Public domain film -> public domain screenplay ?

J

Joe N. Obody

Member
I found a public domain classic film from 1960 that I want to rewrite, modernize, change the location, change the hook and inciting and basic plot somewhat. Wondering about the legality of this. Hmm. Found a couple of blog articles on this, links below. One would think if the movie is in the public domain (as is the case with this film) that the screenplay would also be public domain? The one snaffoo I read in one of the blog articles was to be careful using any screenplay material that did not make it into the film, as that could possible be still protected; as I do not have access to the screenplay that issue would not be a concern. Just wondering if anybody has insight or thoughts on this.

http://www.publicdomaintreasurehunt...n-is-the-screenplay-in-the-public-domain-too/
http://www.lawlawlandblog.com/2011/02/qa_what_are_the_rules_for_maki.html
 
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Joe N. Obody said:
I found a public domain classic film from 1960 that I want to rewrite, modernize, change the location, change the hook and inciting and basic plot somewhat. Wondering about the legality of this. Hmm. Found a couple of blog articles on this, links below. One would think if the movie is in the public domain (as is the case with this film) that the screenplay would also be public domain? The one snaffoo I read in one of the blog articles was to be careful using any screenplay material that did not make it into the film, as that could possible be still protected; as I do not have access to the screenplay that issue would not be a concern. Just wondering if anybody has insight or thoughts on this.

http://www.publicdomaintreasurehunt...n-is-the-screenplay-in-the-public-domain-too/
http://www.lawlawlandblog.com/2011/02/qa_what_are_the_rules_for_maki.html
Click to expand...

Since I'm not a lawyer... My take away 'understanding' is that:

1) If you write a 'new' script which uses only the PD Film visuals and audio, you are 'ok'. So, if you are remaking Ed Wood's classic "Glen or Glenda?"(1953)... it would appear that you can freely use what appears on screen, or dialog Wood-en though it may be...

2) One must be careful to only use movie visuals/audio. Any use of 'from the original script', or 'original novel', need be carefully investigated as to that document's PD status. (I don't know that a script was ever 'published' and so could come under the unpublished category, and claims of copyright made, should you use such material...).

Fortunately I've never seen Ed Wood's script (perhaps neither did he...) for "Glen or Glenda?"... So it looks like clear sailing...

As a note, and something I didn't realize, and I'd have to check this out further... if one 'writes from scratch' some scene, and lo and behold, such a scene is in the 'original script' but was never presented in the resulting movie, and you have never had access to said script, that is not a 'copyright infringement'... apparently copyright does recognize 'parallel' independent development which end up looking 'very similar', but does not call that 'infringement'.
 
It sure gets complicated. Especially since that 1998 Sonny Bono Copyright Extension act. Been reading on that.
http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-the-sonny-bono-copyright-term-extension-act-of-1998-ctea.htm
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copyright_Term_Extension_Act
But it still appears that
"In the United States... works published before 1964 that did not have their copyrights renewed 28 years after first publication year .. are in the public domain"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copyright#Duration
So while the Sonny Bono act extends copyright quite a bit, it does not appear to be retroactive on works published <1964 if those works never renewed their copyrights by their original copyright date plus 28 years; which in my case would apply to a 1960 film/screenplay that as far as I know never had its copyright renewed as it is one cheesy low budget film and is listed on imdb as being on the list of films in the public domain. But like you I am not a lawyer, just too cheap at this point to hire a lawyer (like i said, I would rather vacation in Washington DC and hop a taxi to the Library of Congress Copyright Office and find any copyright documents there, pay myself to do that and get a vacation out of it rather than hire an expensive Joe Lawyer, Esquire!)
~J.O.
 
Joe N. Obody said:
It sure gets complicated. Especially since that 1998 Sonny Bono Copyright Extension act. Been reading on that.
http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-the-sonny-bono-copyright-term-extension-act-of-1998-ctea.htm
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copyright_Term_Extension_Act
But it still appears that
"In the United States... works published before 1964 that did not have their copyrights renewed 28 years after first publication year .. are in the public domain"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copyright#Duration
So while the Sonny Bono act extends copyright quite a bit, it does not appear to be retroactive on works published <1964 if those works never renewed their copyrights by their original copyright date plus 28 years; which in my case would apply to a 1960 film/screenplay that as far as I know never had its copyright renewed as it is one cheesy low budget film and is listed on imdb as being on the list of films in the public domain. But like you I am not a lawyer, just too cheap at this point to hire a lawyer (like i said, I would rather vacation in Washington DC and hop a taxi to the Library of Congress Copyright Office and find any copyright documents there, pay myself to do that and get a vacation out of it rather than hire an expensive Joe Lawyer, Esquire!)
~J.O.
Click to expand...

