ProTools LE 7.4 updates?

Jarek Zabczynski

Jarek Zabczynski

Veteran
Howdy.

I sold my Mbox 1 system a while back and recently got the Mbox 2 Pro with 7.4 LE.
I see some updates on the Digidesign website. Which ones should I install? I see these CS1, CS2, CS3 things...wtf? Do I just install the CS3 update or do I need to do them all? Digidesign is IMO the worst with support and customer service. I called them once and I got a message to call back in an hour because it was lunchtime. :kali:

I know my way around PT, but getting this progam up and running with the correct versions is ridiculous.

Any help would be great. What version I should be running and what updates do I need.

Here's what I got... Intel Quad 2.66 OSX 10.4.11

The Mbox® 2 Pro is the ultimate high-definition portable Pro Tools LE system, packing a wide-range of analog and digital I/O connections into a mobile audio workstation.

Pro Tools LE 7.4 software. Free Upgrade to latest Pro Tools Version available when you register.

Free Bomb Factory® Plug-ins:
The Free Bomb Factory® plug-ins offer powerful effects and utilities from the makers of some of the very best digital emulations of classic analog processors in the industry.

* Bomb Factory BF76 Compressor
* BF Essential Clip Remover
* BF Essential Correlation Meter
* BF Essential Meter Bridge
* BF Essential Noise Meter
* BF Essential Tuner
* Funk Logic Mastererizer

Protools IGN Pack includes:
* Amplitube LE by IK Multimedia
* Analog Factory SE by Arturia
* BFD Lite by FXpansion
* Live Lite 6 Digidesign Edition by Ableton
* Melodyne Uno Essential by Celemony
* Ozone 3 Lite by iZotope
* Reason Adapted 3 by Propellerheads
* Spectron Lite by iZotope
* Timewarp 2600 Lite by Way Out Ware
* Trash Lite by iZotope
* Xpand! by Digidesign A.I.R.
* ProSessions SE by M-Audio
* One year membership to Broadjam.com
* One contest entry at GarageBand.com
* One year membership to Sonicbids
* Pro Tools Method One Instructional DVD

Thanks! :D
 
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Hey Jester,
The CS3 update includes the other two updates, so that would be the one to get. A good place for PT questions and info about updates is the Digidesign users forum at duc.digidesign.com.
 
My experience with Digi is that they are absolutely one of the best companies in terms of support. Just my opinion. You should check out the DUC as Brad suggested.
 
Agreed on the support question. Digi is a company that has no problem charging sky-high prices for its professional product line (Pro Tools HD), and they make a lot of money doing that since they've been the across-the-board pro audio industry standard for quite some time now. The upside is that they plow a good deal of that profit into support and development. Aside from a few really tough cases (like a mysterious GUI freeze bug that took them years to fix), they are on the case promptly, and few new PT releases have any serious bugs for the vast majority of users.

I use PT HD every day, and it's a very very solid product. The MBox and their other lower cost solutions are excellent too, the main downside being a 32 track limit (which is very significant for music producers). All their competitors have vastly greater track counts. In this case, Digi, as the 800 pound gorilla in the room, knows it doesn't have to care.

Their forum, the Digidesign User Conference is among the best you'll find anywhere, and is regularly followed by Digi support staff. I have solved many an issue through it.

Regarding CS updates, you can generally just use the latest (it will include all previous updates), but it's always good to check the extensive compatibility documentation in the "Support" section of their site. Virtually every hardware/software combination, including operating systems down to .1 rev increments, CPU chip sets, video cards, and on and on, is documented in comprehensive detail. If there's a compatibility issue to be found, chances are 99% that they already know about it and have it documented.

On the other hand, as with all things computerese, if it ain't broke, don't fix it. Unless you need to do a CS update, don't. Most of them are to fix highly specific, often isolated problems that affect a very small number of users. It's always possible that a CS update will cause a problem for a given system. Only update if you have a good reason to...
 
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I bought the LE for my new Mac Pro. No go on Leopard... (fortunatelly I have the old PC still running and can practice on that).

Any news when???
 
Can you install OSX 10.4.9 as a clean install on your Mac Pro? If so, reboot under that and you should be good to go.
 
I will also chime in in support of Digi's support. Phone support used to be flakey but has improved. On the other hand the fastest by far way to find a solution is to look through the DUC.
Track count is sort of an issue with Le. I say sort of because out of the box your getting 32 solid tracks and with the music upgrade 48 solid tracks. A lot of out fits talk about "unlimited" tracks but that just isn't the way it works out. On a native system there is only so much you can push through. This is of course changing as computers get ridiculously powerful. It wasn't so long ago that the 1.2 gig single processor G4 was a protected export because it qualified as a "super computer"..., what does that make an Intel eight core???
Anyway I have worked on competing products that choked at around 20 tracks on a Dual 2 gig G5 with 3 gigs of ram. That said I wish Le was voice limited instead of active track limited. Post tends to use a lot of sparse tracks and 32 is a bit of a pain.

