Proper way to wrap moleskin on lav mic

C

CSFilms

Member
I'm trying to put a lav under clothing, specifically putting it under a collar, and read that moleskin is really good to prevent the clothes-rubbing noises. What's the proper way to use the moleskin? Do you just wrap it around the lav mic and then tape it onto the collar?
 
I rarely use moleskin these days as well. The Rycote Stickies/Overcovers or the Garfield Hush Lavs are my typical accessory for that type of mount. Lots of other old and new products are available as well. I also recommend purchasing Thomas Popp's Udemy video series 'How To Put A Microphone On Talent', which covers many scenarios in depth.
 
I have to agree on Moleskin. The only thing I use it for now is wrapping mics that might be pressed against the skin. Moleskin creates quite a bit of rubbing noise when fabric brushes over top of it. Hush lavs create almost no noise when something rubs against it and act to distance the mic from any nearby fabric. Similarly the overcovers don't add any extra noise if fabric is rubbing against them, but they do take quite a bit of top end off of the mic. I don't suggest Rycote undercovers since the have the same noise characteristics as moleskin. Certain companies also make plastic mic holders that do make a little bit of noise but can be very useful in certain situations. DPA's concealers are pretty fantastic and I have decent luck with Rode's concealers.
 
Huh. I still use moleskin fairly regularly. I also use Hushlavs, various medical and toupee tapes, concealer-style mounts (esp the Sanken RM-11), and some Rycote stuff. I didn't find the original Stickies to be sticky enough, but their new Stickies Advanced are pretty good...same with the new Overcovers Advanced....Never warmed to Undercovers, though.

Anyway, one gag I like is a Hushlav-Moleskin sleeping bag (I think one guy who figured it out named it). Basically, take a piece of moleskin, place your lav on the fuzzy (non-sticky) side, then on top of that place half a Hushlav (cut open as if it were a hotdog bun), then over that place another piece of moleskin... stick all that on the neck-side of the collar. Depending on the mount, maybe a little joes sticky stuff or toupee tape to hold the outer fold of the collar in place.
https://www.trewaudio.com/product/psc-hush-lav/
http://www.joeprops.com

Or the whole-lot-of-tape technique shown in this short video (as well as the other basic techniques) is a reasonable place to start, imo (if the video doesn't start at the point I selected for sharing), jump to 6:10):

Comes down to the particular situation...and experience. Rick's suggestion to check out Thomas Popp's training materials is good. In addition to the Udemy videos, he created an iPad "book" that's well done.
https://itunes.apple.com/us/book/down-to-the-wire/id598071724?mt=11


Also, we might have some more suggestions if we know: What kinds of lavs do you have access to? What kind of shirt will talent be wearing? How much do you expect talent to be turning his/her head during takes? Interior only or will you need to worry about windy exteriors?
 
I'll be using a Rode Lavalier, and it'll be on a cotton dress shirt. I'm filming out on the pier and the talent will be moving here and there. I don't want to be carrying around a boom mic (in order to be discrete) otherwise I would just do that too.
 
I haven't used the Rode InvisiLav, I hear they're OK. But since I often use Sanken COS-11 mics, I've been using the Sanken RM11 (rubber-mount 11) which appears to at least partly inspired Rode:
http://www.sanken-mic.com/en/product/product_accessories.cfm/5.1107300

There's also the nice DPA Concealer for their mics...it kind of combines the features of a TRAM cage mount and RM11, though I don't know how it would work with non-DPA mics (probably not a super fit):
http://www.dpamicrophones.com/accessories/concealer-for-dscreet-4060-4061-4062-4063-4071

And I've used and keep meaning to order more of Abetek's button-down mic mount. It works with Countryman B6, Sanken COS-11, and DPA 4060 lavs. Maybe also with some other similarly-sized mounts (the company and their dealers should know).
http://www.abetek.co
mount-step-01.jpg

Edit: Oh, and LMC has some stuff I want to try. Such as:
http://lmcsound.com/products/4s-furry-mount-for-sanken-cos-11/
4SFM-feature.jpg

So ANYWAY... if you're using Rode lavs, give their InvisiLav a shot. But poke around for other alternatives that might work better for certain situations.

At least that's how it seems to me right now.

