Prometheus trailer

[GrahamH]

This is a guy's opinion, .... he still comes up with overly-symbolic meanings for things.

You are of course entitled to think he's being overly symbolic, but in my opinion Cavalorn gets it about right. For example, just before the pilots crash into the alien ship, they did this momentarily-weird thing that I noticed at the time as being odd and unexplained.

However, if one accepts that there's a bunkerload of symbolism poured into the film (which Damon Lindelof essentially endorsed when he tweeted "I like the way you think" to Cavalorn) then their gesture indeed has a reason for being in the movie:

"... when Janek and his co-pilots sacrifice their lives to save the Earth, they apparently stand in the form of crucifixes, their arms held out. So you have three 'crucified' guys, one in the middle higher up, the other two on the sides, lower down. All a bit Calvary..."

 

[David Jimerson]

You are of course entitled to think he's being overly symbolic, but in my opinion Cavalorn gets it about right. For example, just before the pilots crash into the alien ship, they did this momentarily-weird thing that I noticed at the time as being odd and unexplained.

However, if one accepts that there's a bunkerload of symbolism poured into the film (which Damon Lindelof essentially endorsed when he tweeted "I like the way you think" to Cavalorn) then their gesture indeed has a reason for being in the movie:

"... when Janek and his co-pilots sacrifice their lives to save the Earth, they apparently stand in the form of crucifixes, their arms held out. So you have three 'crucified' guys, one in the middle higher up, the other two on the sides, lower down. All a bit Calvary..."

Well, one, you misquoted me; I said he still comes up with overly-symbolic meanings for things which weren't the in movie.

As for holding their arms up, it was a roller-coaster thing, or at least that's how I took it.

 

[David Jimerson]

I'm not saying it was supposed to be profound. I'm saying the unexplained mysteries in this film are not there so an audience can tease out some profound meaning, or even to solve an intriguing puzzle. It exists only to toy with the audience, lead them on and cover up messy storytelling. If they were only interested in making a monster movie they shouldn't have gone there. But they did. And they did it sloppily.

I disagree; as I said, I think they were setup for a sequel. Which I don't care for, at all.

The first responsibility of a storyteller is to tell the story . . . which is why I hated the deliberate ambiguity of the ending of Inception, for example.

 

[CallaghanFilms]

That's like comparing apples to dreams about apples.

 

[Gillvane]

Which is why I find that "Space Jesus" idea really dumb.

That's not just an idea someone came up with to interpret the film. That's a direct quote (Jesus not "space" Jesus) from Ridley Scott. Why did the aliens get upset with humans 2K years ago? Because they crucified Jesus, and Jesus was an Engineer. That was in the original screenplay, but they took it out.

How were they going to get around the fact that Jesus would have been 8 feet tall and so forth? Well, maybe the "engineers" didn't look like that in the first draft of the screenplay. Maybe they changed the look AFTER they took out Space Jesus.

 

[Gillvane]

I disagree; as I said, I think they were setup for a sequel. Which I don't care for, at all.

The first responsibility of a storyteller is to tell the story . . . which is why I hated the deliberate ambiguity of the ending of Inception, for example.

I agree with your statement in general, and about Inception. There is a place for the ambiguous ending, indeed even a genre where it's almost obligatory. That genre is the horror movie.

They killed the bad guy! Or did they? We expect the ambiguous switch ending in the horror genre because it's appropriate there. Leave the audience hanging with a sense of dread. It's a horror movie after all! IN other genres it's just unsatisfying.

 

[GrahamH]

Shaw didn't say "we've changed the atmosphere"; she said "they've changed the atmosphere," as part of a terraforming effort.

Can I get a 3rd opinion on this? The scene in question is when when they return to the cavern with the oozing containers and worms - Shaw looks up and sees the ceiling is morphing. I'm 90% sure she says "we" not "they", but I am happy to stand corrected.

Sorry, but I'm struggling to see Scott directing the actors to channel being on a roller-coaster ride for their final moment on-screen.

And +1 on the Jesus concept coming directly from Ridley Scott's own comments.