Petrus, the DUC is the place to look. Digi lags behind on Apple updates these days because Avid bought them and Avid and Apple are not friends so unfortunately Digi pays the price in lack of help and advance info from the big A. They do have PT working on the 8 core and 10.5 so probably in the next month or so you will see the other platforms supported in 10.5. My guess is that Le will lead the pack since the non "pro" users are more likely to make the jump to 10.5 first.
 
I just installed PTLE 7.4 on 10.5.2 on a 2008 - 8core Mac Pro..... and it's running.
Can't say that for 3rd party pluggins.
Others on DUC reporting PTLE running on 10.5.1 and 10.5.2
 
Noiz2 said:
I have worked on competing products that choked at around 20 tracks on a Dual 2 gig G5 with 3 gigs of ram.
Click to expand...

Really? At 44.1/48KHz? Wth a MOTU 2408 MkII and Digital Performer I've run well over 50 tracks on a G4 Dual 1GHz just fine. Plugin counts were low, but with my current machine (a dual 2.7 GHz G5, 3 GB RAM) it's not much of an issue (and an 8-Core Mac Pro has about 4 times more DSP horsepower than that). Logic, which I admittedly use far less frequently, seems about the same.

...out of the box your getting 32 solid tracks [with PTLE] and with the music upgrade 48 solid tracks.
Click to expand...

The "Music" upgrade costs $500 though, and only works with 96KHz capable systems, the cheapest of which is the $800 MBox 2 Pro (although the $400 M-Audio 410 or better will also work). It comes with some nice plugins, but it's rather expensive if what you really want is the 16 additional tracks. If you want full Time Code capabilities too you'll have to spring for the $1300 DV Toolkit. So it's $2100 (with an Mbox2 Pro) to get what's included in a MOTU UltraLite for $600, which has no track count limits aside from platform-dependent ones.

Anything above 48 tracks puts you in PT HD territory, where the cheapest system is $10K (HD1 and one 96 I/O). A more mainstream PTHD rig, let's say HD2 and two 192s expanded for 24 I/O, costs $21,600. For HD2 with 48 I/O you're talking $32,200. Go to HD3 and it's $35,200. Many studios I frequent have even more I/O. A 48 in 96 out/HD3 rig (like at Legacy Studio A509 here in NYC, IIRC) will run you just under $45,000.

By comparison, a MOTU rig with 48 high quality I/O (3 HD 192s, reportedly very similar sounding to Digi's 192) costs $5100. With FW 800 drives on an 8-Core Mac Pro, it would have a track/plugin count that should satisfy all but the biggest power users.

(All prices above are list.)

Don't get me wrong - I own an expanded PT HD2 system and love it. It's just way overpriced. Digi is in the position to make you pay through the nose for their products...so they do...
 
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I'm not arguing with you that much, Digi is not cheap. It was the low priced spread when it came on the scene (Wave frame started at $30k) but times have changed.
THe product I was talking about was choking on 20 tracks no plugins. But I have experienced other instabilities in native systems also. I'm in post and not many folks out side of mix stages need any more than 8 outs so an HD1 is the norm.
One thing that often isn't taken into account is that Digi has a very generous update program. Those MOTU boxes will be yours to find a buyer for when you upgrade, Digi will cut your cost by about 50% with a hardware trade in. With the way hardware prices have gone that is a credit generally way over the used price.

That said it's a pricey professional tool. I have found as an audio editor I like it better than anything I have used (and that is quite a few). As a all in one music app it's probably lacking. I don't use MIDI much but from what I hear that is pretty weak.
I'm not a big Digi rah rah boy, but I do like the product and since this is what I do for a living it's an investment I need to make.

I have some very mixed dealings with MOTU. In the past there support has sucked but I was on the phone with them the other day and they were GREAT, so maybe that has changed. They are still a bit closed lipped. No downloadable manuals and if you buy a box used and want to get a manual you have to jump through hoops just to buy one. There drivers have been spotty, and they tend to drop support very quickly after a product is no longer sold. As a comparison I was using a PT Mix system (and getting CS updates) long after Mix was history. I have a fair amount of MOTU boxes because they often are a good deal (anyone need a MIDI mixer 7?) but I have often been frustrated with buggy drivers and lack of support.
On the flip side I have heard Digital Performer is great and it certainly has a load of post features so...
 