CS, good luck with your shoot. Sounds like a collar mount (or tie mount or eyeglass/hat mount) is a good way to go. And some sort of Overcover or other lav furry could be worth the hassles (attenuation, hiding) if it's windy.

Please let us know what you decide to do and how it comes out!
 
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I use the Rode with the Rode invisilav. It's basically the same as the Sanken RM11 in terms of design. It fits the Rode Lav perfectly, which is the best part. The width also conceals the bulge of the mic under the shirt. The one thing I have learned is to grab some good toupee tape and some sand paper. The plastic or silicone they use to make the Invisilav doesn't make much noise under clothing, but it also doesn't want to stick to anything. You need the sandpaper to rough up the surface and get rid of any coatings of manufacturing or adhesive that builds up over time.

And the DPA concealers will only fit DPA mics. They are molded hard plastic.
 
Jim Feeley said:
I haven't used the Rode InvisiLav, I hear they're OK. But since I often use Sanken COS-11 mics, I've been using the Sanken RM11 (rubber-mount 11) which appears to at least partly inspired Rode:
http://www.sanken-mic.com/en/product/product_accessories.cfm/5.1107300

There's also the nice DPA Concealer for their mics...it kind of combines the features of a TRAM cage mount and RM11, though I don't know how it would work with non-DPA mics (probably not a super fit):
http://www.dpamicrophones.com/accessories/concealer-for-dscreet-4060-4061-4062-4063-4071

And I've used and keep meaning to order more of Abetek's button-down mic mount. It works with Countryman B6, Sanken COS-11, and DPA 4060 lavs. Maybe also with some other similarly-sized mounts (the company and their dealers should know).
http://www.abetek.co
View attachment 124213

Edit: Oh, and LMC has some stuff I want to try. Such as:
http://lmcsound.com/products/4s-furry-mount-for-sanken-cos-11/
View attachment 124216

So ANYWAY... if you're using Rode lavs, give their InvisiLav a shot. But poke around for other alternatives that might work better for certain situations.

At least that's how it seems to me right now.

CS, good luck with your shoot. Sounds like a collar mount (or tie mount or eyeglass/hat mount) is a good way to go. And some sort of Overcover or other lav furry could be worth the hassles (attenuation, hiding) if it's windy.

Please let us know what you decide to do and how it comes out!
Click to expand...

Cool post Jim. I have never heard of or seen any of these. Choices are always good.
 
Thanks Dan... Ya, there's some cool new lav bits out there.

Solving lav mounting challenges is a lot of fun. Except when it's really infuriating.
 
Jim Feeley said:
Thanks Dan... Ya, there's some cool new lav bits out there.

Solving lav mounting challenges is a lot of fun. Except when it's really infuriating.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I didn't realize that Rycote had updated their overcovers. Just ordered up a bunch for use with my DPAs. I'm somehow excited.

I also ordered up some moleskin to test. I've never been able to get moleskin to help me. If clothing is rubbing over the moleskin, it makes more noise than if I had just used transpore. What am I missing into how to use it?
 
Just an update on what I ended up doing! I was filming the next day and already had moleskin purchased. Quite unfortunate that everyone seemed to say moleskin wasn't too great. I just slapped it on anyways to see what would happen and it ended up working really well! Although I'm not sure if it was anything special or just the dress shirt I attached it to working well with it! You can watch my final video (as well as a behind the scenes video where you can see it here): https://www.rode.com/myrodereel/watch/entry/4364

There was surprisingly almost no wind noise as well with this setup, and I thought the audio turned out great!
 
cpreston said:
I'm somehow excited.
Click to expand...

:-) I think most of us are familiar with giddiness that we can't explain to our significant others.


About moleskin: I've had much better success with Dr. Scholl's Moleskin than I have with generic brands. Perhaps I just tried the "wrong" generics, but IME Dr. Scholl's has better adhesive (a bit stickier, but not too sticky), and is both denser and thicker. I think that all that combines to provide a more secure placement and better isolation.

Or it could be that I've lucked out on guessing where Moleskin will work. Not a humblebrag... sometimes the lav-placement angels smile upon us, sometimes they don't.

Glad you got good tracks Christopher! Nice short film. Good luck in the Rode contest!
 
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