 

[MattinSTL]

Man that's a lot of thread to read.

Prometheus frustrated me... I'm glad I'm not the only one. The writing did seem vague for sake of being vague... however, maybe this will help you enjoy the movie a little more the next time around. I keep reading debates about the movie and nobody talks about the most ridiculously obvious clue; the title.

Prometheus... in Greek mythology, is a rebellious god who created mankind and acted against the wishes of the other engineers... er "gods". He was sentenced to eternal torment for his actions. I think the first engineer we see is "Prometheus"... and of course the ship;

"(In Western Tradition) Prometheus became a figure who represented human striving, particularly the quest for scientific knowledge, and the risk of overreaching or unintended consequences. In particular, he was regarded as embodying the lone genius whose efforts to improve human existence could also result in tragedy."

I'll probably see the film again... mainly for the visuals... hopefully the writing will make more sense the second time around. From the first viewing I still think people are putting way too much modern religious meaning in the subtext... as if every gesture or line is a wink and nod to those choosing to see it.

 

[GrahamH]

The religious aspect is "subtext" only because Scott decided that the overt references in the original script were too "on the nose" (his words) ... and so he cut them out.

 

[WildTrackDave]

Can I get a 3rd opinion on this? The scene in question is when when they return to the cavern with the oozing containers and worms - Shaw looks up and sees the ceiling is morphing. I'm 90% sure she says "we" not "they", but I am happy to stand corrected.

That's what I heard too. We, not they. To me that makes more sense. That room has been sealed off, air tight, for thousands of years. Since they opened the door, they changed the atmosphere in the room and the paintings on the ceiling started eroding, stuff started melting, etc...

 

[agcohn]

If Prometheus had been more of a horror film, I would have been fine with the vague aspects of its story, but there weren't enough scary moments for it to qualify as horror, in my opinion. As sci-fi / adventure, the story is a little flimsy.

It really should have been scarier, and then the unanswered parts of story would have been positive factors.

 

[David Jimerson]

If Dallas didn't bring the Alien aboard, then the movie ends. Done.

Sometimes characters have to make bad decisions in order to create horrific consequences.

If that's so, then anything goes.

But in reality, no, that's not a good enough reason.

 

[MattinSTL]

I saw this a second time today and I'm more inclined to agree with Batutta.

On my first viewing I watched it like a movie and it seemed profound, but tonight I really analyzed it and the script wasn't ready... there is a lot of slop in that movie... things that no character... NO person would do... not even in a bad choice kind of way, but just NO way. The two guys trapped in the ship overnight... they have a mysterious pile of alien bodies, to which they speculate in horror about what really happened... and 3 minutes later they're trying to literally play with an alien king cobra... hmm... nope... wasn't necessary for the story and just way way too stupid.

It reminded me of the nazis saying the ghost of the ark was beautiful... or Ted's encounter with the dino after crashing his jeep in Jurassic Park, the difference being that the nazis didn't just walk away from a mysterious pile of dead bodies at the arc's location... or Ted didn't just find a bunch of bodies, thinking "I wonder what killed them, hey let's play with this dinosaur"... he was worried about his situation right off.

The space snake even makes a clearly threatening move... like a cobra hood... and the guy still wants to touch it?

The most mentally stimulating ideas I've read are from analysis of the movie vs. the movie itself... and it's frustrating that it seems the most interesting things will all happen after this movie ends.

(Also... what's up with the Deep Space 9 soundtrack? The noble-grandeur crescendos don't build any tension...)

 

[Michael Anthony Horrigan]

I saw this a second time today and I'm more inclined to agree with Batutta.

On my first viewing I watched it like a movie and it seemed profound, but tonight I really analyzed it and the script wasn't ready... there is a lot of slop in that movie... things that no character... NO person would do... not even in a bad choice kind of way, but just NO way. The two guys trapped in the ship overnight... they have a mysterious pile of alien bodies, to which they speculate in horror about what really happened... and 3 minutes later they're trying to literally play with an alien king cobra... hmm... nope... wasn't necessary for the story and just way way too stupid.