Just checked, there's an online search feature of the Library of Congress... sorry to ruin your travel plans...

Copyright Registration Lookup

(There's mention that this service is not a 'legal document', so I presume one would have to pay for a copy of the legal certification.)

I looked up "Glen or Glenda"(1953)... bunch of results... so why is there a claim out there that states it's PD???

"Plan 9 From Outer Space"(1959) we have...
---
Type of Work: Motion Picture
Registration Number / Date: PA0001633215 / 2007-10-22
Application Title: Plan 9 From Outer Space.
Title: Plan 9 From Outer Space.
Description: Videodisc (DVD)
Copyright Claimant: Legend Films, Inc. Address: 5075 Shoreham Place, Suite 120, San Diego, CA 92122.
Date of Creation: 2005
Date of Publication: 2005-12-15
Nation of First Publication: United States
Authorship on Application: Legend Films, Inc., employer for hire.
Previous Registration: 1981, PA-102-338.
Pre-existing Material: Black and white, 1951 motion picture entitled "Plan 9 From Outer Space".
Basis of Claim: Colorization of entire motion picture and additional audiovisual material.
Copyright Note: C.O. correspondence.
---

What is interesting is "Basis of Claim".... "Colorization of entire motion picture and additional audiovisual material."...

----

And here's another...
----
Type of Work: Motion Picture
Registration Number / Date: PA0000102338 / 1981-04-23
Title: Plan 9 from outer space / written, produced, directed by Edward D. Wood, Jr.
Imprint: [s.l. : AD.C.A. release, 1959]
Description: 1 videocassette (V H S) (79 min.) : sd., b&w ; 1/2 in.
Notes: Title on housing: Plan nine from outer space.
Filmed under the title Grave robbers from outer space.
Deposit includes screenplay (1 v.)
Cast: Bela Lugosi, Vampira, Lyle Talbot et al.
Performer: Narrated by Criswell.
Credits: Director of photography: William C. Thompson; music: Gordon Zahler; film editor: Edward D. Wood, Jr.
Copyright Claimant: Reynolds Pictures, Inc.
Date of Creation: 1958
Date of Publication: 1958-05-01
Authorship on Application: Reynolds Pictures, Inc., employer for hire.
Copyright Note: C.O. correspondence.

Other Title: Plan nine from outer space.
Grave robbers from outer space.
Names: Wood, Edward D., Jr.
Reynolds Pictures, Inc.
----

But the registration date is 1981... and VHS tape is mentioned for the 'media'... so what's up with that???

There are a number of other records, which may be 'assignments' of rights as the 'property' passes through various holding companies and the like... including a mention of 'Disney'...

I think you need a Pennsylvania Lawyer to figure this all out...
 
I am not a lawyer so this is all conjecture, as always, consult an expensive attorney...
Public Domain works including films in the public domain, per my amateur understanding (again I am not a lawyer, consult an expensive lawyer) can be reproduced on say DVD or Blu Ray by you or me or others for distribution, even to make money doing so. So a company making a DVD off a public domain film can of course copyright their DVD (their cover art, their pricing scheme, their codec, their animated DVD menu) of the public domain film, and sell it. That looks to be what you are seeing. Kind of like opensource software in a way, where it can be legal per the legalese of the GNU license to copy and distribute opensource (GNU license, usually) software for a profit to cover reasonable costs of material and labor and such. So if anybody wants to I suppose they can take Plan 9 From Outer Space and start selling it anyway they can-- of course as it can be downloaded free and legal if public domain, makes it a bit harder to sell it on DVD, but hey knock yourself out; many companies do this, selling dvd sets of e.g. old (public domain) horror movies as a collection, I see that all the time at stores, online; convenient, no downloading.
:)
 
sounds half-baked. theres WORLDS of fantastic public domain literature out there, more than you can adapt in a lifetime. if youre a horror filmmaker (Im guessing you likely are), you can make an hp lovecraft movie with no worries. you can make a DRACULA movie if you wanted to. and yes, call it DRACULA. ...the 60's? dig deeper, I say. what movie is it anyway? maybe you want to keep it secret so no one will STEAL YOUR IDEA.... talk about IRONIC !!!!
 
