author=Jarred Land link=board=fx;num=1097435885;start=0#7 date=10/10/04 at 21:45:34]the 100 has a good macro, but the 100a has an incredible macro.[/quote]
Yeah, but i have üßëR°Mí¢Rø
For those who dont know what Uber Micro is....http://www.purepwnage.com/
[quote author=Jarred Land link=board=fx;num=1097435885;start=0#7 date=10/10/04 at 21:45:34]the 100 has a good macro, but the 100a has an incredible macro.[/quote]
Yeah, but i have üßëR°Mí¢Rø
For those who dont know what Uber Micro is....http://www.purepwnage.com/
G
Guest
Guest
Re: Puppetry with live action
Neil,
Awesome looking composites. How did you change the monkey's mouth? He has an expression in one shot and looks like he's speaking in another shot.
When you greenscreened the monkey in the walking shot, did you shoot the monkey on location? Or did you shoot the monkey in a studio environment (replicating the outdoor lighting) and then composited the outdoor scenery?
Can't wait to see the finished product.
Dave
Neil,
Awesome looking composites. How did you change the monkey's mouth? He has an expression in one shot and looks like he's speaking in another shot.
When you greenscreened the monkey in the walking shot, did you shoot the monkey on location? Or did you shoot the monkey in a studio environment (replicating the outdoor lighting) and then composited the outdoor scenery?
Can't wait to see the finished product.
Dave
Re: Puppetry with live action
hey thanks,
all of the monkey shots were done in the "studio environment" ...AKA a little bedroom in my place where we quickly taped 2 peices of pretty close to chroma green paper from the craftstore to the closet door.
ha ..the monkeys mouth is my mouth masked in and color matched over the monkeys mouth area. so i talked and made expressions for the monkey.. like they do on that late night talk show when they put a live mouth over a picture of somebody... so if anyone wanted to know what my teeth or tounge looked like.. well there ya go
hey thanks,
all of the monkey shots were done in the "studio environment" ...AKA a little bedroom in my place where we quickly taped 2 peices of pretty close to chroma green paper from the craftstore to the closet door.
ha ..the monkeys mouth is my mouth masked in and color matched over the monkeys mouth area. so i talked and made expressions for the monkey.. like they do on that late night talk show when they put a live mouth over a picture of somebody... so if anyone wanted to know what my teeth or tounge looked like.. well there ya go