How is LE 7.4 with post production without the DV toolkit? I prefer Nuendo for post work but I have a friend that is an animator and he is looking for something to record his dialog, incorperate music and sfx without the $1800 Nuendo pricetag. Since the only input he will need is 1 XLR I think the MBox 2 Mini would be perfect for him.

My understanding is without DV toolkit there is no timecode support? I guess he could work around by exporting the video with a timecode burnin to work with. Besides that are there any major limitations to using LE without the DV toolkit?

Can it play video full screen on a seperate display?
 
Matthew R. Rodwell said:
How is LE 7.4 with post production without the DV toolkit? I prefer Nuendo for post work but I have a friend that is an animator and he is looking for something to record his dialog, incorperate music and sfx without the $1800 Nuendo pricetag. Since the only input he will need is 1 XLR I think the MBox 2 Mini would be perfect for him.

My understanding is without DV toolkit there is no timecode support? I guess he could work around by exporting the video with a timecode burnin to work with. Besides that are there any major limitations to using LE without the DV toolkit?

Can it play video full screen on a seperate display?
Click to expand...

Pro Tools without the toolkit is just fine. I've been running it that way for about three years and I've done a lot of film sound work. Basically, you use the picture (the quicktime) as your guide track, and you base all of your sync off of that. Having a TC burn in isn't necessary because you can generally go off the the runtime in Pro Tools. You can do this just fine, in a short film at least, but it gets a little more hairy the in longer films. The toolkit really isn't necessary, but it helps is what I'm saying. I just got it about a month ago, and the real benefit I have with it now is the ability to use 48 audio tracks instead of just 32 without the toolkit. The toolkit is important if you're trying to sync up production sound with certain shots by using the reference TC burn-in in the picture. The only time you'd have to worry is if you were doing real feature work, in which case you'd have to pull down the audio to "film speed" theater spec, which is 47.97khz sample rate or something around there. You basically run your session setup with that option turned on. If you're just doing straight video and quicktimes, standard 48khz sample rate is just fine.

And yes, you can play back the picture full screen if you want. It's going to size the video to be as big as possible on your monitor without stretching the picture, so if you're playing a 16X9 file on your 4X3 monitor, your desktop background will be visible on the bottom and top of your video playback.

Keep in mind too that Pro Tools is the industry standard. You would be able to take your Pro Tools session into about %90 of the post houses in the world. If you went with anything else, you'd probably have to make an OMF/AAF of your audio edits/mix and take the extra steps of converting things over. Pro Tools LE with the MBox 2 Mini and the DV Toolkit 2 would probably run you about $1600 after taxes. The Toolkit alone is about $1200, unless you can find it on eBay for much cheaper.
 
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Matthew R. Rodwell said:
How is LE 7.4 with post production without the DV toolkit? I prefer Nuendo for post work but I have a friend that is an animator and he is looking for something to record his dialog, incorperate music and sfx without the $1800 Nuendo pricetag. Since the only input he will need is 1 XLR I think the MBox 2 Mini would be perfect for him.

My understanding is without DV toolkit there is no timecode support? I guess he could work around by exporting the video with a timecode burnin to work with. Besides that are there any major limitations to using LE without the DV toolkit?

Can it play video full screen on a seperate display?
Click to expand...

If you are going to be working with video files instead of tape (pretty much everyone) you can sync directly to the file. If you are the only person doing work you don't need to worry much about absolute TC positions as long as there is a head pop. Also Le can use TC it just can't switch to TC. So for instance if you start with a session template from an HD system that has TC as primary AND secondary counters the secondary will stay in TC unless you switch it. If you start with a template that has markers at FFOA or start mark then you can just aline with that. I regularly work in mixed Le and TDM shows and it all works quite well. If your doing conforming and your getting change notes HD is pretty much required but if your working on those kinds of shows you probably can afford to move up. Also I think there is a plugin that works in Le that will give you a TC readout.

And of course you can get or create a window burn.

The mini is fine for what your talking about.
 
Thanks for the info guys. It sounds like that would be perfect for him to get all of his dialog recorded on. I will probably do most of his post work and scoring on Nuendo with my computer so I am not to concerned with a lack of features in LE.

Anyone run into latency issues with the Mbox mini 2?
 
Any MBox 2 should be fine for dialog (but don't tell the people on Gear Slutz I said that.:lipsrseal)

If you buy a Toolkit, I'd get the DV Toolkit, if anything for DigiTranslator, VocAlign, and the extra tracks. DigiTranslator makes ProTools cross platform with imports and exports. VocAlign and TL Space reverb alone make the DV Toolkit worth the money IMO. And who doesn't need more tracks?

I only wish Digi gave you a discount on one of the toolkits if you already own the other. The DV Toolkit and Music Toolkit have enough features in common, it feels like a waste to get both.
 
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