I'll go one step further-
start reading and collecting old literature and PLAYS in your genre. Think of it as something you do for the rest of your moviemaking life.
I remember once reading this awesome public domain one-act play about a washed up boxer and a prostitute, they try to commit suicide but they didnt pay the gas bill and so the oven didnt emit gas and they decide to go one more day, it was freekin awesome. Wish i woulda saved it.
Anyways that any of us horror moviemakers can use lovecraft or poe is pretty amazing and almost too-good-to-be-true. I have at least three big fat books, old ghost story collections, literally hundreds of stories, so many gems that can be done as shorts or features. I also collect stuff on my hard drive.
I try to read often, it also helps you to UNDERSTAND YOUR GENRE on a deeper level. Keep in mind adapting isn't a way to skip the screenwriting process, you still have to write it, its just a way to kickstart the process and give you something as a springboard, kind of like a goal to reach, and it IS easier than inventing EVERYTHING from scratch.

Kubrick, Hitchcock, these guys all adapted.

also real quick note about "old timey" stuff: JUST PUT IT IN MODERN TIMES. Its THAT SIMPLE, and doesnt take as much rewriting and changing as you might think.
http://www.classichorrorstories.com/stories/stories.html
http://www.one-act-plays.com/royalty_free_plays.html
 
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nycineaste said:
I'll go one step further-
start reading and collecting old literature and PLAYS in your genre.
Click to expand...

I don't think that was what the original poster was getting at... while I think everyone should collect material from the past, no matter how many times it may have been adapted by others, the fact that it is public domain is a boon to the the nolo budget filmmaker.

What I think the original poster was getting at is specifically a 'film' that has fallen into PD status, and using that specific adaptation from days gone by to remake that adaptation.

If the film is in fact in Public Domain status, then it is 'fair game' for use without licensing, and from the various sites, one can 'recreate' the script scene by scene or shot by shot, provided your resulting remake contains nothing more than the original PD material, or your completely 'new' additions.

I also would mention that I don't agree with the idea that remaking a film that is PD status, is in any way some how 'less than' adapting form some original source, that is also in PD status. Both a new adaptation or a remake require new work for the filmmaker, cast and crew.

I would suspect even a 'careful' remake would deviate from the original, especially for the nolo budgeted filmmaker, because one could not recreate sets or locations depicted in the original to any great exactitude...
 
j1clark@ucsd.edu said:
I don't think that was what the original poster was getting at... while I think everyone should collect material from the past, no matter how many times it may have been adapted by others, the fact that it is public domain is a boon to the the nolo budget filmmaker. What I think the original poster was getting at is specifically a 'film' that has fallen into PD status, and using that specific adaptation from days gone by to remake that adaptation. If the film is in fact in Public Domain status, then it is 'fair game' for use without licensing, and from the various sites, one can 'recreate' the script scene by scene or shot by shot, provided your resulting remake contains nothing more than the original PD material, or your completely 'new' additions. I also would mention that I don't agree with the idea that remaking a film that is PD status, is in any way some how 'less than' adapting form some original source, that is also in PD status. Both a new adaptation or a remake require new work for the filmmaker, cast and crew. I would suspect even a 'careful' remake would deviate from the original, especially for the nolo budgeted filmmaker, because one could not recreate sets or locations depicted in the original to any great exactitude...
Click to expand...

I will be rewriting a great deal of dialogue which to be honest is quite lame in the original, although maybe it felt right for the time. I am changing the backstory and hook quite a bit, changing the ending, changing the location, changing character profiles. Borrowing the basic premise for the most part, and some dialogue although with a lot of rewriting.

Adapting a classic film that is public domain and rewriting it including updating and changing dialogue is a proven successful method-- just look at how it was done for The Blob (Frank Darabont, who went on to fame with The Shawshank Redemption, The Green Mile...) and Alien (Dan O'Bannon, who went on to write many produced films including recently Prometheus). Anyhow, the purpose of my post/thread is not to argue the validity from an artistic point of whether to adapt something from public domain, but to discuss more the legality of doing that, of clarifying public domain status of a screenplay for a public domain film; so I have no interest in discussing the artistic merits anymore, as some (nycineaste) might want to do.
~j.o.
 
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sorry to try to throw you off your original plan, I guess you know what you want to do. I didn't find it unartistic so much as I thought it was a wonky plan that would be hard to pull off without some uneccesary legal and writing pains. I agree remakes are a tried and true approach to making movies. Go forth!!!
 
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