This and many other issues like it just killed the movie for me. Ugh.... the more I think about it, the more it pisses me off.
Again, I can handle a few decisions that I don't agree with, especially when they are motivated, but some of them are just plain stupid. It's like the writers didn't even try.

 

[Gary Huff]

This could be like Kingdom of Heaven, where the Director's Cut on Blu-ray is a much better film than the theatrical release.

Hell, like Blade Runner.

 

[Rick Burnett]

I heard there are 27+ minutes going into the director's cut. That's quite a bit.

 

[Gary Huff]

There has to be something that at least explains why the Irish character with the mapping devices gets lost. A lot of what I didn't like was upon further reflection, but that just leaps out at you onscreen in 4k 3D!

 

[Isaac_Brody]

I just reread Roger Ebert's original Blade Runner review, and the funny thing is that there's this paragraph that you could take out and it applies perfectly to one of the many big issues of Prometheus.

He seems more concerned with creating his film worlds than populating them with plausible characters, and that's the trouble this time. "Blade Runner" is a stunningly interesting visual achievement, but a failure as a story.

http://rogerebert.suntimes.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/19820602/REVIEWS/40819003/1023

I love this world, absolutely love the alien world, but the more I think about it the more the foundation rots. These aren't full fledged characters, and even the interesting ideas that this is all built on are muddled and not fully fleshed out either. James Cameron jokes that he wants to do a sequel, and I honestly thing that would be the best thing to happen to this. As a storyteller Cameron has a much stronger grasp of character and a narrative through-line. He could actually make something good from this.

 

[Gary Huff]

James Cameron jokes that he wants to do a sequel, and I honestly thing that would be the best thing to happen to this. As a storyteller Cameron has a much stronger grasp of character and a narrative through-line. He could actually make something good from this.

That man who made Avatar? Yeesh.

Try as we might, it will be a while before we'll recapture the magic of those 80s summer films we all know and love. That ship has sailed, and even the captains are unable to revisit their glory days.

 

[j1clark@ucsd.edu]

I just reread Roger Ebert's original Blade Runner review, and the funny thing is that there's this paragraph that you could take out and it applies perfectly to one of the many big issues of Prometheus.



http://rogerebert.suntimes.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/19820602/REVIEWS/40819003/1023

I love this world, absolutely love the alien world, but the more I think about it the more the foundation rots. These aren't full fledged characters, and even the interesting ideas that this is all built on are muddled and not fully fleshed out either. James Cameron jokes that he wants to do a sequel, and I honestly thing that would be the best thing to happen to this. As a storyteller Cameron has a much stronger grasp of character and a narrative through-line. He could actually make something good from this.

I've been convinced that Ebert is full of it for quite some time...

Ebert ca. 1980 on "Alien"(1979)
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Ebert called it "basically just an intergalactic haunted house thriller set inside a spaceship" and one of several science fiction pictures that were "real disappointments" compared to Star Wars, Close Encounters of the Third Kind, and 2001: A Space Odyssey,
-----

By 2003 he's almost gushing...
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Roger Ebert included it in his "Great Movies" column in 2003, ranking it among "the most influential of modern action pictures" and praising its pacing, atmosphere, and settings:

One of the great strengths of Alien is its pacing. It takes its time. It waits. It allows silences (the majestic opening shots are underscored by Jerry Goldsmith with scarcely audible, far-off metallic chatterings). It suggests the enormity of the crew's discovery by building up to it with small steps: The interception of a signal (is it a warning or an SOS?). The descent to the extraterrestrial surface. The bitching by Brett and Parker, who are concerned only about collecting their shares. The masterstroke of the surface murk through which the crew members move, their helmet lights hardly penetrating the soup. The shadowy outline of the alien ship. The sight of the alien pilot, frozen in his command chair. The enormity of the discovery inside the ship ("It's full of ... leathery eggs ...").
----

I have liked everything that Scott has done, that I have seen...

And what's more... there was no Jar Jar Binks in "Prometheus"(2012)... in fact, I don't know how one could get a 'marketing tie-in', except for perhaps in the latex/leather/bdsm fetish or psychsexualhorror aficionado crowd...